Testing a rectifier.

Ok thats a lot of good ?s. I'll have to check all that out when I can find a minute or two. Thanks for the speedy reply, I will return soon as a can, stan
 
Mr Retiredgentalman, I finally got to do the suggestions you gave a while back. On the 78 model with overcharging problem. I did have a voltage drop on the switched brown. Came with a rat nest of wire nuts and hanging inline fuses. I got it all buttoned down on a fuse block and fixed the the .6 voltage drop. The blue wire to my all in one rect reg is hooked to the brown switched wire. The other wire "orange" you say feed voltage to the left outer brush. I don't have any voltage now to the brushes. Ground or unground the brushes? So close I know but wish I could look at a wiring schematic for the all in one rect reg. You said there was something from xsLeo that has the diagram for it, so I guess that what I am looking for now. Almost certain with mess I just rewired that this reg rect got shorted out. Thanks so much for the help, stan
 
Mr Retiredgentalman, I finally got to do the suggestions you gave a while back. On the 78 model with overcharging problem. I did have a voltage drop on the switched brown. Came with a rat nest of wire nuts and hanging inline fuses. I got it all buttoned down on a fuse block and fixed the the .6 voltage drop. The blue wire to my all in one rect reg is hooked to the brown switched wire. The other wire "orange" you say feed voltage to the left outer brush. I don't have any voltage now to the brushes. Ground or unground the brushes? So close I know but wish I could look at a wiring schematic for the all in one rect reg. You said there was something from xsLeo that has the diagram for it, so I guess that what I am looking for now. Almost certain with mess I just rewired that this reg rect got shorted out. Thanks so much for the help, stan

I've given you my suggestions in my last post. The information, on wiring colours, I gave you is second hand, so it may or may not be accurate. Where did you get the rec/reg unit come from? You should contact the supplier and demand a connection wiring diagram. Without a diagram you're just shooting in the dark.

When you turn the key on you must have voltage at the brushes. If you have the 70 to 79 rec/reg, then the inner brush is grounded and the outer brush is insulated with about 12 + volts.

In my opinion, an aftermarket combined rec/reg is not a good way to go. Its doubly bad if you have no manufacturers connection diagram. They are expensive and with a failure in one half of it, you have to replace the whole unit. Its much better to have a separate rectifier and a separate regulator.

The signature at the bottom of all my posts states what I have on my 78 SE, for a rectifier and a regulator. Why do a use those items.................because they are inexpensive and they work 100% every day.
 
Thanks The rect reg on mine came on the bike. Prev owner " I know him" said he put it on there new. The bummer is I "don't have " the diagram. That would really be nice. I know its from mikes. So I just ask for a diagram from them. Waiting for the reply. Its like every diagram I look at has some variations in it. If I get this darn thing charging correctly you'll prob be able to hear me wherever you are. lol Kind of a inherited situation I can't wait to get remedied. I thank for the detailed email you gave me before and did everything like you said step by step, and have zero volts at the brushes. Appreciate the help stan
 
stanleyh, a wiring diagram from Mike's for his reg/rec for the 70-79 bikes. Very cool, can you post it to the "Some wiring diagrams" thread in the XS650 TECH section. Or at least post it here.
I think it could be a valuble document.
Leo
 
Mr xs Leo I finally after a bit of searching found a diagram you'd posted for a all in one rect reg for my 78 model. So many options. I am quit sure my new but " came with the bike" reg rect is bad. I have tried every way , its either high voltage or zero boost when running the motor. Mr. Retiredgentleman has helped me a LOT and I have tried his info and after finding the later all in one rect reg diagram it was pretty clear. I am still grey about the what to ground and not to ground with newer all in one rect reg. I am 95% sure that mine is bad. I was not sure what you meant by " some wiring diagrams"? I do not what I'd do without this site for info. wow
 
Yes, as Leo said, we would all like to see the diagram from Mikesxs for the 70 to 79 rec/reg.

Well, if you have connected as per Mikesxs diagram, and do not get correct voltages, then you must have defective components.

If your stator and rotor are good, you could go with a NOS VR-115 regulator and make up your own rectifier.
 
Mr Gentleman Where is info on the nos vr 115 reg? Also what would be involved with rectifier. Thanks for the help stan

Here is the link on building a rectifier:
http://xs650temp.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=Charging&action=display&thread=3473

It needs to have a heat sink. A flat piece of aluminum has been used by some. I used an old finned heat sink that I had laying around.

The Standard VR-115 regulator is available on E-bay for $26.00 dollars or less. Amazon sells it for $22.39. Search around on the web and you may find it for even less. I bought my VR-115 from E-bay motors (AE Auto) in 2008 for $9.99 plus $8.00 shipping.

The VR-115 regulator is very easy to connect to the bike. The orange and yellow wires from the VR-115 connect to the brown wire that is on the load side of the ignition switch. The VR-115 green wire connects to the left (outer) brush on the alternator. The VR-115 black wire connects to the common black wire that runs through the bikes wiring harness, or to a good bare metal ground (do not use the battery box).

These components have given my bike 14.2 volts for the last 5 years.
 

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"some wiring diagrams" In the XS650TECH section, scroll down to the electrical section, there is a link to 'Some Wiring diagrams". At the end of that tread you can post the diagram from Mike's.
Or just post it on this thread.
On grounding most of the all in one reg/recs get grounded through a wire, the later stock units a black wire, after market units may use some other color. The VR-115 uses a black wire. The R-292 that I use you need to ground the case of the unit.
Just rtemember that on a stock bike the battery box is rubber mounted and is no grounded.
Leo
 
Well you will all prob laugh at me. I broke down and bought the all in one rect reg from mikesxs. If this one ever quits on me I going to get the vr 115 system. Everything on my 78/79 model is original. Guess I just wanted to keep it all original. I saw those wiring diagrams. Thats pretty clear on what to do. Sorry I have wasted so much of you alls time on my situation. You all are so helpful, Thanks again and have a great Thanksgiving...stan
 
Well you will all prob laugh at me. I broke down and bought the all in one rect reg from mikesxs. If this one ever quits on me I going to get the vr 115 system. Everything on my 78/79 model is original. Guess I just wanted to keep it all original. I saw those wiring diagrams. Thats pretty clear on what to do. Sorry I have wasted so much of you alls time on my situation. You all are so helpful, Thanks again and have a great Thanksgiving...stan

Just to be accurate; a combined solid state rec/reg is not "original" for78 or 79 years. Up to 1979, individual rectifiers and regulators were used. The regulator was a mechanical relay type.

Regardless, hope you get the electrics working on your bike.

By the way, us curious types, would like to see a picture of the Mikesxs diagram for the 70 to 79 rec/reg.
 
I just got a reply from mikesxs and they said they are going to ask their "technicians" if they have that actual "one line" diagram. I guess we will see if they can find that. If they send it I will try to post it. Thanks again, Happy Thanksgiving stan
 
Here is the instruction sheet I received from Mikes many years ago.
 

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Brian 902 I got that from mikes also. As an electrician I would still like to see a schematic for that part. Still some variables with the straight power to one brush and the ungrounding of the stator brushes, ect. Thanks you for the info stan
 
On the 70-79 bikes the way the alternator works is when you turn the key on power flows from the key on a brown wire that powers most of the bike. The reg reads the voltage on this brown wire. If the voltage is below the preset 14.5 volts it sends full battery voltage to the positive brush on the green wire. Through the rotor, where it grounds to the stator body, engine, frame, battery. It also grounds back into the wiring with a black wire.
Once the engine starts and the battery voltage rises to the 14.5 volt preset the reg turns the power off. It then cycles on and off to maintain 14.5 volts.
The 80 up bikes used a soild state reg/rec and when the key is on power flows out the brown wire to both the reg and positive brush. The brown to the brush supplies full battery voltage to the rotor. Now when the reg reads a low voltage it turns on a transister that grounds the green wire from the other brush. As the battery charges the reg reads the voltage and "turns off" when the voltage reaches the preset. It cycles on and off to maintain 14.5 volts. Being a solid state instead of mechanical it cycles on/off much faster and does a better job of voltage control. No ground at the brushes.
Aftermarket reg/regs can be set up to work as the 70-79 and as the 80 up.
Mike's sells both. If you use one set up as the 70-79 on a 70-79 then no wiring mods need be done. If you use one for an 80 up on a 80 up no mods. If you use an 80 up on a 70-79 then you need to do some mods .
Leo
 
Brian 902 I got that from mikes also. As an electrician I would still like to see a schematic for that part. Still some variables with the straight power to one brush and the ungrounding of the stator brushes, ect. Thanks you for the info stan

That instruction sheet confirms the wiring connections that I gave you earlier.

Stan; there are no varibles with straight power to one brush and ungrounding of brushes.
The 70 to 79 years do NOT use battery+ power to one brush, that is done on the 80 to 83 years. No modifications (ungrounding) required.
 
Hello Mr. Retiredgentleman, xsLeo, and Brian 902. I have the 78 xs. You all have helped me with my charging problem in the past. I appreciate it! I reluctantly bough the all in one solid state reg rect mikes xs sell for $99. I received the "mikes xs info" like Brian 902 posted. Its not a diagram like I requested from them, but thats all they said they had to give me so that was disappointing. I looked at the "solid state all in one" diagram in in xstech "some wiring diagrams". I thought I hooked the new one up like that diagram says to. The 3 whites are easy- from the stator to the regrct. I took switched pos. 12 volts to the right brush and its isolated from the stator with a nylon screw. The green off the outer brush goes to the green on the recreg. The red went to the battery positive 12v. The green and the red wire are same gauge AWG. Thats what is in the 6 slot connector. 5 wires = 3white, red and a green. The separate " 2 wires " orange and a blue. They are the same AWG size. The orange I grounded. The blue I hooked to the hot switched from the key brown wire which also has almost no voltage drop. Did I screw up? I'd say I did.The new "lovely all in one" regrect with no diagram gave out a nice puff of smoke when I turned the key on. LOL Prob should have put it on a separate 2 amp fuse. If the way I hooked it up is blatantly wrong I would prob go try that for a second, and if that don't do it I going to do like I should have done, just like Mr. Retiredgenleman told me to do " in the first place". Please pardon my stubborn "trying to keep it close to original self." Thank you all so much, stuck on a part stan
 
Hello Mr. Retiredgentleman, xsLeo, and Brian 902. I have the 78 xs. You all have helped me with my charging problem in the past. I appreciate it! I reluctantly bough the all in one solid state reg rect mikes xs sell for $99. I received the "mikes xs info" like Brian 902 posted. Its not a diagram like I requested from them, but thats all they said they had to give me so that was disappointing. I looked at the "solid state all in one" diagram in in xstech "some wiring diagrams". I thought I hooked the new one up like that diagram says to. The 3 whites are easy- from the stator to the regrct. I took switched pos. 12 volts to the right brush and its isolated from the stator with a nylon screw. The green off the outer brush goes to the green on the recreg. The red went to the battery positive 12v. The green and the red wire are same gauge AWG. Thats what is in the 6 slot connector. 5 wires = 3white, red and a green. The separate " 2 wires " orange and a blue. They are the same AWG size. The orange I grounded. The blue I hooked to the hot switched from the key brown wire which also has almost no voltage drop. Did I screw up? I'd say I did.The new "lovely all in one" regrect with no diagram gave out a nice puff of smoke when I turned the key on. LOL Prob should have put it on a separate 2 amp fuse. If the way I hooked it up is blatantly wrong I would prob go try that for a second, and if that don't do it I going to do like I should have done, just like Mr. Retiredgenleman told me to do " in the first place". Please pardon my stubborn "trying to keep it close to original self." Thank you all so much, stuck on a part stan

Stan, you must stop looking at the "solid state all in one" diagram in the Wiring Diagrams of the Tech section. That diagram is only for the 80 to 83 years.....................it cannot be used for 70 to 79 years. You do not take positive 12 volts to the right brush. You do not use a nylon screw.

The orange that you grounded is why you got smoke. The orange from the rec/reg is the variable positive + voltage supply to the left outer brush.

The directions that Brian902 posted are correct. If you had followed his directions, you would have been connected correctly. The Mikesxs instruction sheet says to connect the green from the rec/reg to the black of the alternator, but since you have a "new" stator, the green should connect to the red wire (right inner brush, which is grounded) on the new stator.

I suspect the regulator you have is now finished, because you grounded the regulator's positive + voltage output that normally supplies the rotor current.
 
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