Newbie with unknown Halco motor/tracker help needed

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Gman

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Hey,
New to the forum all the way from the UK. Just bought an unknown project with no guarantees and I believe a bit of a basket case i.e. bad things to come but to be expected. It's suppose to be a street flat tracker with an Halco 840cc engine. The bike has a Halco clutch system and an oil cooler attached to the oil filter. How can I tell what the internals are without splitting it. this is going to be a long project to turn into a modern cafe racer, lace wheels modern brakes alloy swingarm and inverted forks(maybe). something between http://www.xs650chopper.com/2010/03/xs650-cafe-the-beast-mk2-from-the-limey/ http://www.xs650chopper.com/2010/03/xs650-cafe-the-beast-mk2-from-the-limey/.

First step is the engine: no starter just basic Boyer non battery system, check what it is and maybe rephase it, any suggestions

then front end r1?

Rear motolanna or single suspension.


Any help one the engine identity and what needs doing to it if it is a 840?


Thanks



Read more: http://xs650forum.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=projects&action=display&thread=2338#ixzz1AqXZrrzk
 
If you have any doubts, I'd tear it down and check it over. You'd hate to ruin some cool hi-po parts due to a blocked oiling port, or something similar...

Tearing one of these engines down is very simple. If it hasn't run in a while, you'll want to check all the timing chain guides, chain, filters, etc...


As for the re-phasing if that thing, I have several customers in the Au and the UK that have been riding the 840's for a while, and can't enjoy all the power due to vibes and rider fatigue. They report an amazing difference with the rephase.
 
Welcome Gman. Are you new to XS's or is this just a new project to you? Any pics?

I'd agree with Punkskalar, sounds like you are going to get headfirst into the bike so tearing the motor down for a check over would seem to be a wise thing to do.

Where abouts are you based? If i'm close I may be able to help if you are a little unsure where to start (you probably know more than I do tho! :laugh:)
 
Hiya,
Thanks for the quick reply, I managed to get the engine out of the frame in 40 minutes, love old tech, especially when the engine is so light.. The previous owner/s have looked after the bike as it has a lot of one off stainless parts, e.g. mounts, bolts etc. I'll split the engine over the weekend if not sooner. Anything I need to look for which will give me clues of what I have. So far I can see that it has dual coils crank covers modified for oil cooler.
 
Punkskalar said:
If you have any doubts, I'd tear it down and check it over. You'd hate to ruin some cool hi-po parts due to a blocked oiling port, or something similar...

Tearing one of these engines down is very simple. If it hasn't run in a while, you'll want to check all the timing chain guides, chain, filters, etc...


As for the re-phasing if that thing, I have several customers in the Au and the UK that have been riding the 840's for a while, and can't enjoy all the power due to vibes and rider fatigue. They report an amazing difference with the rephase.
Click to expand...

One of the biggest faults with those big bore kits is the heavy slugs they're using on the short arm,extend the arms mated with lightweight slugs and you'll reduce the vibes on the 360 firing order. The pistons I'm using for my L/R 80mm bore are between 100 to 125 grams less than a stock XS650,that's with pins and rings:yikes:
 
Good news,
It is a 840 Halco ( I am actually surprised), took the head of ( I going to do a full rebuild) and measured the diameter to 85mm and it had a Halco gasket.

The head valves were slightly rusty.

I am going to go the whole way and split the case and get everything properly clean and painted.

Still not sure if it is worth doing a 90 rephase as I have been told that upgrading the gearing can make massive difference and loads cheaper
 
Good news then, and its good you got it torn down.

Gearing and Re-Phasing are two way seperate things. Higher gears can keep down the highway buzz, but nothing is gonna compare to getting the internals running smoother... Got any pics of the valves? Were the pitted, how are the seats?
 
I need to take the valve out will do this weekend (including full strip down of the rest of the engine). I am still toying with a rephase but really don't want to spend too much. I am still trying to learn the easiest method i.e. without the need of an additional crank.
 
Gman said:
I need to take the valve out will do this weekend (including full strip down of the rest of the engine). I am still toying with a rephase but really don't want to spend too much. I am still trying to learn the easiest method i.e. without the need of an additional crank.
Click to expand...

You can go 277 with all the parts you have there :thumbsup: No need for another crank, and alot less expense than going 270. PM me for more information if needed, I don't want to muddy up your thread. We all like inexpensive mods, keep us posted on what else you find inside that engine.
 
Yep i think I am going to do the 277 change. I found a engineering company in nottingham who has experience doing it and charge £80 for the help, they can also cut and reweld the cam to suite. I think the first job is to strip and bag the parts then send the engine to get cleaned, bead blasted and painted then reassemble everything. May be worth doing the 5th gear overdrive conversion.

Any thought?
 
By the way the bike came with AMAL carbs, anyone got any ideas on their performance?

this was my previous project
CIMG3496.jpg
 
SO far I have managed to unbolt every nut and bolt on the outside of the case but I am strougling to split the case and I don't want to damage it, am I missing something here?
 
Gman said:
SO far I have managed to unbolt every nut and bolt on the outside of the case but I am strougling to split the case and I don't want to damage it, am I missing something here?
Click to expand...

There is a hidden nut behind the clutch if I remember right. Look in the clutch side of the cases, and there should be a nut that holds the cases together.
 
Yeah thanks ( I eventually did a search and found a thread , sorry the punt). Bastard bolt/phillips heads were all chewed up. Engine internals looking good, suzuki pistons and cylinder bore hardly scored. Clutch is also an 8 version.
 
When you get the cylinder block removed,take some pictures where the cam chain passes through the case halves and whats the head gasket made of?
 
Here are some more pics, There is some silicone in the usual place (was told it is a Halco mod due t0 the area being prone to be too cool).
DSC_1002.jpg
DSC_1001.jpg
DSC_0998.jpg
DSC_0992.jpg
DSC_0988.jpg
DSC_0983.jpg
DSC_0967.jpg
DSC_0966.jpg
DSC_0964.jpg
DSC_0959.jpg


The carbs I have are AMAL 34mm anyone know if they are any good? Internals llok good except some wear on the clutch basket.

Will get it all cleaned up and rephased with the cams.
 
More questions:

Where can I get a 270/90 crank spline ( I think someone in Oz does one), not sure which way to go with the re-phase, 270 or 277?
Where can I get a "hot/race" cam for the above.
How do you remove the pins in the dog gear selector. I managed to removes the safety clips but the pins wont come out easily.

Has anyone seen a long stroke i.e. 533 or 577 crankrod engine 840cc that has been re-phased?

Does the geometry change due to being a uk spec 5** crank not the US 4** therefore making the 277 re-phase a bad idea?
 

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