XS650 clutch

[turn left]

Plates...

.........................Steel............Friction
Pre Aug 73...........1.6mm........6 @ 3.5 mm
Aug 73 – Aug 78...1.4 mm.......7 @ 3.0 mm
Post Aug 78.........1.4 mm.......6 @ 3.0 mm

I know this is an old thread but it seems to be the most comprehensive regarding clutches. I have a 79 with 6 friction plates as described above. Why does MikesXS and 650central recommend "1980-84 models use 6pc, 1974-79 models use 7pc"? I know I am beating a dead horse here but I read & read and yet still confused on what to order.

 

[turn left]

Found another clutch thread specifically about 79's.
http://www.xs650.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13665

They do indeed run 6 friction plates @ 3.0mm and 5 pressure plates @ 1.4mm.
I guess my best bet is just to call either Mikes or 650central to see if their plates are 3.0mm and 1.4mm and disregard their recommended quantities. It was just odd that both companies listed 7 friction plates with each brand they sell.

 

[5twins]

I don't think it's ever been made entirely clear just when Yamaha implemented the change from the 7 to 6 plate clutch. My '78 Standard had a 7 plater, the '79 in the link above along with yours has a 6 plater. It's also mentioned that only the Special models got the 6 plater. Who knows. Bottom line I guess is if you have a '78 or '79, inspect your clutch and see.

All the plates (steel and friction) are the same between the two except that bottom spring loaded steel plate used in the 6 plater. It's slightly thicker than the other steels @ 1.6mm.

 

[XSLeo]

I replaced my clutch plates with a set of Forodo plates. They came as a 7 piece set that could be used with all years. Just use the same number as your old set used.
As far as ordering the plates, just count how many are in yourclutch and buy that many.
Leo

 

[turn left]

Leo, you recommend the forodo plates or anything else I should look around for? about to make my order

 

[XSLeo]

A new set of clutch springs, Mike's are cheap, get them from 650central.
I got a NOS set of Kibblewhite 70 lb springs off ebay.
With these springs, the new plates, new actuator worm in the side cover, the almost new Motion pro cable, everthing well lubed I can pull the clutch with two fingers. No slipping and neutral is easy to find.
The steel plates I used a coarse sandpaper, around 100 grit, to clean off the discoloration of the steel plates. This roughed them up some, better grip. It also removed the burrs from the stamping process when made.
Leo

 

[ryan_mac18]

In need of a quick tip. I have a hughs handbuilt hydraulic clutch. Recently bought the bike and my clutch fluid just started spewing. Need to know what the correct fluid would be. If there is a certain weight needed

 

[peanut]

I'm still a little confused about how many washers there should be and where they all go .?

Hieden tuning show the thrust washer ,needle race and another washer in this order which is fine.

Why have I got an extra thrust washer in my box of bits ?
see picture.
Also can someone please explain what is meant by

'Ensure the spacer is ok, you have the two washers, there are no rubbing marks '??

which spacer ? which washers? and where on the picture do I need to check for rubbing marks ?

 

[5twins]

The second thicker and wider washer you've found may be for behind the clutch. There should be another thin washer back there with it. Here's a labeled drawing I made up .....

For rub marks, you would check the back of the main hub, between the inner and outer hub, and the top of the pressure plate & inside surface of the cover. Here's what I found inside my cover upon disassembly. Apparently, someone in the past assembled things wrong or had too many washers installed .....

And yet one more diagram, a color coded one from that German manual, which I labeled in English .....

 

[peanut]

ahhh that is bloody excellent 5twins thank you

Thats going to be useful for anyone that looks here during an engine rebuild.

Now I have got to find the missing thin washer that goes against the bearing ....ho hum...pigs bum....

Looks like my engine may have been missing the small thin washer !. can anyone tell me what the OD and ID measures please ?
It looks like it should be OD 35mm ?ID 25mm thickness 1mm ??

 

[Jim Kelley]

I replaced the six phillips headed machine screws on the clutch pack with replacement items from Mike's XS. The replacement items where very slightly longer and when everything was reassembled the clutch dragged a bit and gear selection was problematic. Turns out the tip of the machine screws was scorring the back of the clutch basket. Lots of fun disassembling the clutch again and the flushing the engine to get the aluminum shavings out of the inside. Check the length of the new screws if you do this and grind off the excess if the are longer.

 

[peanut]

crikey that makes me mad !...is there no end to the crap coming out of the far east?
What is wrong with having quality control for crissakes.?
How much unecessary work has that caused.

I think any shop selling stuff from a dubious source should make sure of the quality themselves before selling it. There must be a duty of care /responsibility somewhere along the line surely it shouldn't rest with the customer .

Sorry Jim just venting off .

Welcome to the forum ,Thank you for the warning ,much appreciated.
looking forward to hearing more from you and maybe seeing some pics of your bike ?
John

 

[JohnnyDsCustoms]

I bought a clutch that I was told was either a '79 or '80 year clutch. I know they changed between the '79 and '80 model years. How do I tell which year I have. it did not come with clutch plates or springs. So I would like to know how I can tell the difference so I can get the proper plates and springs. Thanks.
JohnnyD

 

[XSLeo]

JohnnyDs Customs,
From 70-73 they used a rubber ring between the plates and the fiber plates were thicker. There were 6 3.5 mm fiber plates. The rubber rings acted as shock absorbers when the clutch engaged.
In 74 they changed to a thinner 3 mm fiber plate and removed the rubber rings. They used 7 plates.
The change you refer to happened in 78, the standards got the older clutch, the Specials got the new clutch. The new clutch has a groove in the bottom of the basket. This grove held a flat plate, then a curved plate, This curved plate was a spring. Then a regular steel plate. These were held in place by a wire clips in a groove cut in the teeth that engage the plates.
In 79 the standards got the old clutch, the Specials got the new clutch. In 80 all bikes got the new clutch.
All years used the same springs.
The clutch you got from a 79-80 is probably the new clutch. I wish I had a pics showing the differences. If you look through the parts fiches at a parts seller like boats.net you can see the different parts used in the different years clutches.
I have used both styles of the clutches. The later clutch engages just a bit smoother when taking off from a stop. The earlier version you can feel the engagement more on take off, it is a bit rougher. Once you are moving you won't feel any difference.
Yamaha used the exact same fiber plates up through I think 2007 on bikes with engines up to 1700 cc's. So getting the fiber plates at the dealer is still possible. When I replaced my fibers I got a set of Forodo plates. It came as a 7 plate set so it can work with all years.
The steels may still be available from the dealer, I can't say for sure. I might try to get a complete clutch off Ebay. This will have all the plates you need. The last one I bought I paid like $10 with a few bucks for shipping.
Leo

 

[hks650]

i'm having trouble taking off the clutch bolts. i even bought one of those t bar screwdriver. when i try to turn it, the clutch either moves and it just budge at all. any tips?

 

[650Skull]

ahhh that is bloody excellent 5twins thank you

Thats going to be useful for anyone that looks here during an engine rebuild.

Now I have got to find the missing thin washer that goes against the bearing ....ho hum...pigs bum....

Looks like my engine may have been missing the small thin washer !. can anyone tell me what the OD and ID measures please ?
It looks like it should be OD 35mm ?ID 25mm thickness 1mm ??

Top of post #7 page one has the washer sizes and the info 5 twins posted

 

[retiredgentleman]

i'm having trouble taking off the clutch bolts. i even bought one of those t bar screwdriver. when i try to turn it, the clutch either moves and it just budge at all. any tips?

Use a manual impact tool..............hit it with a hammer. There is a clutch holding tool available.................look at www.mikesxs.com

 

[hks650]

thanks, i will look intot that. hopefully it works, cause its quite stuck in there.

 

[XSLeo]

The hand impact tool is almost a necessity when working on these bikes. The force of the hammer blow fully seats the bit in the screw then it turns the screw a bit. Usually just a few whacks with the hammer are needed.
The hand impact tool can also be used with sockets and such too. Depending on the tool it may have a 3/8 or 1/2 drive . the bits fit a socket looking thing that fits on the square drive. Just pull the bit holder off and use sockets that fit the drive.
I have this one from Harbor Freight. Item #37530, on sale now for $7.29.
Leo

 

[hks650]

haha i picked the exact one from the HF near my house. never knew these exist.