Beautiful Robin - really great job.
Congrats my friend!
Pete
Congrats my friend!
Pete
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On the road again at 40.............the bike that is
Thanks Pete!
And thanks for all your underground parts and goodies supply support!
And thanks for all your underground parts and goodies supply support!
This afternoon I finished my 6th head bolt retorque. Studs were real close to holding, took about 10° of torque wrench movement and the bolts are still holding.
Also installed new spark plugs.
Not much on the drain plugs....
This was all the rubber bits.....
This may be old and just been flushed out?
Looks like some more sludge flushed out in the side filter.
But this was interesting. Awhile back 2M said:
The oil looks like a fine metallic paint. are these the fines you were referring to 2M?
Had a little time for a test ride. Mighta pushed her a little more today. Boy she's running great, I can't get over it.
Will plan on another oil change and retorque in another 500 miles.
Also installed new spark plugs.
Not much on the drain plugs....
This was all the rubber bits.....
This may be old and just been flushed out?
Looks like some more sludge flushed out in the side filter.
But this was interesting. Awhile back 2M said:
The oil looks like a fine metallic paint. are these the fines you were referring to 2M?
Had a little time for a test ride. Mighta pushed her a little more today. Boy she's running great, I can't get over it.
Will plan on another oil change and retorque in another 500 miles.
Great to hear that you are reaping well-deserved, hard-earned rewards for all your sweat and focused work, Robin !
Thanks Dude. Still got a lot to learn, so thankful and appreciative for all the help and support I've received here.
This has really been a labour of love and I'm happy I've got other adventures waiting. Don't know what I'd do without a project.
So happy to have one dependable rider so I can enjoy the others without any pressure.
This has really been a labour of love and I'm happy I've got other adventures waiting. Don't know what I'd do without a project.
So happy to have one dependable rider so I can enjoy the others without any pressure.
I would be willing to bet that the small pieces you’re seeing were remnants from before. You’ve already replaced two of the main rubber shedding components, the cam chain guide and the starter gear. I think you’re doing really well and I believe your bike will be a good running reliable bike for years to come.
And I know what you mean about having a project. I love always having something to do out in the shop!
And I know what you mean about having a project. I love always having something to do out in the shop!
We'll that's what I'm thinking and hoping for as well Bob.
Thank goodness for projects to keep us out of the pool halls eh?
No. The fines I was referring to earlier are from iron/iron wear-in, like from rings/cylinder, cam/follower, trans gears, bearings. That stuff is abrasive, and attracted to magnets.
Your metallic oil slurry is likely aluminum flakes. You can drag a magnet thru it to be sure.
There's very few places in the XS650 engine that have aluminum in direct contact with moving parts, so seeing aluminum flakes in the oil is disturbing. Most suspicions are with the camchain front slipper, but I'm thinking about your clutch. We've already discussed the pressure plate, but I recall that you installed different clutch spring screws. There's been several postings in here about long screws protruding thru the back and scraping on the clutch basket. Have a look at 5Twins' post on those screws:
http://www.xs650.com/threads/clutch-spring-cap-screw-modification.3408/page-3#post-351484
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Well now, that's not the news I wanted is it, but that's why I posted this picture as I've never seen my oil look like this before.
Thanks 2M.
Tried the magnet test. Those flakes are so fine, hard to really determine anything. I think you're right that it is aluminum filings though 2M, that is what it looks like.
I had dumped this oil into an old used container so it's likely a little dirtier but you can see those flakes if I swirl the oil somewhat.
These are the Mikes/XSDirect screws and spacers that I used. They look like the 40mm long Mikes XS screws in 5twins pic.
Not sure how long they are though, I never measured them.
They say they fit 70-84's but that's no guarantee that longer screws weren't shipped and I just didn't know enough to check the length.
Both front guide and rear cam chain tensioner are new. Front guide is OEM, rear is Mikes/XSD, so you wouldn't think there would be a problem with them.
I was pretty careful to make sure the front guide was centered when I installed it.
So, fine aluminum filings are coming from somewhere. Where do we start?
Tip her over and verify clutch spring screw length? And then hope that's what it is.
That would be an easy solution and would sure beat the alternative of having to pull the engine and go looking in there.
Looks like I jinxed myself this time thinking I was done.
Thanks 2M.
Tried the magnet test. Those flakes are so fine, hard to really determine anything. I think you're right that it is aluminum filings though 2M, that is what it looks like.
I had dumped this oil into an old used container so it's likely a little dirtier but you can see those flakes if I swirl the oil somewhat.
These are the Mikes/XSDirect screws and spacers that I used. They look like the 40mm long Mikes XS screws in 5twins pic.
Not sure how long they are though, I never measured them.
They say they fit 70-84's but that's no guarantee that longer screws weren't shipped and I just didn't know enough to check the length.
Both front guide and rear cam chain tensioner are new. Front guide is OEM, rear is Mikes/XSD, so you wouldn't think there would be a problem with them.
I was pretty careful to make sure the front guide was centered when I installed it.
So, fine aluminum filings are coming from somewhere. Where do we start?
Tip her over and verify clutch spring screw length? And then hope that's what it is.
That would be an easy solution and would sure beat the alternative of having to pull the engine and go looking in there.
Looks like I jinxed myself this time thinking I was done.
That's where I'd start.
Thanks Jim. Would some of this be normal in any oil change and especially an oil change after a rebuild?
Or, does this look like too much fine filings?
Without getting into that work I'm wondering if I should run it for 100 miles or so and then drain the new oil to see if there's more filings. Maybe something has worked itself out?
Or do you think I should just get to it and check out the clutch spring screw length?
Or, does this look like too much fine filings?
Without getting into that work I'm wondering if I should run it for 100 miles or so and then drain the new oil to see if there's more filings. Maybe something has worked itself out?
Or do you think I should just get to it and check out the clutch spring screw length?
I'd have a look Robin.
OK, thanks Jim.
Rob, since you're good at polishing, how 'bout polishing out the existing scrape marks on the pressure plate and inside the rightside clutch cover, and any other scrape marks you've noticed. This will give you a clean starting point for detecting future scraping, if any...
Ok, I can do that 2M. Thanks.
Indeed!
Man she's getting too comfortable in this position.
Let me cut to the chase. No joy on the clutch screws being too long. The Mikes / XS650 Direct screws are 40mm long.
So the inner hub is rub mark free. Unfortunately this isn't the source of my 'cheap 70's metal-flake paint job' to use 5twins words.
I compared all areas that had scrape marks to pictures taken in June when I was last in there and there are no changes.
June pic:
July pic:
June pic:
July pic:
Could post more pics but kinda redundant.
2M as excited as I was about polishing something I decided against polishing these spots for three reasons.
1) I would have to start with an abrasive such as a fine grit paper or roloc discs and was afraid that would remove too much material that could compromise the ability to notice subtle changes in the future.
2) I have a pretty extensive photographic record of everything that can be referenced.
3) If word got out that I was actually polishing the 'INSIDE' of my cases I may get a visit by these guys.
So, no luck with this boys. I know the next logical sources are the cam chain guide/tensioner but there's only 550 miles on these brand new ones, so unless I really messed something up somehow I can't see that they would disintegrate this quickly. Also if that were so there would be a lot of noise from the cam chain rubbing on aluminum, and that isn't the case. (pardon)
Obviously I have no desire to go through all the work of tearing this down again, but would do so readily if there was any bad noises indicating that there is something really wrong.
I haven't done anything to source the cause of these flakes, so they may very well be back in the future.
I don't know what else to do or look for so I think I'll button her up and check the oil again in another 100 miles or so unless you guys have any other suggestions as to something else to look for.
This course of action does cause me some concern as I don't want to do any irreparable damage, but it was running great with no unusual noises.
EDIT: All the wheel bearing grease that was packed in the needle bearing has been washed away and there was plenty of oil throughout the entire clutch assembly.
Let me cut to the chase. No joy on the clutch screws being too long. The Mikes / XS650 Direct screws are 40mm long.
So the inner hub is rub mark free. Unfortunately this isn't the source of my 'cheap 70's metal-flake paint job' to use 5twins words.
I compared all areas that had scrape marks to pictures taken in June when I was last in there and there are no changes.
June pic:
July pic:
June pic:
July pic:
Could post more pics but kinda redundant.
2M as excited as I was about polishing something I decided against polishing these spots for three reasons.
1) I would have to start with an abrasive such as a fine grit paper or roloc discs and was afraid that would remove too much material that could compromise the ability to notice subtle changes in the future.
2) I have a pretty extensive photographic record of everything that can be referenced.
3) If word got out that I was actually polishing the 'INSIDE' of my cases I may get a visit by these guys.
So, no luck with this boys. I know the next logical sources are the cam chain guide/tensioner but there's only 550 miles on these brand new ones, so unless I really messed something up somehow I can't see that they would disintegrate this quickly. Also if that were so there would be a lot of noise from the cam chain rubbing on aluminum, and that isn't the case. (pardon)
Obviously I have no desire to go through all the work of tearing this down again, but would do so readily if there was any bad noises indicating that there is something really wrong.
I haven't done anything to source the cause of these flakes, so they may very well be back in the future.
I don't know what else to do or look for so I think I'll button her up and check the oil again in another 100 miles or so unless you guys have any other suggestions as to something else to look for.
This course of action does cause me some concern as I don't want to do any irreparable damage, but it was running great with no unusual noises.
EDIT: All the wheel bearing grease that was packed in the needle bearing has been washed away and there was plenty of oil throughout the entire clutch assembly.
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You know how I see this. I’d be doing the exact same thing. It runs great, no scary noises, I’d ride it and do frequent oil changes for a while. Its what the Dr’s like to call watchful waiting. Until something comes up that definitely points to a fixable problem , I’d say go enjoy that motorcycle. You earned it! 
Thanks Bob. There may well be something else that the Gurus will suggest to explore, so we'll see.
