jayel
#9 Guru 74 TX650A
a girder front end and you're worried about drum vs. disc brakes? 
hard tail frame too? 
hard tail frame too? 
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How good can the stock front drum brake be made to work?
neanderthal
neanderthal
a girder front end and you're worried about drum vs. disc brakes?
so everyone with a hard tail or girder shouldnt worry about the brakes they use?
hmmm dont know about that logic.
80brat
XS650 Addict
I THINK FRONT DRUMS ARE COOL no mastercin on the bars simple clean look
jayel
#9 Guru 74 TX650A
if you're jamming a girder forked hardtail hard enough to be worried that you need disc brakes logic has very little to do with itso everyone with a hard tail or girder shouldnt worry about the brakes they use?
hmmm dont know about that logic.
Jeeter;
This thread reminds me of the guys that show up every 3 or 4 months, and ask a question like this," I'm planning on running with no front brake, so my bike will be real cool looking; should I do that?"
The threads go on for 3 or 4 pages, with lots of verbal bantering with 2 very clear view points. The "Safety" guys like myself tell them its a really bad idea, and of course the "Badass rebel" guys tell them to "go for it................its your bike, so do what you like".
So, Jeeter, this thread is much the same. Anybody who drove cars/trucks/bikes in the old days, knows that drum brakes are crap, plain and simple as that. However, that should not matter to you. If you want the look of the drum brake on the front, then just do it and enjoy it for what it is. As long as you ask for opinions on things like brakes, you will get many replys that don't agree with your view point.
Be sure to post some pictures when you have it installed on the bike, and us "Safety" guys will be shocked and astonished.
This thread reminds me of the guys that show up every 3 or 4 months, and ask a question like this," I'm planning on running with no front brake, so my bike will be real cool looking; should I do that?"
The threads go on for 3 or 4 pages, with lots of verbal bantering with 2 very clear view points. The "Safety" guys like myself tell them its a really bad idea, and of course the "Badass rebel" guys tell them to "go for it................its your bike, so do what you like".
So, Jeeter, this thread is much the same. Anybody who drove cars/trucks/bikes in the old days, knows that drum brakes are crap, plain and simple as that. However, that should not matter to you. If you want the look of the drum brake on the front, then just do it and enjoy it for what it is. As long as you ask for opinions on things like brakes, you will get many replys that don't agree with your view point.
Be sure to post some pictures when you have it installed on the bike, and us "Safety" guys will be shocked and astonished.
neanderthal
neanderthal
Drums are crap compaired to disc yes, but drums are not crap. Just because a bike is rigid doesn't mean you can't worry about stopping. That is just plain dumb to think otherwise.
Jeeter
XS650 Addict
Really? No kiddin"? Wow, I had no idea that I would receive ideas spanning a broad spectrum on this issue.
I'm not sure what you're poking at here, but I am fully aware that many viewpoints are going to be presented, which is precisely why I posted this. If I just wanted to have my way "just to look cool" I wouldn't even BOTHER with asking about any new developments on drum brake tech, I'd just do it, other's opnions be damned.
I'm sorry that you're not happy with my thread, but that too is just another opinion, isn't it?
I wanted to know if there have been any other drum brake improvements other than what the likes of Racetech has done with them. I got some opinions sent my way, and I've made my decision accordingly. If you'd read my last post or two you'd know that I left the option open and did not decide on anything solid. I also admitted that there are positives to both, considering the package the brakes would be mounted to.
Yea, haahaa ...Be sure to post some pictures when you have it installed on the bike, and us "Safety" guys will be shocked and astonished.
.. because all I want to do is shock and astonish the safety guys. Yup, the safety guys' opinions are SO important to me that I'll go out of my way just to upset them.
Jeeter
XS650 Addict
a girder front end and you're worried about drum vs. disc brakes?
so everyone with a hard tail or girder shouldnt worry about the brakes they use?
hmmm dont know about that logic.
if you're jamming a girder forked hardtail hard enough to be worried that you need disc brakes logic has very little to do with it
Well I guess that sews it then. I'm not just curious about something, I'm actually stupid! Well, me and Jake Horton that is. Haahaa! I'm just glad I am surrounded by all of this kind wisdom to straighten me out.
Listen folks, telling someone they're stupid for not thinking like you is NOT any way to get them to think your way. People are far more open to suggestion when they are treated with some degree of respect. Unless they're too stupid to grasp the concept of respect, then, yea, you just gotta put them in their place. (that was sarcasm).
I'll take everyone's suggestions into consideration. I actually do appreciate your thoughts, which is exactly why I posted the question in the first place.
I understand that, I mean "no kidding?". The reason that the rigid frame was in the picture is that there are certain limits that keep it's speed reduced in nearly ANY situation. The need for brakes to haul down a 600cc sportbike from 150+mph just does not exist with the rigid framed XS650 bike. That's all I meant.
It's a wonder I am still alive, I guess. I mean I raced for years, in numerous forms, it's a friggin miracle that I am alive and breathing with as stupid as I am. Haaha!
I mean, how on Earth did our dads EVER SURVIVE on the horrible mean streets with only those drum brakes to rely upon?!?!?I'm just having fun with some of these replies. This is fun, don't you all think so?
Lesson here? Always be afraid to ask a question. There actually ARE "stupid questions" that will be met with stupid answers.
neanderthal
neanderthal
Your last post was confusing. If directed towards me, I wasn't calling anyone stupid. I was saying being closed minded was...my folks used to do that. I hated it...oh you think that's stupid? So you're calling me stupid....no mom just the idea not you haha. You'll be fine with drums. If you go above the speed limit in traffic then that's your problem. You need more than brakes to get out of a sticky situation.
In a way I'm defending you jester...read the entire thread. Think you have me confused for a different poster.
In a way I'm defending you jester...read the entire thread. Think you have me confused for a different poster.
Jeeter
XS650 Addict
AH! Ok, now I see. My bad, totally. I mean, I don't really "know" everyone here yet.
My apologies for misunderstanding. I'm serious.
You ARE having fun here! For more, do a google search on 'oil recommendations'.
2 more things on your drum front:
Good luck finding an XS1 or XS1B front drum, complete system. They're somewhat rare, especially in good condition. It'll $$ cost $$ you.
That racetech site is cool, but they require that YOU supply the shoes. The aftermarket shoes I've come across are already too thin, wouldn't want to grind them down, unless they could rebond some material to the shoe frame (no mention of that). Morris's vintagebrake site had the good shoes, and offers the grind/fit service.
2 more things on your drum front:
Good luck finding an XS1 or XS1B front drum, complete system. They're somewhat rare, especially in good condition. It'll $$ cost $$ you.
That racetech site is cool, but they require that YOU supply the shoes. The aftermarket shoes I've come across are already too thin, wouldn't want to grind them down, unless they could rebond some material to the shoe frame (no mention of that). Morris's vintagebrake site had the good shoes, and offers the grind/fit service.
Okie
XS650 Addict
I agree. Go to Vintage Brake. He can make a drum brake work as well as it possibly can, and does for vintage racers who use drums.
Adjustment is critical on the TLS brake to get it to work right.
Also, they don't work so well going backwards.
Painfully adequate on my 71b.
Also, they don't work so well going backwards.
Painfully adequate on my 71b.
Jeeter
XS650 Addict
As it stands I've elected to go with the disk brake option that the girder front end builder offers. I may have dual 11.5" disks using 2000 to 2007 Harley Ferguson calipers and disks (as well as any aftermarket stuff that is made to fit that same application). So, at present I'm going with Wilwood calipers, some sort of lightweight disks (NOT wavy disks, I just don't care for that look on this project) perhaps EBCs or something. The front hub may be any narrow glide (aka Sportster) type hub that has a 0.750" wheel bearing, and that includes whatever the aftermarket has to offer.
As far as the drum brake notion, I've gained a lot of information from this thread, and it's been a great help on the idea. That said, I still plan on seeing what can be done with a stock XS drum brake (see re-arcing and other improvements) however that will be one of my bench projects that will be done separately from the actual bike build. Just like the hot-rod engine I want to build, it too is another bench project that will begin with building up a really great cylinder head. Both the drum brake and the built head will be bench projects done separately from this bike project.
Should the drum brake setup work out well enough, on the bike it goes. This bike will be an ongoing development, just like an actual racebike. As I've said before, "you're never really done with this type of bike". Which is part of what makes it so much fun.
Thanks for the constructive help and experiences that some folks shared. I appreciate the input.
As far as the drum brake notion, I've gained a lot of information from this thread, and it's been a great help on the idea. That said, I still plan on seeing what can be done with a stock XS drum brake (see re-arcing and other improvements) however that will be one of my bench projects that will be done separately from the actual bike build. Just like the hot-rod engine I want to build, it too is another bench project that will begin with building up a really great cylinder head. Both the drum brake and the built head will be bench projects done separately from this bike project.
Should the drum brake setup work out well enough, on the bike it goes. This bike will be an ongoing development, just like an actual racebike. As I've said before, "you're never really done with this type of bike". Which is part of what makes it so much fun.
Thanks for the constructive help and experiences that some folks shared. I appreciate the input.
