1973 xs650 starter wont turn

patrickjudkins

XS650 Member
Messages
12
Reaction score
0
Points
1
Location
arkansas
i just took on trade a couple 70's xs650's. The one im messing with now is a 73. here what i have done thus far. Hooked up 12v battery and it had no power anywhere, discovered the solenoid is bad, had power coming in but wasn't putting out power to the gauges, lights, etc. Replaced it, now i have lights, headlight, neutral light, but the starter doesn't even make a sound. The neutral light is on, clutch is pulled in even though its seems very loose, the kill switch seemed iffy to me so i wired through it temporarily. the bike kick starts, but im tired of kicking it. trying to make all the systems work, then im going to tear it down clean it and put it all back together to sell.
 

Attachments

  • 11930713_10203251128237514_902045506_n.jpg
    11930713_10203251128237514_902045506_n.jpg
    74.8 KB · Views: 190
Make sure the battery negative cable is connected to bare metal on the frame with no corrosion present.

Connect your VOM to read the voltage on the load side of the starter solenoid,(the terminal that goes directly to the starter motor). If you see no voltage when trying to use the starter motor, then the problem is with the control wiring for the solenoid. If you do see full battery voltage, then the problem is with the starter motor itself, so you need to remove it for inspection. If the solenoid clicks and voltage measures 9 volts or less, the battery is very weak and cannot supply enough current.
 
when you press the button to start there is no voltage on the starter side of the solenoid, no clicking sound no nothing, im guessing the solenoid i got is good enough to power the accessories through the 12v accessory wire but wont flip to start the bike. Next question when i depress the button, it has a single blue wire connected to it, does that short to ground or does that apply 12v to its side of the solenoid which then would send 12v to the starter to start the bike? also is it safe to jump across the 2 main posts on that solenoid to try and start it, i do it all the time on cars and boats, but motorcycles are new to me, i dont wanna kill myself. thank you for your help
 
The solenoid only powers up the starter motor. It does not supply any other loads.

From the wiring diagram, battery power comes from the ignition switch, to the kill switch, to the safety relay, and then to the push button. Use your VOM to measure at each location to see where you are losing the battery voltage.
 

Attachments

  • 72 and 73 wiring jpeg.JPG
    72 and 73 wiring jpeg.JPG
    110.6 KB · Views: 624
thx for the diagram, however my starter solenoid has 4 wires, main power in, power to starter, starter trip wire and power to accessories, the diagrm only shows a 3 wire setup mine is 4
 
yes sir, thats my next project! i fi can get the red one running and sold im going to move on to the gold one, unless i can find a buyer the way she sits
 
That diagram does show a four wire solenoid. The red battery cable, the black down to the starter, a blue/white from the start button, and a fourth that is off the bottom , a black wire, going to a set of triangular lines. These triangular lines represent ground.
You can see the same symbol in several places in the diagram, it always means ground.
As RG said power comes to the solenoid through the key switch, kill switch and safety relay. This power goes out to ground to complete the circuit. This trips the relay, sending full battery power through the large cables to the starter.
There are several tests you can do to test the starter. With a set of jumper cables like to jump a car, hook one end of the jumpers to a good battery. I have a spare car battery I use for these tests. You can even use your car battery, just get the car and bike close enough to reach from one to the other with the jumper cables.
Hook the cables to your battery, Hook the ground side to one of the front foot peg mount nuts, this is a good ground. Put a large screwdriver in the positive clamp.
Now from under the bike peel back the rubber cover over the big cable at the starter. Touch the screw driver to the cable lug on the starter. This may cause a few sparks but it should spin the starter and turn the engine. If it does spin the starter and turns the engine, you can be pretty sure the starter is ok. Now put the rubber cover back over the cable lug.
Now move up to the solenoid. Peel back the rubber covers from both cables. Touch the screwdriver to the cable that runs down to the starter. If the starter worked in test #1 It should work this time. If not the cable is suspect. Just cleaning the cable ends and lugs should improve things If not replace the cable.
Now if your bike battery is fully charged unhook the jumper cables from the spare battery. Use just the red side to jumper from the cable from the battery to the cable to the starter. This should spin the starter. If not it could be bad cable connections, bad cables or bad battery.
If all these tests prove the starter and bike battery are ok then unplug the blue/white wire at the solenoid. Hook a jumper wire from battery positive to this blue/white wire. This should spin the starter. If not check the ground connection on the black wire on the solenoid.
If the solenoid clicks but wont spin the starter then the solenoid is bad. A solenoid is just a switch. The relay part just closes the switch. If the switch contacts are burnt no power will flow from the battery to the starter.
If the solenoid spins the starter in this test then the wiring between the battery and solenoid needs work.
You say it kick starts and runs ok. Do all the lights and such work ok?
If so you need to check for battery voltage on both sides of the kill switch. With the key ON one wire should have battery voltage on it at all times, the other only when the button is pushed. If power wont come through the start button then it can be taken apart and the contacts cleaned.
If the start button has battery voltage on both sides when you push the button but the starter won't spin then it could be a bad blue/white wire from the start button to the solenoid. At the solenoid test for voltage on the blue/white wire when the start button is pushed. If no or low voltage the wire needs to be traced to find the bad spot and fixed.
Leo
 
ok, what im saying is the diagram really only shows 3 wires, the ground is thru the bolt on one of the corners it grounds to the fram, mine has 4 wires, incoming 12 volts, starter wire, red wire for power to accessories and then black to starter, this diagram doesnt show my solenoid
 
Ok, so I jumped the coil to 12v sprayed starter fluid in carb openings, turned over for about 10 seconds and it fired up and ran great as long as I pumped starter fluid in it, after a minute of run time it died, now no spark... agh! What do I need to check? Put new plugs checked spark plug wires with a analog volt meter and nothing so I'm guessing this has points maybe? Where are they how to I check them, what should my gap be?
 
Ok, so I got spark on the left side, right side I think the black coil? Is bad, points look great, only thing I'm concerned about is the center of the points which I believe is the cam wobbles a little and makes the points contacts close every turn
 
hmmmm...my '73 had a decompression lever/starter switch.

You can see the small lever on the right side in this pic:
Cafe650007.jpg
 
The more I look at your pics, I think that bike is a '74 TX650....not a '73. The sidecovers and tank are wrong also...
 
hmm, i think your right, i guess i should look at the titles. Im think im just going to sell them, im already tired of messing with it. I know the yellow one is a 1971 sx1b. im going to put them up for sale and see what i can get for them like they are. i already ordered another new solenoid and that coil black tube thing. any idea what they are worth? im sure not much, im starting to regret the trade i did the more research i do.
 
I traded something that was worth 1500$ I'd love to get twice that, but it looks more like I'll loose a little. Anyone here interested in them?
 
Back
Top