Expanded charging system guide (In progress)

Is there a way to use this regulator on my bike? it appears to be the same as the regulator/rectifier unit I see on this page. if so how do I do the wiring from 7 to 6 wire connector?
 
According to the '81 650 wiring diagram, you should have a 7 wire connection to your reg/rec. Three whites and the green run to the alternator. There is also a red, brown, and black. The red is constant power directly from the battery (unswitched). That feeds the rectifier part of your reg/rec. The brown is switched power from the harness. It is turned on and off with the key. The black is ground. Your inner brush is also fed switched power from the harness on a brown wire. The green wire to your outer brush controls the ground. That's how your regulator controls the charging output, by "regulating" or turning the ground on and off.

That Seca reg/rec appears to be the same ground regulating type so should work.
 
5twins said:
According to the '81 650 wiring diagram, you should have a 7 wire connection to your reg/rec. Three whites and the green run to the alternator. There is also a red, brown, and black. The red is constant power directly from the battery (unswitched). That feeds the rectifier part of your reg/rec. The brown is switched power from the harness. It is turned on and off with the key. The black is ground. Your inner brush is also fed switched power from the harness on a brown wire. The green wire to your outer brush controls the ground. That's how your regulator controls the charging output, by "regulating" or turning the ground on and off.

That Seca reg/rec appears to be the same ground regulating type so should work.
Click to expand...
I just checked the wiring on my bike according to the above message. I have been working on the wrong part. That's what I get for depending on ebay. I found the regulator and the right connector, plugged in the regulator from the 82 Seca and the bike is charging normally. Now all I have to do is figure out how to swap out the regulators.
 
just wanted to say a big thank you to everyone who took the time to post all this information. I just got a 79 XS650 Special and after fully trickle charging the newer gel battery to 12.7v, it would be profoundly dead after only a couple miles of riding. it failed the slap test and I was getting 12.1v at the battery while revving at 3-4k RPM. opened up the alternator, made a jumper cable out of speaker wire from the battery + terminal to the + brush, and (after some sparks!) the stator magnetized, the voltage at the battery went up to 14-15v at 3-4k RPM. based on diagnostic guides I thought I had a bad regulator or bad wiring.

I pulled out the brushes, which were about 10mm long. probably could be replaced soon but maybe not dire. cleaned off the rotor with rubbing alcohol, put it all back together, and suddenly it was all just working! was getting 14-15v at the battery when revved to 3-4k RPM. weakly passes the slap test with the alternator cover back on. took it for a test ride and the battery had more charge than when it started - a first!

moral of the story: start with the simple stuff - it could just need a cleaning! my rotor didn't even look that dirty. so happy it was a simple fix. never would have figured this out without all your help. a round of beers for all...
 
I hate asking this question due to the fact that I may be missing the answer somewhere in here, but golly, there's a LOT of stuff to read and my head can't get around it...

I wanna do the Curly's Tests. I'm confused about a few things...

1: To be sure, I DON'T need nylon screws, right?
2: Where I am supposed to make a jump to ground? (This is the main question I have, as I have seen a few differing things about this)
3: Just curious: How many continuous amps does the reg/rec create?

Here's my bike details:
• 1975 XS650b
• Original Stator and Rotor.
• Mike's Solid State Reg/Rec (part number 24-2089)
• Motogadget M-Unit.
• AntiGravity 8-cell.
• Weather Pack connector (https://www.delcity.net/store/Weather-Pack-Female-Housing/p_809164.h_809170.t_1) instead of the big white chunk - to save space for the white, brown and green wires. The Red and Black are bullet-type connectors. THe weather pack connectors are rated for 20amps continuous. I will convert back to the original blocks if I have to, but only if I have to.

The bike kicks on easily, runs like a champ. The battery on a tender will hold 13.15 amps. (The battery is good)

The brushes are long (but the rest of them look less than new), but they seem OK. I dunno.

I cleaned the slip rings with steel wool, a chamois, and a few drops of denatured alcohol. They look much better.
 
Correct, you do not need nylon screws.
You do not jumper to ground. For the test, you need to jumper the battery positive (12 v +) to the left, outer brush terminal.
The rec/reg does not create any amps. The amps are created in the alternator, and that is about 14.3 amps at 4000 rpm (200 watts).
I replace my brushes when they get down to 0.4 inches long.
 
retiredgentleman said:
Correct, you do not need nylon screws.
You do not jumper to ground. For the test, you need to jumper the battery positive (12 v +) to the left, outer brush terminal.
The rec/reg does not create any amps. The amps are created in the alternator, and that is about 14.3 amps at 4000 rpm (200 watts).
I replace my brushes when they get down to 0.4 inches long.
Click to expand...


Thank you, good man.
 
retiredgentleman said:
Correct, you do not need nylon screws.
You do not jumper to ground. For the test, you need to jumper the battery positive (12 v +) to the left, outer brush terminal.
Click to expand...

This screw?

Thanks again!
 

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Yes, the screw that supplies regulated power to the outer brush from your regulator. The other three screws ground the inner brush to the alternator casting .....

EarlyBrushMountLabeled.jpg
 
I see you posted another pic, one of your brush wire connections. If that red wire running to the inner brush is a power wire, that's wrong. It should be a ground, but not necessarily from the frame somewhere. It can be the ground wire from the regulator/rectifier. As originally set up, the black wire running to the inner brush isn't delivering a ground to it. That brush is already grounded through it's 3 mounting screws. The black wire is actually getting a ground there and delivering it to the regulator.
 
5twins....................I'd say the red wire to the grounded right inner brush is likely correct. The copper stator windings and the red and green wires look clean and may have been recently replaced from Mikesxs. Mikesxs used a red wire as the connection to the right inner brush (ground), instead of using a black wire as they should have used.:doh:
Qwerty should trace that red wire back to the rec/reg unit and make sure it connects to a green wire at the combo unit.The green wire
at the brushes should be traced back and connect to an orange wire at the rec/reg unit.
Also Qwerty should confirm that the case of the rec/reg unit has a ground wire running to a good bare metal ground on
the frame (not the battery box).

Edit; disregard this post. The OP now says the picture I referenced was not his engine.
 
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The 2089 unit Mike's has pictured now does have the same wire colors as the stock units did. Of course, that doesn't mean they connect to the same things. There is a link for install instructions but they are absolutely no help at all. The drawing is for a 1981 model, lol.

Honestly, I don't understand why people buy these combo units. It seems they don't work more times than they do so it's just a total waste of $100+.
 
That photo is not from my bike. I needed a reference for which screw was the one I need to jump the battery to. I was at work.

This is my bike. The bottoms left screw is a green wire. Top left is black (ground)
 

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Yeah 5twins, sometimes you just can't help people. You and I have both tried to pass on information such as using the VR-115 regulator, but the lads are determined to spend lots of money on junk chinese parts that mostly don't work.
That sure is a joke, showing an 1981 model diagram as install instructions for a 70 to 79 product.
 
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I like my vr115 system, I recently put one on my sons friends cb750. And I need to add that it was here on this site I gained the most help in doing it. Thanks goes to the good guys here on xs650.com
 
I'm using a combo because I'm not running a stick setup based on the super sensitive anti gravity battery, due to space and weight. In need a more modern charging system that won't overcharge my battery and blow it up.

For what it's worth, I have no issues keeping the original alternator (no PMA) because I know it works.
 

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