PAMCO Timing

vincejames

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It seems like there is not a definitive answer on the forum, so I wanted to pull some of the experts. I have a PAMCO on my bike w/ e-advance, battery and PMA. The bike will start and run but, I'm having one issue. When I tested the timing with my timing gun it looks like the timing is just off by about 1/2 inch and I cannot rotate the PAMCO any more clockwise due to the shape of the PAMCO plate and the bolts that help keep it in place.

My cam chain is fine and all routine maintenance checks out. Thoughts on if this issue has been resolved or anyone knows the answer would be great.

Thanks,
Vince
 
Hmmmmm - I don't have an answer for you VJ - but I am interested in this topic as well.

Pete
 
Yes it is. Cam chain is fine. Some recommended trimming the PAMCO plate so that it can be turned a 1/2 inch clockwise.
 
That is a lot to be off. The Pamco usually times up somewhere in the middle of it's adjustment range so add that to what you're already off and, well, you're really, really off. I would check that replacement "cap" for the mechanical advance and make sure it's installed/aligned properly. That's what locks the timing in at a certain spot. If it's installed right, maybe it was made wrong (alignment pin slot in the wrong spot)? You might try contacting Pete to see if this problem has occurred before.
 
Sep last year in your thread on getting the carbs tuned your bike was running and up to 80MPH. I have to assume the timing was spot on then.........what has changed, or been done, for the timing to be so far out now????
 
I had to trim my plate to get it timed correctly. It has run great since.
What you have done, has solved the problem temporarily, but the root problem is still there. I agree with 5twins................something is either assembled wrong or some part came manufactured wrong. How did you determine TDC to set the timing?
 
Some tips / hints at timing the PAMCO E-Advancer:

1. Be sure your idle speed is at or below 1200 RPM. The E-Advancer introduces advance starting at 1300 RPM, so any idle speed above 1200 will cause you to adjust the plate to eliminate this advance, and you may run out of room before you do.
2. Your timing light works best with a negative spark plug voltage. The dual output coil produces that on just one of the plug wires, the other one will be positive, which can cause the timing light to be erratic or false timing indications. This is true for any ignition using a dual output coil, not just the PAMCO. Try using the other plug wire.
3. There is a slight amount of free play in both the magnet rotor and the cap that replaces the advancer. Try holding either or both of these in the opposite direction needed when tightening the shaft nuts to move the timing within range.
4. A loose timing chain or a worn out timing chain can put the timing mark out of the desired adjustment range. Correct whatever is the issue with your timing chain before attemptiong to set the timing.
5. Those fancy, expensive timing lights with the built in advance preset should not be used as they can introduce unwanted delays in the flash of the timing light. Set them to zero or don't user them. This is true for any ignition installed in the XS650 or any motorcycle engine.
6. Setting the timing with an aftermarket PMA alternator rotor can be challenging as many of them do not have a key way to locate the rotor on the crankshaft, or the markings supplied by the manufacturer are not accurate. If you are experiencing problems setting the timing with a PMA setup, suggest that you temporarily reinstall the factory rotor to set the timing.
7. The timing is set at idle speed or below. Exactly the place where a PMA can be most troublesome as far as producing a reliable pure DC voltage. This can cause the E-Advancer to recycle due to the low voltage, producing an erratic timing indication. Disconnect the PMA and use a battery to power the PAMCO when setting the timing.
8. All of the advancer caps are made by the same CNC machine so it is very unlikely that one out of a batch of 100 would be cut incorrectly. However, it is possible for the hole in the camshaft that is used for the locating pin can be worn from age so it does not hold the locating pin firmly, allowing the cap to move out of its proper position. So, just hold the cap in the opposite position from where the timing shows when tightening the nut.
9. For best results, after you have gotten the engine to idle reliably and the timing is in the ball park, try reducing the idle speed to 1,000 RPM as that will be below the speed that the E-Advancer produces any advance. This should also take care of an inaccurate tachometer, many of which are not very good at low engine speed.
10. Sync the carbs before attempting to set the timing. If the carbs are not synced, then it is possible that one of the cylinders is not working at all at idle, so the engine actually slows down when it is time for that cylinder to fire, resulting in an erratic idle speed and subsequent erratic timing.
 
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I see, from previous threads, that vincejames does not have a tachometer. As per Pamcopete's instructions, you need to set the timing when the rpm is at or below 1200, but since there is no tach, I guess vincejames is just guessing what the rpm is. That may be his real problem.
 
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