Wherein I either make a seat or a fool of myself, and also other things with the bike

I've pretty much run nothing but pods on my 650s for as long as I've had them (about 15 years). Yes, there can be issues riding in the rain, but mainly in very heavy rain and only when you come to a stop. The pods may suck some water in at a stop and the bike can start running rough and want to stall. But, once you're aware of this issue, you just blip the throttle and keep it running. There doesn't seem to be any problems once in motion and moving down the road. I guess the water just blows by then.

The UNI foam pods we use come in two versions, the black foam one piece and a dual layer version. The dual layer is nothing more than the plain black unit with an added red foam "sleave" put on it. I can't say for sure, but it's possible this version might be less prone to sucking in water. As you can see, I have a set installed but I have yet to be caught in the rain with them .....

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Got my tiny battery in today, and ordered a bunch of stuff to do the rewire last night. Am quite pleased with it, I actually initially thought it was an empty box on the table (my wife brought it in). I feel like I said it before, but I'm looking forward to getting that done.
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Sitting is what I'm most concerned with in relation to the pod filters, I'm guessing that when in motion the legs will be enough of a wind deflector to keep them from getting too wet. When I ride to work the bike just sits outside though and I don't want to have the filters soaked by a storm then have the thing take a big gulp of water when I go to start it. Certainly appreciate feedback on the question.
 
Got my tiny battery in today, and ordered a bunch of stuff to do the rewire last night. Am quite pleased with it, I actually initially thought it was an empty box on the table (my wife brought it in). I feel like I said it before, but I'm looking forward to getting that done.
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Sitting is what I'm most concerned with in relation to the pod filters, I'm guessing that when in motion the legs will be enough of a wind deflector to keep them from getting too wet. When I ride to work the bike just sits outside though and I don't want to have the filters soaked by a storm then have the thing take a big gulp of water when I go to start it. Certainly appreciate feedback on the question.

Hi Nash,
you sure that the charging system won't overwhelm that tiny battery?
A plastic bag pulled over each pod filter when you park would keep them dry.
 
Hi Nash,
you sure that the charging system won't overwhelm that tiny battery?
A plastic bag pulled over each pod filter when you park would keep them dry.

it's 9AH 135CCA so....probably not? Honestly hadn't given any thought to it and barring voltage regulator failure don't think it'd be an issue. Maybe I'm wrong?
 
it's 9AH 135CCA so....probably not? Honestly hadn't given any thought to it and barring voltage regulator failure don't think it'd be an issue. Maybe I'm wrong?

Hi Nash,
sorry, your definition of "tiny" is way bigger than mine. 9AH & 135CCA will certainly work on a kickstart only XS650.
 
Hi Nash,
sorry, your definition of "tiny" is way bigger than mine. 9AH & 135CCA will certainly work on a kickstart only XS650.

Yeah, tiny as in physical footprint, not in capacitance. Really, even then only tiny in comparison to a normal motorcycle battery.
 
Something of actual substance today, made a tray to hold the new battery and finally cut the grab bar tabs from the back of the frame.
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First a comparison picture of the old and new battery, which doesn't do the change justice. I don't know what one of those stock batteries weighs but it's got to be four or five times what the new battery does. It easily made up for the additional seat weight just with the change to the lighter battery even though that wasn't really a concern.
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Tearing stuff off the bike. The electric starter hasn't worked since I got the bike, I haven't pulled it out to specifically check it but it sounds as though a bushing/bearing is worn out and the gear jumps teeth. It hasn't bothered me as the bike kicks very easily, but it still had all the junk associated with the electric start so I took the relays off. While I was at it I yanked the turn signal flasher. Turn signals are another thing I've never seen work on the bike, it didn't have front turn signals and moving the switch to the right caused both rear lights to come on. I've already ordered a digital flasher to go on with the rewire eventually.
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Beginning to work on the new battery tray, using just random scrap bits laying around. Normally I'd want something bigger to break the edge over but I can't be choosy. Also the lump of an original battery carrier in the back ground.
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There is the tray and hold down made and mocked up on the bike. I can fit another slice of foam between the battery and the seat when seat is down. The seat is hollow even up above the frame so there was room to work with, moreso than there would be with the stock seat.
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Showing below the tray with things in place. The bottom of the tray is roughly even with the bottom of the frame rails. Happy with this and happy that the spacing worked out OK. Opening things up would have been all for naught had the thing needed to hang below the frame anyway.
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There is the painted battery tray. It's not my best work but it works and that's all it needs to do. While the paint was drying I took the opportunity to remove the grab bar tabs and some of the wiring tabs from up by the air filters. Also fit the new front turn signals I bought last weekend, so I have running lights on the bike for the first time.
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Painted tray installed, and you can see where I chopped up the old carrier to steal the attachment points for the factory air filters. I didn't want to incorporate anything onto the new tray for them because the plan is still to go to pod filters. I'll have to work up something at that point to support the carburetors and have a plan for it when the time comes but don't have the stuff yet.
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Just got stuff crammed in there for now, it won't have to live this way for long though. Wiring stuff is already showing up so I'll get on with the rewire soon.
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Going back together to head home I can't help but think I'll have to do something different with the rear fender now completely. I was planning on at the very least modifying it to accept a fuse block and some relays to run the bike. It doesn't look right sitting in front of the frame hoop there. There is an amazing amount of wheel clearance there that doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. It's possible that it's simply due to the longer shocks but either way even with the rear shocks fully compressed there is probably inches of clearance. The springs are heavy enough that I can't imagine what I'd have to due to bottom the thing out though.
I'm thinking more about the filters too, wondering if maybe I can get them close enough to the center line of the bike to keep the weather off them or if I really need a cover. The tabs from the original cover aren't the most aesthetically appealing things in the world and I'd like them gone. I can probably engineer something less obtrusive if I have too, but I'm also thinking about maybe something that just snaps over the outside of the filters themselves so it can be as small as possible. That'll be thought on more later once I actually have a pair of filters.

Also the bike needs a bath, and with that a good night to everyone.
 
Ordered filters and found a number, the new battery is less than a quarter the weight of the lead acid original. For some reason I think I remember the number 4 pounds from weighing everything a year ago with the seat change which wasn't including the section of rear fender removed. If that be the case then I'm definitely down, and things are becoming more centralized. I'll add some back in with changing the rear fender and adding the fuse block and extra relays but that shouldn't be too much.
 
As I mentioned earlier, I've run pretty much nothing but pods for many years and never had any carb support issues. Just make sure you have the tin shrouds in place over the intake rubbers, they add needed support. Run without them and you might very well have support issues.

Your rectifier was originally located out in the open air for cooling purposes. It may not take well to being hidden and enclosed under the seat like that. You might consider upgrading it to a more modern unit. They don't look so bad and wouldn't detract much from the look of the bike if hung on the bottom of your new electrics tray in the open air. In particular, the unit from an XS400 or XS500 would be a good candidate. It was a more modern design, totally enclosed and not bad looking .....

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All that needs to be done to it is to change the connector block so it will match your original and your harness .....

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Your rectifier was originally located out in the open air for cooling purposes. It may not take well to being hidden and enclosed under the seat like that. You might consider upgrading it to a more modern unit. They don't look so bad and wouldn't detract much from the look of the bike if hung on the bottom of your new electrics tray in the open air. In particular, the unit from an XS400 or XS500 would be a good candidate. It was a more modern design, totally enclosed and not bad looking .....

I don't disagree with the theory behind that what so ever, internally regulated alternators have fans on them for that very reason. My original plan was to mount the rectifier and voltage regulator under the battery tray for the purpose of getting more airflow to it in fact. I got to thinking then though, where it was originally mounted wasn't REALLY out in air flow, it was between the battery and the metal side cover. with the air filter blocking the front side of it. And then I thought "How big could the output on that alternator possibly be? and how much heat could that stuff possibly make?"
It's entirely possible that I'll be forced to make a change in the future, but the tray isn't remotely air tight in the frame, nor is the seat air tight to the frame, nor is the rear fender air tight to anything really.....so there is in all likelihood moving air around there when the bike is moving. I actually checked the thing after riding today and using my finger gauge the regulator and rectifier weren't much warmer than the battery and tray surrounding them. Granted it was only 60F out today so it's possible heat will be a larger issue come summer. It's something I'll keep an eye on going forward.
 
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Drew this out this morning, feel like this is everything I need. I left out the high beam indicator because I just don't see the need of one and never have personally. I'm getting rid of all the electric start stuff so don't need to include any of that junk either. I briefly considered scrapping the horn as well, it barely works, but decided on simply replacing it for a working model later as I can see the need for it down the road. The other thing I didn't bother drawing out was the multiple gauge lamps only doing a single one on the page even though there are multiple ones, I need to get some replacement sockets for them as well eventually just for the sake of having them. Also of note is I bought a selection of weatherpack connectors to incorporate on things and didn't bother to show basically any of them.
It'll be nice having the circuits mostly individually fused from now on. It blows having the possibility of being stranded because a brake light wire rubbed on the frame for instance. The plan is to go tomorrow and make the new rear fender with mounting for the fuse block and relays, then I can get down to the business of the actual wiring. I received the pod filters and a short piece of silicone hose last night too, so I'll try to get my filter adapter/carburetor support made tonight.
I really need to replace a wheel bearing in my truck too, but bike stuff is more fun. The other news is I was talking to my boss yesterday and when GoodGuys car show time happens my bike may end up in the bed of a C10 we've built and are hoping to take so that'll be cool.
 
Ha, just hit post and noticed I left a ground indicator off of the relays for the headlights and indicator lights.
 
Spent ten and a half hours minus a break for lunch working on things today. I ended up not working on anything last night, I remembered that if I went to work I wouldn't be there alone and I much prefer to be alone. Funny thing happened on the way in this morning too, sitting at a red light guy flagged me down and asked if I'd stop somewhere to talk about the bike. So that's a first for me. Lots of pictures tonight so I'll keep most of them thumbnails as this will already be a big post.
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Started out working on the air filters, made some short tubes to get from the silicone tubes to the air filters. Popped them together to see how it looked and be able to measure for the support part of things.
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Here is after the support was welded to the tubes, I drilled and tapped two holes in the frame tube right behind the carbs for the support. It doesn't look like much really, but it's actually quite rigid when everything is in there so no worries about the carb adapter to cylinder head sealing this way, and it's a largely unobtrusive way to support everything. That was about the time I went to Hooters with the family for lunch, came back sandblasted that piece and painted it.
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Got started then on the rear fender, irritatingly I had to start with a largely unused sheet of steel as we didn't have any scrap pieces laying around large enough to work. Put a roll in the middle of the piece and then broke the edges over. Then it was a couple hours of English wheel, planishing hammer, and the metal shrinker to get it into a fender shape. This is the first time I've ever done a fender, or even anything trying to make a single piece compound curve like this. It was a situation where I felt like I understood the idea behind the creation of a fender and just did that. Looking back now I basically had it right other than not thinking of the metal stretching under the English wheel a bit so I didn't have to start with a piece of as wide as I did, but other than that things went smoothly.
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Got the lower end anchored, ended up just reusing the factory fender mounts swapped to opposite sides and it works. I started out thinking I'd modify the factory mounts then realized they are almost certainly cast pieces and won't easily weld in. I could have found a piece of tubing, capped it, and made the same cup design but that just seemed like pointless time when I was expecting a crunch anyway. In the end, I'm good with this way of mounting. The pictures were taken before I did the back mount, for that I welded a tab onto the frame hoop and drilled a hole in the fender. Then put a rubber donut between the fender and tab, securing it was a bolt and nylock nut.
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Finished fender, reused the license plate mounting that I had grafted onto the factory fender cutting it off that and rewelding it to this one. Interestingly enough without really even trying to do so the curves of the two fenders matched almost perfectly. Added a couple nutserts to secure the fuse block and machine screws welded to the fender to attach the relays. Also it's not really easy to see but there is a tab welded on to mount the turn signal relay. The other picture shows the bottom edge of the fender with the cut out for chain clearance. At that point did the whole sandblast and paint deal for the fender too. Thankfully it fit into the blast cabinet, much bigger and it wouldn't have fit.
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While that was drying, and after I noticed the spot of the air filter adapter that I missed and sprayed some more paint on it, I went through and removed the side cover mounts from the frame. Y'all have convinced me to just run with the filters exposed all the time, though to be honest it didn't take a whole lot of convincing. It just looks cooler that way. Just sprayed some engine enamel over those spots on the frame too for the sake of having something on them. At some point I'd like to take the whole thing down and have the frame powder coated but that's down the road.
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Picture showing the layout of everything once I had things installed. You can sort of tell all the open space for airflow here too. I keep checking the alternator controls expecting them to be hot but I'm beginning to think it's just not going to be a problem.
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Finished products there, and I just noticed I don't have anything direct on the fender from the side to show it inline with the frame. Even with the crown of the fender, it hides almost completely when viewed directly from the side. Nearly forgot too, I bought the valve adjuster cover from Mikes and got rid of the compression release too.
Riding it home, it seemed to run better on throttle now. The idle is off and will need to be corrected, that surprised me a little as I wasn't expecting the filters to make any real difference in the way the engine ran. Just riding through town it seemed to want to pull better, even pulling out on to the main road on the cold engine the bike just was able to accelerate more smoothly. Thinking about that I got to a safe piece of road and went to wide open through first and second gears and wow, the bike pulls way harder now. I sent a message to a coworker and told him it pulls so much harder I kinda wonder if the old air filters were clogged. I hadn't changed them in the three years I've had the bike but they didn't look abnormally dirty and didn't think it necessary. Now the engine runs clean and pulls all the way to what seems like it should be close to redline. The tach is still broken, and it's obviously hard to gauge RPM at WOT on low gear, but again just seat of the pants the thing is noticeably quicker and sounds happier. So yeah 10/10 would do again on the air filters. Need to clean everything up well and take some nice pictures of it again, but that'll happen enough day. Tomorrow wiring starts, maybe.
 
Those pleated style pods you've chosen aren't the best for these CV carbs. They can cause turbulence in the air flow and that can mess with the slide lift. The issue is most pronounced in the upper midrange, say 4 to 5K, under heavy or full throttle applications. The bike will break up and stumble. Although you probably don't ride the bike this way (full throttle applied through the upper midrange), you may need to try it a few times for testing purposes.

Also, now that you've added pods to go along with your freer flowing exhaust, the bike might benefit from some minor jetting changes. When you're close on jetting, about the only way to know if a change will be better is to try it. In your case, a bump up a size or so on the mains may improve things even more. Unless you already did that for the pipes. If so then adding the pods has just completed the mod package, making it all work better. You can't let out (freer flowing exhaust) what you don't let in (increased intake due to the pods).
 
The extensions off the back of the carb to the pods will probably prevent the pods from interfering with the pilot intakes

That's exactly what I'm betting on, and given the ride home from the shop last night I believe my horse came in. Adding the tubes between the filters and the carb bodies does two things. One is simply the length allowing time for any turbulence caused by the filters to even out. The second thing the length does is adds a volume of clean air on the front side of the slides. I've added enough volume with the tubes and the size of the filters themselves that there is an amount of clean air before the slide equal to or possibly greater than the capacity of the cylinder itself which will allow the air to not have to rush through the filter elements under engine vacuum and as a result not create as much turbulence in the first place.


Those pleated style pods you've chosen aren't the best for these CV carbs. They can cause turbulence in the air flow and that can mess with the slide lift. The issue is most pronounced in the upper midrange, say 4 to 5K, under heavy or full throttle applications. The bike will break up and stumble. Although you probably don't ride the bike this way (full throttle applied through the upper midrange), you may need to try it a few times for testing purposes.

Also, now that you've added pods to go along with your freer flowing exhaust, the bike might benefit from some minor jetting changes. When you're close on jetting, about the only way to know if a change will be better is to try it. In your case, a bump up a size or so on the mains may improve things even more. Unless you already did that for the pipes. If so then adding the pods has just completed the mod package, making it all work better. You can't let out (freer flowing exhaust) what you don't let in (increased intake due to the pods).

I had already put larger jets primaries and mains in the carbs back when I did the exhaust, I would imagine I can probably go up another step now though. For the sake of being honest it probably needs new ignition coils too since I keep seeing things talking about how weak they were from the factory. The funny thing is, the midrange WOT stumble/breakup issue you mention is a perfect way to describe the way the bike acted before. Obviously I'll know more after I get the wiring done and just go riding around. :cheers:
 
One is simply the length allowing time for any turbulence caused by the filters to even out. The second thing the length does is adds a volume of clean air on the front side of the slides. I've added enough volume with the tubes and the size of the filters themselves that there is an amount of clean air before the slide equal to or possibly greater than the capacity of the cylinder itself which will allow the air to not have to rush through the filter elements under engine vacuum and as a result not create as much turbulence in the first place.
I wouldn't be surprised if you were getting a little pressure recovery in the mid/upper range too. Be interesting to see a dyno test with and without the extensions.
 
Taking a break from wiring to eat. Started on it last night and worked till 10:45PM, which was when my wife came into the garage and informed me it was late and she was just going to bed.
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It's funny looking, I'm used to wiring entire cars so that being all the wiring to the bike seems like a little bit of nothing. One "funny" thing I found last night is that the slightly more than a year old ignition switch I have isn't working correctly and the park light function is dead. I can't remember a time I've ever used the park lights on a bike so I'm not overly worried about it but it's aggravating none the less. The new handlebar switch gear I have has an otherwise unused "On/OFF"" switch so it'll graduate into a parking light switch.
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There's how it things left off for the night. Garage is a mess but I doubt I'm the only one here that can say that. Packed things up and then lay in bed half the night thinking about working on the bike instead of sleeping. Well, break time is over.
 
Good job with the intake. I keep thinking I'd like to make-find a single large air filter to feed both sides. It goes hand in hand with a battery box-ectomy and lithium ion battery to free up the room.
Your wiring looks great too.
Honestly your tail piece was not exciting me, but as the bike comes together it's growing on me!
 
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