The ergonomic experiment

OK for once we don't want any before, during or after pics of that.

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Alternate title: I was bored and wanted to try to make my ‘77 D more comfortable, by making some simple changes , without spending a bunch of money, but I probably will wind up spending way more than I hoped, because nothing is ever as simple as it first seems. :D

This is all Gary’s fault. Him and that darn Ywain :smoke: making an XS look all kicked back and comfortable.
It got the wheels turning in my mind.
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My XS2 is the perfect around town ripper, it’s a blast to ride, but it’s low geared and buzzy and not really suited ( for me ) to take on longer rides.

That leaves my ‘77,
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It’s a great bike and I really enjoy it, it’s motor is smoother and I have a small windshield and a luggage rack for it, so it lends itself better for longer rides, but there are still some comfort related issues that keep me from riding it too far. ( To be completely honest some of these issues are more of a creaky old guy issue :confused:)

So, here are the things I wish to address,

1. After about 45 minutes of riding , my knees start complaining. I want to be able to stretch out my legs.
2. I also want a more relaxed riding position.
3. To get anywhere very far, I have to travel on some fast moving highways for quite a distance. When I get
up to 65mph the motor is starting to get very buzzy. I want taller gearing to drop the rpms at highway speed.
4. I recovered my seat a while back and it looks nice, but the foam is stiff and my butt hurts after a while.

Besides, Gary’s Ywain, I also drew inspiration from T Zimmermans super clean ‘77,
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I have already ordered most of the things I will need to get the ball rolling, they have already started arriving.
As things come in and the bike goes together, I’ll post updates here.

The plan:
Highway pegs, higher rise handlebars with more pullback, new X Ring chain with new sprockets , a standard 17 tooth front and a 31 tooth rear, new softer handgrips. The seat is on hold for the time being, but I’ve got some ideas.

I originally planned to get a set of engine guards like TZ’s, I found NOS ones on EBay, but I opted for a more minimal look.
I found a pair of chrome , fold up pegs that mount to the front motor mounts. I got em on EBay. They were in fair condition, the chrome is presentable, if not perfect. All the bolts were rusted solid and were a lot of work to remove.
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I was surprised when they arrived to see that one of the mounting plates was bent. Since there was no crash damage evident, I assumed the bike must’ve tipped over and landed square on the end of the peg.
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I took it to a local car club garage and asked one of the guys there if they had a hydraulic press? He said
“ Why sure! Be right back! “ He got the bend out of it and here they are cleaned up and ready to mount.
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These pegs originally came with o-rings in the grooves on the pegs. I have ordered a bag of o-rings from EBay and will restore that original look. I will also have to replace the front motor mounts with longer bolts. I did manage to find one long ass bolt on eBay. But I’m going to have to use a piece of all thread for one of them.
Shoppers alert, if you like the look of these pegs, there are a pair for sale right here on our forums for less than I paid! :doh: http://www.xs650.com/threads/1979-xs650-special-parts.56489/

Next up, I got a 31 tooth sprocket and X Ring chain from Amazon, I already had a new front sprocket.
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And lastly ( for now ) new handlebars and grips. I had at first considered a set of used bars off of a Special.
What I wound up buying is a new set of Emgo bars that are early Goldwing replica bars. They have similar angles to the stock bars but have more rise and a little more pull back. Emgo 23-12544
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Here you can see how they look next to my stock bars.
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They look really wide in the photos but they are just one inch wider. Now don’t laugh.....but I also bought a set of foam handlebar grips. They’re not the most stylish grips you’ve ever seen, but I’m going for maximum comfort here.

A lot of these things are very personal choices, handlebars are almost like starting an oil thread! I know a lot of guys like the low bars that let you lean into the wind. These handlebars are an experiment for me, I know from my cruiser days that sometimes when sit more upright, you shift problems to your lower back. Feel free to comment, but I’ve already bought everything. It’s just a matter of assembling.

I’ll post updates here as I get things together and when I do some road testing.
Stay tuned......
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keywords, highway pegs, handlebars, sprockets, gearing, chain, grips


B-O-B.

Why fix something what isn't broke ???
Your mate from Gondwanaland

Geedub
 
I am a huge fan of Guzzi’s , I look at them constantly. For me it’s all about that engine. I always said I’d own one someday, I rode a late model Guzzi at a dealership years ago and was hooked. I always thought an old 850 Eldorado would be a fun restoration project. Put a big old windshield on it and look like a highway patrol.
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G'day again Bob,

I also like the Guzzis however, When we used to go on rallies with them as a BMW rider they (the Guzzies) would advise us that our BMW's were just Guzzi's with saggy tits.
 
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Hello Fred,
I spent the day cleaning parts and stinking up my garage with kerosene fumes. I was feeling torn about replacing any of these components at all! They all came out in such remarkable shape, given their age and the mileage on the bike. The bushings look practically new and the pivot tube has some minor wear, but honestly I think I could throw the whole thing back together and most people would never feel the difference in handling.
- - - and maybe even polish my dipstick while I’m at it. :D
Later, Bob

Hi Bob,
Your bike photos make me writhe with envy at it's cleanliness, maybe enough that I'll clean mine this spring.
Nevertheless, it's best that you swap in an M16-ended throughbolt.
My own experience tells me that If you tighten the stock M14-ended one enough to lock the pivot tube in place it's end will snap off.
OR
Don't tighten it that hard and let the pivot tube move with the swingarm so the bike steers all sloppy like you've gotten used to from years of riding that way. You choose.
BTW, avoid polishing the bike's dipstick because it's matte finish holds the oil better.
Hand polish your own dipstick with perhaps a touch of vaselene.
 
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Ewww... :sick:
Yeah, I agree with the M16 bolt upgrade. I forgot who it was, but somebody wrote an article on here someplace, about doing that very same upgrade, complete with grease fittings (Was the Jim, maybe?). Like I said, as long as you've got it apart... Somebody else said "...if you have to take it apart to get to it, replace it..." Boulder Damn! My memory is shot! I read this stuff, I remember it, but I can't remember who wrote it! :banghead: Anything you can do to upgrade performance is a no-brainer. :rock:
 
Yeah, I agree with the M16 bolt upgrade. I forgot who it was, but somebody wrote an article on here someplace, about doing that very same upgrade, complete with grease fittings (Was the Jim, maybe?).
Nope... wasn't me. I don't feel the larger bolt is necessary. This whole wrung off bolt problem comes from incorrect assembly. The frame mounts for the swingarm are slightly wider than the steel bushing. To compensate, most people just keep cranking down on the bolt 'till it either sucks the frame mounts in to cinch the bushing down.... or shear the head off the bolt. Neither outcomes are good. A sheared bolt is obvious but sucking the frame in ain't good either. Pulling the frame in throws off the alignment of the mount holes... and that ain't good. The correct way to do it is to shim the bushing so it's a slight interference fit in the frame. Once you have that, there's no need to crank on the bolt 'till it sheers. On my SG, I'm actually using about 10lbs less torque than called for and the rear is plenty solid.

If you want to upgrade to the 16mm bolt, go right ahead. It doesn't hurt anything 'cept the wallet.... but done correctly, it's not really necessary. Where you at @gggGary ? I need some backup here. ;)
 
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I have put bronze bushings in 5 Xs650's and have never had a problem with the bolt. I have always tightened to about 1/2 of final torque, pumped grease in until it came out everywhere,reassembled everything except the shocks and then checked smooth operation and freeplay. Installed the shocks, lowered the bike and then torqued to final setting.
 
Yeah, I’m still on the fence regarding replacement parts, everything is in such good condition. New bronze bushings for sure. But beyond that......:shrug:

No work being done here for a short while. Gotta catch up on some honey do’s and we have relatives in town.
 
On my SG, I'm actually using about 10lbs less torque than called for and the rear is plenty solid.
I'm right there with you on the most recent swingarm installation. In the case of the 79 components which were very dry and stuck. After thoroughly cleaning the pivot tube on a lathe and measuring end clearance in the frame with feeler gauges I determined to use no shim in this case. Manufacturing variances must be a factor in the spacing. Anyway, upon installation I too raised and lowered the swingarm while greasing and tightening the nut. It was decided a light torque was all that was necessary at least for now.
And about the bronze bushings ? A very popular upgrade which can also contribute to improper fitment depending on the very bushings purchased. Those should be measured for flange thickness and compared to the original bushing. I actually believe most guys buy the bronze bushings because the fragile original bushings were destroyed during disassembly. I have saved originals and have a spare set even as I consider those perfectly usable. Realize I have access every work day to - bronze, a lathe, and all the measuring tools and when it came time to make my own ? Pass, unnecessary unless you are building a flat tracker or track bike. That's my opinion. The pivot tube itself was more tempting to make.
-R
 
Nope... wasn't me. I don't feel the larger bolt is necessary. This whole wrung off bolt problem comes from incorrect assembly. The frame mounts for the swingarm are slightly wider than the steel bushing. To compensate, most people just keep cranking down on the bolt 'till it either sucks the frame mounts in to cinch the bushing down.... or shear the head off the bolt. Neither outcomes is good. A sheared bolt is obvious but sucking the frame in ain't good either. Pulling the frame in throws off the alignment of the mount holes... and that ain't good. The correct way to do it is to shim the bushing so it's a slight interference fit in the frame. Once you have that, there's no need to crank on the bolt 'till it sheers. On my SG, I'm actually using about 10lbs less torque than called for and the rear is plenty solid.

If you want to upgrade to the 16mm bolt, go right ahead. It doesn't hurt anything 'cept the wallet.... but done correctly, it's not really necessary. Where you at @gggGary ? I need some backup here. ;)
:agree:

Long afore ole James was hang'n round these parts, I was the voice in the wilderness saying exactly what he says!

That exact issue seems to be more common in the later specials. It might be a fixture wear problem. Factory building fixtures wear out when thousands of assemblies are built in them. Often the end of a model run is due to fixturing needing replacement $$$.
 
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