So git 'er Done

Even though you didn't allow the kick shaft to come out completely, I think it popped out enough to screw up the return spring install. I think you'll need to start over with it and do a proper install from scratch. It's not difficult although it does baffle many. See post #8 here .....

http://www.xs650.com/threads/how-the-hell-does-this-kicker-shaft-work.25602/

I must caution you against following some of the techniques shown in the video posted later in the above thread. Grabbing a splined shaft with pliers is a very, very bad idea. Please don't do that, lol.

Thanks @5twins. That's the exact technique I found using search, but better explained and documented.

Full of confidence now.

Took a few hours to get back in there and out again with the side pegs, brake lever and kickstart back on. It was a three handed job to get the exhaust back on but after a bit of a head scratch an old tie with a loop on either end became my "third" arm. Good job too because when fitted it looked as if the suspension might graze it. So after some cursing and fruitless adjustment off it came to be re-fitted. It was easier the second time and no interference. The mysteries of 40 year old bikes, eh?

(maybe the motorcycle gods were telling me. "You said you would wire brush the exhaust studs and put copper slip on them... and you forgot to do it.")

BUT pleased to report the kickstart problem was what I'd dreaded, but using @5twins / @XSLeo 's technique it was an absolute doddle.

Mysteriously, the right side of the bike is looking a lot cleaner than before. Most of the grease and grime is on me.

(1977 Xs650D) Bike Stalling on 1st Gear, Clutch Engaging....

@MadHatch has posted about his clutch problems and much to my horror I read @5twins post about aligning the dots on the clutch basket.



I just put it all back as it was before and did some checking that the washers and spacers were all actually there and in the right order. I knew this assembly sequence was an issue. But I didn't align the dots.

Everything seems to work fine and once I'd worked all the slack out of the cable bar bar a safety margin I can select neutral acceptably. Gear changing is fine too.

I've about a dozen miles on the bike just to shake stuff down. Everything seems fine. Should I stop immediately what I'm doing and have it apart?

Dave, I had awful problems with the clutch on my XS. The bike ran but terrible problems with slip and trying to get the clutch adjusted. In the end it was all down to PO having assembled the clutch wrongly with those dots not aligned.

In fact, when I dismantled the clutch and found that was the case, http://www.xs650.com/members/twomanyxs1bs.14703/ said he has never seen one not aligned that works at all.

Here's the relevant bit of the Miss November thread, its post #458:

http://www.xs650.com/threads/miss-november-xs2-tribute.55057/page-23#post-608332

So, based on the problems I had, would recommend doing the clutch again. Sorry.

No worries @Raymondo. I sort of knew that for my own peace of mind I'd end up doing it again.

Well I took @Raymondo 's advice and dropped the oil and whipped the clutch cover off. I dragged my feet on the way to the garage but it didn't take above half an hour and that included selecting the sound track. (Jethro Tull).

Turns out I could see the dimple through the hole. But I took the clutch pressure plate off just to make sure. And I marked it with a marker pen just to make sure what I was seeing was the dimple and not an optical illusion. You can see it here.



BUT

Whats the wire holding the last plate in? It looks like its supposed to be there. Has channels cut for it. I discovered it when I spotted a nasty tangle of wire in the clutch basket which I was just about to extract with a pair of pliers. I can't see it in the parts explosion.



Also, The Partzilla fiche doesn't show a lock washer.

https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/yamaha/motorcycle/1975/xs650b/clutch-tx650a-xs650b-c

but I've now spotted them in photos on the forum. So, I've one on order. (Yambits).

Perhaps I should go to Las Vegas and throw dice.

Aha!

Ring- Clutch Boss (retaining wire) - What is this?

Maybe I have the later clutch. I'll have to count clutch plates.

Yes, someone has swapped in a later clutch, or at least the inner hub. It's an easy swap and a good one. That later inner hub with the dampened bottom plate engages smoother.

Yes, the lock washer set-up on yours is wrong, probably the old lock washers from the original inner hub. That later hub uses the type that folds up against the side of the nut, similar to what's on your countershaft sprocket. Here's mine not folded against the nut yet. You can see it has tabs that lock into notches in the clutch hub .....

Thanks @5twins, That's reassuring.

Clutch dogs have a bit of wear on them. .....Arrows show the bumps, these can be filed down. Not so much that they are smooth because you don't want to take any more of the basket, just enough to take the tops off and smooth down the ridges.........Your steel plates could have a sharp edge smoothed as well. You'll find one side of the steel plates is sharp and the other may not be.......... I lightly filed each individual groove, (helps to atop the plates from grabbing when in action),on all the plates but others have easier less time consuming ways..........

Thank you @650Skull . You have eagle eyes and I'm very grateful for the help. Could this explain difficulty in selecting neutral? Seems logical to me. I'll attend to it next oil change. I thought I had dodged this bullet but after a ride long enough to properly warm it up it does it. That'll teach me for being smug.

@5twins, the locking washer I waited for (Yambits UK for reference) had the tabs but not the "ears" to fold over.

When stripped the clutch to do the electric start I made sure I had everything to hand, including the correct socket for the clutch basket nut. But after getting into it I found that the nut was not the size I was expecting. There are three different sizes? Is that right? So maybe what I have is for a smaller nut. But its a long way too small to fold anything over.

Thanks guys.

Dave

The rear brake light wasn't working. It turned out to be loose / dirty bullet connectors. So, while I was on, I cleaned up the switch, replaced the tatty electrical tape with heat shrink tubing and put a couple of electrical ties on to hold it safe.

Dammit, nothing lasts. Its only 45 years old. My wipe over with an oily rag must have been the last straw.



Dave

Yes, it seems different sized nuts were used to retain the inner basket and I'm not sure there's any way to tell what you'll find until you get in there. So far, I've run across 3 sizes - 27, 28, and 29mm.

DaveO said:

Dammit, nothing lasts. Its only 45 years old.

Click to expand...

Long time, no see.

Working from home gave me some time in the garage. So last year, I got my bike on the road. I did some runs out to local places on the coast but as things got busier (and colder) the bike was relegated to the garage. I've had several configurations of the choke/enrichener and was not happy with them. So I did this and I forgot to post about it.

Might help someone out for an EX500 carb install.








The choke is from eBay for a Yamaha dirt bike or something. Bracket was make with a vice, drill and hand file from a bit of scrap aluminium.

(note to self - get some shoes for my vice)

I also replaced one of the enricheners. The original one had a crooked button and when I tried to straighten it, it snapped off. Pretty predictable really in hindsight, but live and learn (or maybe not).

There's a joke on the internet that consists of two diary entries, one his and one hers. The woman's diary entry is long and heartfelt and mostly about how the man is moody and seems distant. The mans diary is short and to the point. "Bloody bike won't start."

Well, the bike goes great and the carbs are fine. I'm chuffed with the EX500 carb conversion.

But if I'm honest and I think I've been trying to ignore and deny it ... Its not a great starter. It used to start great before the carb swap. A slight crack of the throttle and a couple of kicks and it was away. Now it starts on the electric foot, but rarely without a lot of effort on the kickstart. As I say, I have been in denial. But it struck me that the only bit of the wiring I haven't pulled all the bullets apart and rewired and soldered is the Boyer ignition. Its all new. I only just fitted it. "Yeah, twenty years ago." says my monkey. It struck me lying in bed. So, I had a little look this morning.

I'm not exactly sure what a good spark should look like but I'm sure it should be fat and blue and not a little twinkle. I've got 12.34V at the battery and 11.79V at the live feed into to BB. So, its dropping a half a volt through the ignition switch, kill switch and any wiring. No, difference if I use the point where the BB earths or direct to the battery pole. So the earths are good. I wouldn't have thought half a volt would be a disaster but what do I know?

I've got non-resistor plugs in (a new set), copper core HT leads. So I'll remake the plug cap connection and test the plug caps next. I'm assuming they will have a resistance.

Can't do any more today but any thoughts would be welcome.

Hope everyone had a great Easter weekend.

Dave