UPDATE: my Phase 3 COVID19 vaccine trial experience

...and one more last thing before I go, since my initial comment helped start this dust storm. The nurse yesterday evening told me my Dad made an ever so slight improvement yesterday. She says don't give up hope just yet. He put up with raising me for 17 yrs. So obviously he's a tough ol' bastard. ;)
 
...and one more last thing before I go, since my initial comment helped start this dust storm. The nurse yesterday evening told me my Dad made an ever so slight improvement yesterday. She says don't give up hope just yet. He put up with raising me for 17 yrs. So obviously he's a tough ol' bastard. ;)
hang in there dad! Jim's needs a few more of your words of wisdom
Before my dad dies he always , always tried to head me in the right direction and didn't laugh to hard when I would fail miserably
Hang in there Dad!!
 
hang in there dad! Jim's needs a few more of your words of wisdom
Before my dad dies he always , always tried to head me in the right direction and didn't laugh to hard when I would fail miserably
Hang in there Dad!!
Time for me to finish the Bob Woodward book RAGE
The library is running out of books for me (I'm desperate if I'm even reading this one)
Maybe I'll just go out to the garage and finish up my heating project
Go KC
 
Cuz your rights, ARE this nation? ...
That is a key insight. If individual rights are absent, then what is being defended? What is the difference between the U.S. and China? A soldier's job is to unquestioningly defend. It's the job of all the rest of us is ensure what they're defending is worth defending, that is continues its mission of being a shining something on a hill in the world of darkness or something to be poetic :).

If you want to get vaccinated you can be, and then you're protected. Where's the problem? Well, there's the 5% hole. I guess you take the brand new mortality rate I think it is, (not case fatality rate) after some percentage is vaccinated and see how it compares with other risks, ones we consider acceptable.
 
That is a key insight. If individual rights are absent, then what is being defended? What is the difference between the U.S. and China? A soldier's job is to unquestioningly defend.
There's an irony here.... The first day of boot camp, the soldier gets about 10 shot in each arm. Your "right" to not be vaccinated is gone.... bam bam... next.
So here's a thought... lets declare war on this virus. We can declare a war on drugs... poverty.... you name it, we've declared war on it at some time or another. Now... be a good soldier and get your vaccine. Hooah!! :D
 
There's an irony here.... The first day of boot camp, the soldier gets about 10 shot in each arm.
I'd suppose, if the new recruit is an anti-vaxxer and makes a fuss, he/she will simply be shown where the exit gate is.
Hmmm.... I don't think that would go down too well if the draft ever came back in. Too much of an easy out, there.
 
I'm going to throw my 2 cents in.
First I will get the shot when it's my turn. But I do not think anyone should be forced to get it against their will.
I think a unwritten right we have in the US is the right to be stupid.
What's it gonna take to get through to you first amendment zealots that the good of the nation is more important than your choice?
does personal freedom outweigh the good of the country?
One problem I see is the good of the country argument.
Taken to a extreme the Super Bowl should be canceled. It is the biggest home party day of the year. Could end up causing super spreader events all over the country. For the good of the country maybe the Chiefs should forfeit.:(
 
First I will get the shot when it's my turn. But I do not think anyone should be forced to get it against their will.
Completely agree. I'm not advocating "forced vaccination." What I'm try to do is change minds (good luck with that :rolleyes:). Don't think of it as losing a right, think of it as doing your part for the greater good.

One problem I see is the good of the country argument.
Taken to a extreme....
I think that's a false equivalency. Asking people to get vaccinated isn't extreme in my opinion. Extremes are seldom good options. Yes, "forced vaccination" would be extreme. Cancelling the Superbowl would be extreme. Again, I'm all about changing minds.
 
Completely agree. I'm not advocating "forced vaccination." What I'm try to do is change minds (good luck with that :rolleyes:). Don't think of it as losing a right, think of it as doing your part for the greater good.


I think that's a false equivalency. Asking people to get vaccinated isn't extreme in my opinion. Extremes are seldom good options. Yes, "forced vaccination" would be extreme. Cancelling the Superbowl would be extreme. Again, I'm all about changing minds.
:agree:
 
Asking people to get vaccinated isn't extreme in my opinion.
Informing people with prudent facts as to why they should get the shot is what needs to be done. Then they can make a informed decision. It needs to be their decision.
Using the "good of the country" argument rubs me the wrong way. History is littered with governments using that argument to justify doing bad things.
 
Using the "good of the country" argument rubs me the wrong way. History is littered with governments using that argument to justify doing bad things.
Insert whatever language you will... it's still a common sense argument. More vaccinations means less cases. Less cases means more back to normal. If there's a fallacy to that logic, I'm not seeing it?
 
I'm way out of town again this weekend. Catching up here seeing different perspectives on vaccination. Although some do get upset over different lifestyles (mine), opinions, or reasoning.
I cannot apologize for being myself and simply passing on my own perspectives as well. I am 58 years old by the way and still going for it.
What does bother me is when my choice to continue living and working full time, traveling on weekends, supporting businesses needing customers, and going anywhere I please becomes an opportunity to attempt to share or guilt this behavior as a Covid spreader. Wrong. I Do Not Have Covid. I have not had any Covid symptoms. I am not ill at all.. I am Not spreading Covid and personally, have little reason to fear Covid.(within reason)
By now I have known quite a few co workers who have stayed home (company policy) after Covid exposure or even testing positive. Note taken, my personal examples in my own circle were fortunately not physically threatened by Covid in any way.
Anyway, I only contribute anything on XS650.com via cell phone key pad. Thus really never post lengthy posts.
Pics are way more fun for sure :)
So here are a few. In the last two days I've been a customer at several restaurants as well which are "open" while traveling.. Im out exploring some of Eastern Washington.
I am clearly very fortunate and aware of this to be able to keep living this lifestyle.
-R
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:lmao:
Wish I were sharing current XS650 experiences but unfortunately my XS's are being prepared for a move of over 200 miles to hopefully better circumstances away from the west coast cities.
 

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Insert whatever language you will... it's still a common sense argument. More vaccinations means less cases. Less cases means more back to normal. If there's a fallacy to that logic, I'm not seeing it?
No argument that the vaccine is not a good thing. I just don't like the "good of the country" argument. Nobody should be pressured into putting something in to their body that they do not want. What would you say if you were told you have to eat a serving of spinach every day because it's good for you? I like spinach but I would not like to be was told I had to eat it for "the good of the country".
 
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I'm way out of town again this weekend. Catching up here seeing different perspectives on vaccination. Although some do get upset over different lifestyles (mine), opinions, or reasoning.
I cannot apologize for being myself and simply passing on my own perspectives as well. I am 58 years old by the way and still going for it.
What does bother me is when my choice to continue living and working full time, traveling on weekends, supporting businesses needing customers, and going anywhere I please becomes an opportunity to attempt to share or guilt this behavior as a Covid spreader. Wrong. I Do Not Have Covid. I have not had any Covid symptoms. I am not ill at all.. I am Not spreading Covid and personally, have little reason to fear Covid.(within reason)
By now I have known quite a few co workers who have stayed home (company policy) after Covid exposure or even testing positive. Note taken, my personal examples in my own circle were fortunately not physically threatened by Covid in any way.
Anyway, I only contribute anything on XS650.com via cell phone key pad. Thus really never post lengthy posts.
Pics are way more fun for sure :)
So here are a few. In the last two days I've been a customer at several restaurants as well which are "open" while traveling.. Im out exploring some of Eastern Washington.
I am clearly very fortunate and aware of this to be able to keep living this lifestyle.
-R
View attachment 184465
View attachment 184469
:lmao:
Wish I were sharing current XS650 experiences but unfortunately my XS's are being prepared for a move of over 200 miles to hopefully better circumstances away from the west coast cities.

In Australia except for the odd time the pathogen has escaped quarantine and there is local lock-downs. The last is in progress and it is for 5 days and so far there are no local transmissions from the close contacts of the carrier. Besides the odd inconvenience life is as normal as can be with social distancing, hand sanitizing, and some limits on attendances to public gatherings, like movie theaters, concerts, sports crowds, ect. State Boarders do have restrictions when there are outbreaks, More and more, as these are controlled and understood, the restrictions are less restive in the time they are closed. Usually closed to the population that resides an the area of the outbreak where they are aggressively testing contact areas.

The testing is done through the app and close contacts are tracked down. but people who have visited contact areas/places are asked to get tested on a voluntarily bases.. The general public are on board and there are sometime 3 hours or more delays for these people waiting to get tested. Complaints are few and far between. ..........Compliant......Maybe. But for a short inconvenience 99.9% of Australians are more than happy to suffer the short sharp situation, knowing that the freedoms we have due to not having Covid-19 in the community and the vigorous controls in-place at the boarder, (yes the boarder is open to Australians returning home with the covid virus and to people who are granted permission to travel overseas and back), where overseas visitors, in a restricted capacity, some to make a movie, tennis players, and other sports people and business and some govt people.

There are people who are complacent, some are anti-VAXes or just disbelievers. Nothing, or nobody to make you feel guilty about here, if we want to travel about. Our neighbors and loved ones can be visited safely, holidays can be taken, may be some restrictions on places or at times to be able to visit an area for short times.

The big thing is, on a general basis we are safe, and are not having our friends and neighbors getting sick and dying.

This is not a statement of, we are better than you, or glee. .................

Some will say we have no independence or have given up our rights. nothing could be further from that truth......... We help each other by helping ourselves, or you could say that the-other way round and it is still true. Compassion and empathy does not mean we loose individuality, independence or or rights

My heartfelt sympathies and condolences to anyone who is going through the trauma of having to deal with sick friends or family
 
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No argument that the vaccine is not a good thing. I just don't like the "good of the country" argument. Nobody should be pressured into putting something in to their body that they do not want. What would you say if you were told you have to eat a serving of spinach every day because it's good for you? I like spinach but I would not like to be was told I had to eat it for "the good of the country".

Sorry i don;t think a spinach/food analogy has any bearing on a world wide pandemic that is causing, and will i some cases cause, the economic and social collapse of our society.

A company who has a workforce of 100 people and they deal with the public. 30 of them refuse to get vaccinated........Does the company have the right to protect the public who want to come into their store ............. how can they do that when 30% of their customer relations people refuse.

1; Does the company close down and all 100 people get put out of work and all other people who rely on that business as part of their business.

2; give those 30% an incentive to get a vaccination, be it through a monetary incentive or some other way.

3; give that 30 the choice to comply or leave.....does the company have that right to ask if it means protecting their customers.

with a vaccination program in place, The public has a right to know if their public relations person has been vaccinated. If they haven't then how will that effect the companies ability to compete and retain their customers. .........I guess it comes back to that question.........does the rights of a few out-way the rights of the many.

If a company can be sued because they employ UN-vaccinated staff, (if they cant sack them as is the staffs right to refuse vaccination), and one if them transmits covid-19 to a customer.....Who is liable...... or maybe the UN-vaccinated people should have to take out public liability to retain their rights and putt the onus back on them, in such a scenario
 
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Sorry i don;t think a spinach/food analogy has any bearing on a world wide pandemic that is causing, and will i some cases cause, the economic and social collapse of our society.

A company who has a workforce of 100 people and they deal with the public. 30 of them refuse to get vaccinated........Does the company have the right to protect the public who want to come into their store ............. how can they do that when 30% of their customer relations people refuse.

1; Does the company close down and all 100 people get put out of work and all other people who rely on that business as part of their business.

2; give those 30% an incentive to get a vaccination, be it through a monetary incentive or some other way.

3; give that 30 the choice to comply or leave.....does the company have that right to ask if it means protecting their customers.

with a vaccination program in place, The public has a right to know if their public relations person has been vaccinated. If they haven't then how will that effect the companies ability to compete and retain their customers. .........I guess it comes back to that question.........does the rights of a few out-way the rights of the many.

If a company can be sued because they employ UN-vaccinated staff, (if they cant sack them as is the staffs right to refuse vaccination), and one if them transmits covid-19 to a customer.....Who is liable...... or maybe the UN-vaccinated people should have to take out public liability to retain their rights and putt the onus back on them, in such a scenario

You are forgetting one thing. If you have been vaccinated what is the problem. It's the un-vaccinated people that will have the problem.
 
Not forgetting at all......The experts still don't know how the vaccine is going to work as a whole. ...... They think vaccinated people will be be carriers. with the new strains and other mutations that haven't happened, (longer it takes to vaccinate the more it will mutate and poor countries are not getting access to the vaccines or will in the distant future, so it stands to reason that more mutations will happen), If 90% of the population get vaccinated it is supposed to trigger a herd response.......problem is of the 90% of the vaccinated only, (depending on the vaccine), 60-93%, of the 90%, are getting antibodies from inoculation. If it is a 2 jab vaccine then a person is still susceptible to the virus before the second jab, (6 weeks or more), and can get sick and transmit. The % of non vaccinated and those that don't get the anti bodies means the virus is going to be circulating in the community.............now back to the 30 employers who refuse to get vaccinated, and the consequences.......

Personally, I think the vaccinations are going to crate a false sense of security. There will be carriers. If international boarders open up, Stamp on your passport, having been vaccinated these carriers are going to get past the barriers and infect..........Mutations will run rampant until the vaccinations are tweaked.......will some die.....who knows but one only has to look how these new mutations have changed the demographics of who get infected, the rate of transitions, to come to the conclusion we haven't got control at all
 
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I think the problem as a whole is people are spoiled, selfish and easily led down the path of least resistance. It’s the “ Me, me,me” generation. Just sayin.....Nothing is certain and until we achieve “ Herd Immunity” there will always be something popping up, vaccination or not. Will I get one? Absolutely.
 
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Update:
I got an unexpected call from the clinic handling the Phase Three J&J trial that I am enrolled in. They wanted to know if I wanted to get the vaccine. They explained that if I came in, they would "unblind" me -- see if I got the vaccine or placebo, and then, if I got placebo, they would give me the real vaccine. So, I said sure, and went in. It turns out that I got the real vaccine back in November. Before I as unblinded, it was like my other visits -- they drew blood and interviwed me. They also did a nasal swab -- my first since my initial visit. I think they went in my nose about an inch shallower than the first swab -- it wasn't nearly as bad.
I am still part of the trial, which is scheduled to last two years. In order to asses long-term efficacy of the vaccine. My visits are becoming further and further apart. I've had 5 so far since November, but I'm not due again until December.
 
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