tonyc
XS650 Guru
I received my California pink slip for title of my 76 within two weeks. As I mentioned a painless procedure. Good look to all.
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Barn find registration in California
- Thread starter Xumi
- Start date
RpNSht
XS650 Addict
my bike Calling All Destroyers is pretty much done. i received great news today. i finally received the paper work from the guy who know a guy who has a friend that was able to get the bike in my name. as suspected a mechanical / storage lien was put on the bike and as a result the bike was put into the name of the guy i know. forms came with the paper work that allows the lien holder to sell the bike to a new buyer.
the forms are all in my name and i will have to visit aaa or dmv for the next step. im going to try with aaa but im foreseeing that i will be visiting the dmv regardless.
the forms are all in my name and i will have to visit aaa or dmv for the next step. im going to try with aaa but im foreseeing that i will be visiting the dmv regardless.
Chris Potempa
XS650 New Member
Hi Everyone --
Even though this thread is a year old already, I want to add to it because it was instrumental in getting my own machine titled and registered here in California. And as anyone who's doing a Google search using keywords such as "California", "titling", "barn find", etc. will find, this thread will be one of the very first of search results to come up. So whether you have an XS650 or, in my case, a 1937 Sunbeam Model 9 (an old British thumper) hopefully this will be a benefit to all by at least saving others the expense of using a titling service which is just a waste of money. I'm going to relate my experience with a few additional thoughts if any:
I bought my 'bike from a really old miner-type guy up north with not only no existing paperwork, but not even a license plate as well. To make things more difficult, whether it's a domestic or foreign make from back in the day, what passed for a VIN# won't be anything like what the DMV clerks are used to seeing now (since 1982?). In my case both frame and engine numbers were only five digits and included both a dash and a slash. My big worry as a vintage 'bike enthusiast is the fear of the CHP disregarding the old numbers and instead whipping out a drill (NOOOOO!!!!!), pop rivet gun and attaching a new bright and shiny new aluminum VIN# plate to the frame or engine. Not only does it lower the value of your machine upon sale at some point hopefully long down the road, but it puts a kind of taint on it in the eyes of others as well. This shouldn't be a worry though if your machine is stock and shows no signs of major alterations.
The main thing I learned from this is to show up to the DMV with as much paperwork as you can throw at them. If you show up with simply a lost title form and the comment that it's been in your family forever and a day -- which may be true -- it'll be hard and the clerk will be immediately skeptical from the get-go. If there's no record on their system then, in the clerk's words, "We need to create a paper trail from scratch" and to do that, they love, love, love to see as many of their DMV forms as possible already filled out by you. That said, at a minimum all you need from the previous owner is a handwritten bill of sale. Get something from the former owner basically stating the year, make, model, frame and engine numbers, mileage (if known) and the price paid. Also a sentence or two stating that a search was done and the old paperwork and/or plate couldn't be found anywhere and is presumed lost. Finally, his/her signature. That's the minimum you need from the former owner. I also had the former owner sign a DMV-provided blank bill of sale form (form 135) and a power of attorney form (form 260) as well. The power of attorney form is overkill but a good thing to have since it authorizes you to conduct any unfinished business at the DMV counter that still requires the signature of the former owner. Good to have if the guy you bought your machine from is a nine hour drive north of where you now are.
So, take the above paperwork along with completed forms 343 (Application for Title), Statement of Facts (form 256) and a blank Vehicle Verification form (form 31) along with a blank check to the DMV and they'll then issue you a temporary registration, paid receipt, and an Application for Vehicle VIN# with the DMV clerk's signature already on it. This last one you'll have to take with you to the CHP to have the 'bike VIN# verified. Don't be freaked out by the title of the form -- it doesn't necessarily mean that they're already planning on attaching a dreaded aluminum tag to your 'bike, it's just to verify the existing VIN#.
Next, because in my case the Torrance CHP only take appointments, I had to wait two weeks before going there. Okay though as I already had my temporary registration so I could start riding now if I wanted. Before going to the CHP, make a photocopy of everything the DMV handed to you at your local library or Kinkos. Be prepared to hand your photocopies to the CHP officer which they will keep. Forever. The officer will then look at the numbers on your machine and then disappear into a back office somewhere verifying that what he's seen hasn't been reported stolen somewhere, sometime, someplace in the last century. Assuming all is legit (in my case there was no record anywhere), he'll finally come back out wiping the donut crumbs off his/ her uniform and hand back to you your original paperwork (again your copies of same which they keep) and a now completed and stamped Application for VIN# form. Take all of this back to the DMV and they'll issue you a registration and your new plate and tags. Title will show up about two weeks later in the mail.
Some notes:
Showing up to the DMV -- but much more so to the CHP -- with a book on the history of your make of 'bike lends you some credibility. In my case I had in a hand an out of print book on the history of Sunbeams which listed in the appendix what you could expect for frame and engines numbers for any particular year/ model. This was a small help at the CHP.
Know who you're buying from. If the person you're buying from ever balks at issuing you a bill of sale (and power of attorney if needed) written like I previously described or says that they'll mail it you later... run, don't walk, away with your money still in hand. Most of us think that statutes of limitation last for say, seven years or so. Not so with anything stolen. That same CHP guy told me of a guy who came in with a 'bike that he said had been sitting in his garage for just past eight years and he now wanted to get it all legally roadworthy again. The officer then did his thing and later came back reporting that not only was the 'bike reported stolen eight years ago, but that he now had the time to enjoy a longer conversation with said "owner".
If all of this sounds really long and complicated, it's really not. Aside from waiting times at both the DMV and CHP, I spent less than fifteen minutes at the counter of both places.
Actually having the 'bike with me was only required at the CHP office. The San Pedro and Torrance office DMV clerks could have cared less about actually getting out of their chairs to go outside and see it.
In summary, make sure you have a bill of sale from the former owner, completed forms 135, 256, 343, 260 (cover-your-ass backup Power of Attorney form -- optional) and a blank form 31 (which actually never ended up being used). DMV issues a temp registration followed by an appointment with the CHP and then immediately back to the DMV for registration and plate + tags followed by your permanent title in the mail a few weeks later.
As an aside, I've been buying and selling vintage and older motorcycles for my own use since the late 80s with and without titles here in my birth state of California and this seems to be the most up-to-date way things are now done. More of a hassle than the way it was done when I was 17 -- 31 years ago -- but still not as expensive or time consuming as having to use a title service.
Finally, a big thanks to the original poster -- Xumi -- who confirms for myself and others that this is how it's done now.
Even though this thread is a year old already, I want to add to it because it was instrumental in getting my own machine titled and registered here in California. And as anyone who's doing a Google search using keywords such as "California", "titling", "barn find", etc. will find, this thread will be one of the very first of search results to come up. So whether you have an XS650 or, in my case, a 1937 Sunbeam Model 9 (an old British thumper) hopefully this will be a benefit to all by at least saving others the expense of using a titling service which is just a waste of money. I'm going to relate my experience with a few additional thoughts if any:
I bought my 'bike from a really old miner-type guy up north with not only no existing paperwork, but not even a license plate as well. To make things more difficult, whether it's a domestic or foreign make from back in the day, what passed for a VIN# won't be anything like what the DMV clerks are used to seeing now (since 1982?). In my case both frame and engine numbers were only five digits and included both a dash and a slash. My big worry as a vintage 'bike enthusiast is the fear of the CHP disregarding the old numbers and instead whipping out a drill (NOOOOO!!!!!), pop rivet gun and attaching a new bright and shiny new aluminum VIN# plate to the frame or engine. Not only does it lower the value of your machine upon sale at some point hopefully long down the road, but it puts a kind of taint on it in the eyes of others as well. This shouldn't be a worry though if your machine is stock and shows no signs of major alterations.
The main thing I learned from this is to show up to the DMV with as much paperwork as you can throw at them. If you show up with simply a lost title form and the comment that it's been in your family forever and a day -- which may be true -- it'll be hard and the clerk will be immediately skeptical from the get-go. If there's no record on their system then, in the clerk's words, "We need to create a paper trail from scratch" and to do that, they love, love, love to see as many of their DMV forms as possible already filled out by you. That said, at a minimum all you need from the previous owner is a handwritten bill of sale. Get something from the former owner basically stating the year, make, model, frame and engine numbers, mileage (if known) and the price paid. Also a sentence or two stating that a search was done and the old paperwork and/or plate couldn't be found anywhere and is presumed lost. Finally, his/her signature. That's the minimum you need from the former owner. I also had the former owner sign a DMV-provided blank bill of sale form (form 135) and a power of attorney form (form 260) as well. The power of attorney form is overkill but a good thing to have since it authorizes you to conduct any unfinished business at the DMV counter that still requires the signature of the former owner. Good to have if the guy you bought your machine from is a nine hour drive north of where you now are.
So, take the above paperwork along with completed forms 343 (Application for Title), Statement of Facts (form 256) and a blank Vehicle Verification form (form 31) along with a blank check to the DMV and they'll then issue you a temporary registration, paid receipt, and an Application for Vehicle VIN# with the DMV clerk's signature already on it. This last one you'll have to take with you to the CHP to have the 'bike VIN# verified. Don't be freaked out by the title of the form -- it doesn't necessarily mean that they're already planning on attaching a dreaded aluminum tag to your 'bike, it's just to verify the existing VIN#.
Next, because in my case the Torrance CHP only take appointments, I had to wait two weeks before going there. Okay though as I already had my temporary registration so I could start riding now if I wanted. Before going to the CHP, make a photocopy of everything the DMV handed to you at your local library or Kinkos. Be prepared to hand your photocopies to the CHP officer which they will keep. Forever. The officer will then look at the numbers on your machine and then disappear into a back office somewhere verifying that what he's seen hasn't been reported stolen somewhere, sometime, someplace in the last century. Assuming all is legit (in my case there was no record anywhere), he'll finally come back out wiping the donut crumbs off his/ her uniform and hand back to you your original paperwork (again your copies of same which they keep) and a now completed and stamped Application for VIN# form. Take all of this back to the DMV and they'll issue you a registration and your new plate and tags. Title will show up about two weeks later in the mail.
Some notes:
Showing up to the DMV -- but much more so to the CHP -- with a book on the history of your make of 'bike lends you some credibility. In my case I had in a hand an out of print book on the history of Sunbeams which listed in the appendix what you could expect for frame and engines numbers for any particular year/ model. This was a small help at the CHP.
Know who you're buying from. If the person you're buying from ever balks at issuing you a bill of sale (and power of attorney if needed) written like I previously described or says that they'll mail it you later... run, don't walk, away with your money still in hand. Most of us think that statutes of limitation last for say, seven years or so. Not so with anything stolen. That same CHP guy told me of a guy who came in with a 'bike that he said had been sitting in his garage for just past eight years and he now wanted to get it all legally roadworthy again. The officer then did his thing and later came back reporting that not only was the 'bike reported stolen eight years ago, but that he now had the time to enjoy a longer conversation with said "owner".
If all of this sounds really long and complicated, it's really not. Aside from waiting times at both the DMV and CHP, I spent less than fifteen minutes at the counter of both places.
Actually having the 'bike with me was only required at the CHP office. The San Pedro and Torrance office DMV clerks could have cared less about actually getting out of their chairs to go outside and see it.
In summary, make sure you have a bill of sale from the former owner, completed forms 135, 256, 343, 260 (cover-your-ass backup Power of Attorney form -- optional) and a blank form 31 (which actually never ended up being used). DMV issues a temp registration followed by an appointment with the CHP and then immediately back to the DMV for registration and plate + tags followed by your permanent title in the mail a few weeks later.
As an aside, I've been buying and selling vintage and older motorcycles for my own use since the late 80s with and without titles here in my birth state of California and this seems to be the most up-to-date way things are now done. More of a hassle than the way it was done when I was 17 -- 31 years ago -- but still not as expensive or time consuming as having to use a title service.
Finally, a big thanks to the original poster -- Xumi -- who confirms for myself and others that this is how it's done now.
Mexiwop
XS650 Enthusiast
so today i just got my first yamaha xs (will start a thread soon)
2.5 hrs at the CA DMV and walked out with a titled/registered bike.
here is the story,
i bought a bike off a forum user here in northern california, im from southern california. owner 1a bought bike from owner 1 with no paper work. owner 2 bought from owner 1a with a bill of sale. (me) owner 3 bought from owner 2 with owner 1a's to owner 2's bill of sale. then i hada bill of sale/power of attorney from owner 2 to owner 3 (me). vehicle was still on dmv records with possibly owner 1's info. (i cant be certain because dmv doesnt release that info unless they are involved with the sale) bike had some small back fees due.
i tried to go to AAA but they sent me to the dmv.
waited in line to talk to the front desk clerk for a number. there she said it was no problem with owner 1a to owner 2 bill of sale, and the bill of sale/power of attorney from owner 2 to owner 3(me)
she proceeds to hand me a statement of facts form and a file for lost title form to fill out. (no previous owners signatures, just me)
after 2hrs i finally get up to the window and hand the lady all my paper work. after she looks at it she pulls up the fees and i sign them a check for $140. pick up my tags and head home.
i want to thank you guys for the info
. i believe the power of attorney made the difference
2.5 hrs at the CA DMV and walked out with a titled/registered bike.
here is the story,
i bought a bike off a forum user here in northern california, im from southern california. owner 1a bought bike from owner 1 with no paper work. owner 2 bought from owner 1a with a bill of sale. (me) owner 3 bought from owner 2 with owner 1a's to owner 2's bill of sale. then i hada bill of sale/power of attorney from owner 2 to owner 3 (me). vehicle was still on dmv records with possibly owner 1's info. (i cant be certain because dmv doesnt release that info unless they are involved with the sale) bike had some small back fees due.
i tried to go to AAA but they sent me to the dmv.
waited in line to talk to the front desk clerk for a number. there she said it was no problem with owner 1a to owner 2 bill of sale, and the bill of sale/power of attorney from owner 2 to owner 3(me)she proceeds to hand me a statement of facts form and a file for lost title form to fill out. (no previous owners signatures, just me)
after 2hrs i finally get up to the window and hand the lady all my paper work. after she looks at it she pulls up the fees and i sign them a check for $140. pick up my tags and head home.
i want to thank you guys for the info
. i believe the power of attorney made the difference
angus67
Welder's penetrate deeper!!
I hope my venture into this mysterious realm helps me title my Enduro xl250. I'm rebuilding the motor now, but keeping it cheep in case sht don't work out.
GunSlinger60
XS650 New Member
Thanks Xumi for the guidance on which forms to use. only thing that I might be able to add is the statement of facts box G. the DMV Clerk give me a Boiler plate Copy which had this exact verbage,
I purchased Vehicle on _______ from _______ it has been stored at ____________
the value of the vehicle is______. to the best of my knowledge there are ______ Liens.
Happy to say that everything worked out!
I purchased Vehicle on _______ from _______ it has been stored at ____________
the value of the vehicle is______. to the best of my knowledge there are ______ Liens.
Happy to say that everything worked out!
buzzword
XS650 Addict
Thanks for this post, OP! Very helpful.
The guy I got my bike from lost the Maine title he got from the original builder, so I went in with the following:
...and after a couple of hours, I now have a clean CA title and a cool retro black/yellow plate on the way.
Thanks again! Glad to find help like this on this site.
The guy I got my bike from lost the Maine title he got from the original builder, so I went in with the following:
- Notarized bill of sale from builder (A) to my friend who bought it (B)
- Expired Maine registration card from (A) - expired 03/2014
- Expired Maine license plate from (A) - expired 03/2014
- CA DMV Bill of Sale (Form REG 135) from (B) to me
- CA DMV Statement of Facts (Form 256) stating the bike was never registered in CA since it showed up from Maine in non-running condition, and was given to me as a gift by (B)
- CA DMV Power of Attorney (Form REG 260) from (B) which allows me to make decisions on behalf of (B) related to the titling of the bike in CA - NOTE: didn't wind up needing this, but it's a safe bet.
- CA DMV Application for Title (Form 343)
- CA Highway Patrol VIN Verification
- CA Bureau of Automotive Repair Brake and Lamp inspection certificates
...and after a couple of hours, I now have a clean CA title and a cool retro black/yellow plate on the way.
Thanks again! Glad to find help like this on this site.
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