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final rear chop fender mounting method

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by emzdogz, Jan 31, 2010.

  1. emzdogz

    emzdogz Aunty Em

    You'd think a flat trailer fender would be the easiest thing in the world to mount up and have look half way decent on a hardtailed frame, right?
    Wrong. Well at least for me. Tried a couple of different methods and always ended up unhappy with how far the fender was from the tire and with the radius of the fender not matching the wheel/tire.
    So I learned a way to slightly decrease the radius of the fender, by spreading the skirts outward. Worked pretty well and now at least it in the ballpark of the radius I want. Still need to even the skirts out. You can see in some places that it was not perfectly evenly pulled.
    So then I had to make mounts that would put the fender somewhat closer to the tire. I'm not a freak about this like some are...I can handle a bit of room between tire and fender but I really don't want to see daylight, when viewed from the side. Or at least not much daylight.

    So I welded a piece of angle iron going backward and up from the frame cross tube...the lowest one just in front of the back wheel. That gives me my bottom mount. On the higher crosstube - the one the back seat mounting bungs will attach to (probably) I welded coped threaded bungs to, at just the right angle. I was able to get them at just the right angle by mounting it first with this big u-clamp and spacers. So with it firmly in position I shoved, tapped the threaded bungs into position and tack welded them to the frame crosstube. Them I took it apart and welded them all the way around. Took lots of grinding to get those MIG welds looking halfway decent. Someday I would love to work with a TIG welder. anyway....
    So THEN I had to make holes in the fender that would match up with the newly welded-on bungs. THAT was hard and stupid and time-consuming. Ended up making extremely elongated holes to give me some play, to fit them.
    :doh:
    Then I welded washers over the elongated holes, to a. hide their ugliness and b. make a nice fitting hole for the bolts that hold fender to the bungs to go through.

    What I'm happiest with: how I got the coped bungs located and welded on. What I'm least happy with: the DUMB way I located the holes. I tried a bunch of stuff and measured and measured and they still ended up a good 3/16 off. A fender just isn't that easy to measure, as its curved both ways. :doh:

    The GOOD news is that the whole deal is hellaciously strong. Still need to figure out where I will cut the fender. Might make it shorter at both ends, or just at front bottom. Since I won't be carrying passengers its plenty strong that I don't need a mount at the very back. I may put one anyway...or I may not.

    Here's some pics.
    (I should win an award for the world's slowest-progressing chopper project)
    :yikes:

    http://s250.photobucket.com/albums/gg258/emzpublic/XS%2009/rear%20fender%20position%20mock%20up/back%20fender%20final%20mounts/
     
  2. inxs

    inxs xx

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    - time is an illusion...lunchtime doubly so

    ford prefect
     
  3. angus67

    angus67 Welder's penetrate deeper!!

    what welder are you using? if useing sheilded mig, try to let the weld puddle biuld up a little longer. I'm sure it will look fine once its gets all painted. just looks odd with all the grinder marks all over the place.
    My problem was I cant get the side to side centered over the tire. But after reading your post, elongateing the holes is the answere I was looking for. I'm using a front fender on the rear.
     
  4. emzdogz

    emzdogz Aunty Em

    hey Angus, yeah you may be right about letting puddle build. I notice my best welds are the ones where I can SEE the puddle real well...and of course if I take off and try to drag it too soon, well that ain't gonna happen. Its a Lincoln weld pac 100 with gas.
    Today I accidentally started welding without turning the bottle on....funny thing is sometimes it goes that way anyway. So I wonder if my gas supply is being blocked or something. Was better once I turned the bottle on, lol, but still not my best welds.'

    Are you the person who was gonna use a Special front fender on the back? I'd thought of trying that too.

    Good luck!'
    :) should be a really good look if you can make it work.
     
  5. angus67

    angus67 Welder's penetrate deeper!!

    Yeah, but I'm not the only one.
    That Lincoln is a good welder for this. Do you 'crack' the valve before you put your regulator on? What pressure you using? I'm at 35 CFH. You might not have your regulator up enuf. give it another 10.
    Also, did you make sure your polarity is correct? For some reason. when I first got my miller 180, I only had gas less wire, and when I finally got some gas, I forgot to switch the polarity. Thought I broke it. Then felt stupid when the graph on the cover literally smacked me in the head with the answer.[​IMG]:doh:
     
  6. emzdogz

    emzdogz Aunty Em

    Crack the valve? no....
    what does that mean? you mean like turn it on briefly then off again and then on?

    Polarity is set up correctly...I have gotten nice welds out of this thing before. I notice the more it is used, the better it works. But to come out after 2weeks of no use and turn it on and expect perfect regular operation, I guess that isn't going to happen.

    My regulator only shows one pressure level. When its off the needle is all the way at the bottom and when "on" it goes up to like 6:30 or 7 o'clock. Then when I tun it off the needle eventually settles back down. Its the kind with only one dial. Doesn't regulate a heck of a lot...might as well not have it. Dial recognizes no difference between full on and almost off.

    What I'm definitely going to do is when this project gets disassembled for final painting, I'll go over and scrutinize all the welds I did, do some additional grinding etc.
    It'll be easier to get at some of the parts I've welded on. In the position its in now, its really hard to get at the work in an effective position.

    As a beginning welder, right now, my only good welds are ones where I'm able to get really close up on the work and concentrate on having my hand in the correct angle, etc. Some of these places I've been trying to weld are pretty difficult.
    I really did think those washers would go on easier though.

    Anyway, time to move ON!
    This week I'll put the back wheel back on, figure out where I want the brake stay to attach to the frame, make a bracket for that and hopefully put the chain on the bike. Go ahead and bleed in the back brake.

    Then I can move on to making a place for the battery and electrical stuff.

    Lots to do!

    PS: what gas are you using?
     
  7. Gordon

    Gordon XS650 Junkie

    Aunty Em, he's suggesting that you open the tank briefly before you mount the regulator to clear any debris .
    As far as the machine not working so well after a period of time could be rust on the wire/ casing. Which would also cause the crappy welding, until 'clean' wire come's through. I clean mine a couple time's a year, & lube the wire channel up with PB Blaster. Not a whole lot, just enough to keep rust away.
    I know your budget is low, but you may need a new regulator. Sound's like there is a leak some where,too.
     
  8. emzdogz

    emzdogz Aunty Em

    thanks for the info, Gordon.
    :)
     
  9. angus67

    angus67 Welder's penetrate deeper!!

    even a cheap regulator sounds better than what you have. I dont meen to knock you.
    Yes, cracking the valve is when before ataching regulator, breifly open and close the valve. this makes sure you dont have any junk or critters in there so you dont blow them down the line . also, take out your liner, and make sure it isnt kinked or bent. If it is, it will studder, and burn up your tips , or shotgun your weld, blowing out your gas, leaving porous craters. Liners arent too expensive. mine are 35$. Also, make sure you have the straitest run of your cable . I dont know your experience with welding, so, I'm only trying to give suggestions. Not trying to flame you.
     
  10. emzdogz

    emzdogz Aunty Em

    Angus, thanks, really. I am a beginning welder.
    Took a (very) short class in arc (stick) welding a couple of years ago, but didn't really do anything with it until this project. My Dad gave me his Lincoln Weldpak as he was no longer using it and it is nearly new as far as "hours". But honestly, I think you're right about the regulator, the needle only moves about 5 degrees, even with knob turned all the way "on". And this is regardless of whether the tank is full or near empty.

    Thanks for info re: "cracking" tank. I actually did that, but I didn't really mean to, lol...whoosh! but I'm happy to know it was a good thing.
    The next thing I need to weld (well one of the next things) will be done off the bike, so I'll be in better position and can concentrate better. I'm also having probs seeing the puddle and I find that making sure the are I'm welding is well lit is helpful - also that I am wearing my glasses behind the mask.

    thanks again! this is all a learning process for me. The good thing is I firmly believe the minor welds I've ended up with so far are very strong. (I had the hardtail and raking of neck done by a pro)

    :)
     
  11. Gordon

    Gordon XS650 Junkie

    Aunty Em,
    What are you using for a helmet? I receintly got one from Harbor Freight that's auto darkening. I find that my weld's are much better because I don't have to move my head to lower the sheild anymore. And the $50 was well worth spent.
    If you got a little scrap metal around, pratice is allway's good to do. My welding, although I was a welder at a defence plant, (many year's ago), need to pratice before I attempt a criticle weld. It's all about flow, the metal flowing between the piece's your putting together. A good weld, imho,should be stronger then the metal. It take's some time to get good weld's, but it doe's get easier the more you do it. Kinda like sex, opp's, my bad.Just the fact you are attempting it make's me proud of you.

    P.S.,,,Thank You for the P.M.,,,it's people like you that make my world a better place.,,,Gordo:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
     
  12. weekendrider

    weekendrider Iron Horse cowboy Top Contributor

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    Sometimes it is cheaper/easier to rebuild the regulator than buy new?
     
  13. emzdogz

    emzdogz Aunty Em

    Gordon, good idea re: the helmet (mine is one of the thin plastic ultra cheapies that I'd bought when I took the class a couple years ago)
    Keeping my hand located just right when I pull the trigger and it first sparks, that is definately one of the bigger challenges. My hand tends to wanted to jump over a bit and not seeing well isn't helpful. Will have to take a trip over to H.F. I need other things from them anyway.

    Maybe even a regulator!
    :)

    but I kind of know what you mean about the flow with welding. You can just tell when you're getting that perfect "bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz" while you're doing it and not the snap crackle pop.
     
  14. emzdogz

    emzdogz Aunty Em

    thanks for the idea - will check it out next time I have to change the bottle.
     
  15. inxs

    inxs xx

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    - i find welding very meditative...emptying your head of lifes shit allows you to relax, this is when you click into the flow, the rest of the world has no place here...
     
  16. Gordon

    Gordon XS650 Junkie

    RICE KRISPY"S!!!!Mmmmm, good.
     
  17. angus67

    angus67 Welder's penetrate deeper!!

    how do you build a regulator? is it easy?
     
  18. Travis

    Travis Staff Member XS650.com Supporter

    Another welding tip.. Change your tips when they wear out. They get ovalized and make it hard to get a good bead. Also make sure you have a good ground. If your grounding clamp is hot, and it's not from being close to a weld, then you might not be getting a good ground.
     
  19. emzdogz

    emzdogz Aunty Em

    thanks, Travis!
     
  20. angus67

    angus67 Welder's penetrate deeper!!

    how did your fender turn out?
     

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