arod_1
XS650 Fan
Looks like a nice tank. I may order one. I have a hard time spending $40 for a tank liner fix that might work. Already has paint too. No need to paint it immediately. Thanks.
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My XS650 project, Deep South XS
- Thread starter ippytattoo
- Start date
-
- Tags
- build
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
It comes with a new petcock and cap as well so it is a package deal. I have no problems with it. When I took my old one to a welder he wanted $100 to braze the seam and pressure test it so this was a cheaper alternative for me.
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
Well I finally got my Ardtail and started the fab work on some of brake mounts:
Brake stay rod bolt welded and started blending
HHB Rear brake pivot and rear master cylinder mouting bracket
Also started on adapting the Keihin CVK carbs from a 2004 EX500 to my old girl:
Here you can see that the throttle cable is moved to in between the carbs rather on the outside of the left hand carb. The EX500 uses a dual throttle cable but has a return spring so my single cable works smooth as silk with no sticking.
Here you can see the idle adjustment screw under and in between the carbs (little black thumb screw)
Here you can see the modification the the upper rear support bar needed to clear the backbone.
Initial thoughts and observations on the EX500 carb swap:
1) As far as mechanical fitment the EX500 carbs are a direct replacement for the BS34's as far as the spigot and intake bell are concerned which means that the carb boots and filters do not need to be changed if you are currently running BS34's.
2) The choke on the EX500 carbs is a cable actuated choke so I had to come up with a creative solution using a little bit of ingenuity. Taking a page out of the BS34 play book I decided to use a spring and ball and created detents in the back side of the choke actuator. On the left hand carb there is an unused hole behind the actuator rod that worked perfectly for a spring and ball, using this hole I now have positive stops for no choke, half choke and full choke. When I take he carbs off for jetting changes I will get pics of the setup.
3) I knew that the jetting would need to be changed from reading the previous posts regarding this swap but wanted to see what it would do right out of the box. With these carbs fitted the bike starts and idles perfectly which really wasn't to much of a surprise as noboody mentioned having to change the pilot jets. Once I confirmed that the pilot circuit was operating at least acceptably and modifying my throttle cable for the new throttle pull position I took her out for a quick spin up and down my road and found that from idle up to about 4k rpms all was ok but at 4k it started breaking up pretty severely which from what I had read was really expected since everything I had read said that the mains need to be leaned out by 1-2 steps. I will have jets in hand tomorrow and will be doing jet swaps and tests to dial it in. The stock jets are 35 pilots and 130 mains. I ordered 38 pilots just for testing purposes and 122, 125 and 128 main jets to get her dialed in.
One thing I noticed is that the carbs weigh considerably less than the stock bs34's just by the weight in my hands. Also the CVK's have built in vaccum barbs which can either be used for vaccum petcocks or for carb sync making it an easy swap for people with bs38's using JBM carb boots.
All in all I think this could be a viable solution for replacement carbs using newer technology which also cleans up the look around the carbs quite a bit and this set of carbs cost only $140. A win win in my book.
Brake stay rod bolt welded and started blending
HHB Rear brake pivot and rear master cylinder mouting bracket
Also started on adapting the Keihin CVK carbs from a 2004 EX500 to my old girl:
Here you can see that the throttle cable is moved to in between the carbs rather on the outside of the left hand carb. The EX500 uses a dual throttle cable but has a return spring so my single cable works smooth as silk with no sticking.
Here you can see the idle adjustment screw under and in between the carbs (little black thumb screw)
Here you can see the modification the the upper rear support bar needed to clear the backbone.
Initial thoughts and observations on the EX500 carb swap:
1) As far as mechanical fitment the EX500 carbs are a direct replacement for the BS34's as far as the spigot and intake bell are concerned which means that the carb boots and filters do not need to be changed if you are currently running BS34's.
2) The choke on the EX500 carbs is a cable actuated choke so I had to come up with a creative solution using a little bit of ingenuity. Taking a page out of the BS34 play book I decided to use a spring and ball and created detents in the back side of the choke actuator. On the left hand carb there is an unused hole behind the actuator rod that worked perfectly for a spring and ball, using this hole I now have positive stops for no choke, half choke and full choke. When I take he carbs off for jetting changes I will get pics of the setup.
3) I knew that the jetting would need to be changed from reading the previous posts regarding this swap but wanted to see what it would do right out of the box. With these carbs fitted the bike starts and idles perfectly which really wasn't to much of a surprise as noboody mentioned having to change the pilot jets. Once I confirmed that the pilot circuit was operating at least acceptably and modifying my throttle cable for the new throttle pull position I took her out for a quick spin up and down my road and found that from idle up to about 4k rpms all was ok but at 4k it started breaking up pretty severely which from what I had read was really expected since everything I had read said that the mains need to be leaned out by 1-2 steps. I will have jets in hand tomorrow and will be doing jet swaps and tests to dial it in. The stock jets are 35 pilots and 130 mains. I ordered 38 pilots just for testing purposes and 122, 125 and 128 main jets to get her dialed in.
One thing I noticed is that the carbs weigh considerably less than the stock bs34's just by the weight in my hands. Also the CVK's have built in vaccum barbs which can either be used for vaccum petcocks or for carb sync making it an easy swap for people with bs38's using JBM carb boots.
All in all I think this could be a viable solution for replacement carbs using newer technology which also cleans up the look around the carbs quite a bit and this set of carbs cost only $140. A win win in my book.
XSJoel
XS650 Junkie
As usual, nice write up man. Keep up the progress so I have some motivation to do something.
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
OK I got my jets in tonight and tried to do a little tuning and here is what I got:
Stock 130 mains
1) Starts and idles good
2) Accelerates good up to about 4k at about half throttle then starts to stumble and break up. With WOT it falls flat on it's face at about 3.5k but will recover if I roll off the throttle to about 3/4.
3) Crackling/popping out exhaust (open exhaust) on deceleration.
So I swapped out the mains for a 128 (1 size leaner from the stock 130)
1) No change.
2) Slight change which seemed for the worse. Falls flat at about 3-3.5k with WOT.
3) No change.
Swapped in the 125 mains (2 sizes leaner from stock)
1) No change.
2) Change for the worse. Falls Flat on it's face at about 2.5-3k but will still recover if I roll back to just above half throttle and then horrible above 4.5k even at part throttle.
3) No change.
Swapped in the 132 mains (1 size richer from stock)
1) No change.
2) Better. I can pull WOT with a little stumbling in mid range but will pull through and accelerate to about 6.5k (all the room I have on the road I am on).
3) No change.
So here is what I am thinking I need to do (correct me if I am wrong):
1) get some 135 & 138 mains (2 & 3 up from stock) and test those
2) put in 38 pilots (1 up from stock)
3) possibly shim the needle as they do not have clips and grooves for adjustment
Stock 130 mains
1) Starts and idles good
2) Accelerates good up to about 4k at about half throttle then starts to stumble and break up. With WOT it falls flat on it's face at about 3.5k but will recover if I roll off the throttle to about 3/4.
3) Crackling/popping out exhaust (open exhaust) on deceleration.
So I swapped out the mains for a 128 (1 size leaner from the stock 130)
1) No change.
2) Slight change which seemed for the worse. Falls flat at about 3-3.5k with WOT.
3) No change.
Swapped in the 125 mains (2 sizes leaner from stock)
1) No change.
2) Change for the worse. Falls Flat on it's face at about 2.5-3k but will still recover if I roll back to just above half throttle and then horrible above 4.5k even at part throttle.
3) No change.
Swapped in the 132 mains (1 size richer from stock)
1) No change.
2) Better. I can pull WOT with a little stumbling in mid range but will pull through and accelerate to about 6.5k (all the room I have on the road I am on).
3) No change.
So here is what I am thinking I need to do (correct me if I am wrong):
1) get some 135 & 138 mains (2 & 3 up from stock) and test those
2) put in 38 pilots (1 up from stock)
3) possibly shim the needle as they do not have clips and grooves for adjustment
XSJoel
XS650 Junkie
Nice little surprise there.
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
Got a little more done today on my hardtail after helping my kids with their vehicles: put in new lower control arm on my daughters car and put the motor back in my sons zx-6r
Here are some current shots:
Here are some current shots:
arod_1
XS650 Fan
Did you get your carbs tuned in? Curious how that turned out.
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
I'm waiting on some larger main jets which should be here tuesday. I put in the larger pilots and which definitely calmed down the popping/crackling on decel, shimmed the needles 1 step as they are not adjustable the normal way with the clip. I should have them all sorted tuesday or wednesday.
arod_1
XS650 Fan
I have a bike that will pull strong through the gears, idles fine, starts good. It's one problem is when cruising at about 3-4K, if you throttle it, it will stumble a little then catch and pull hard. Opening the fuel screw a liitle helps, but that's a band aid and doesn't cure it completely. I'm going to pull it apart today and either bump the mains up one size or shim the needles. Not sure which yet. It's not my XS, but I'm trying to learn from your experience. I guess it could be float height too, but I checked them before and they were right on.
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
I got a little more fab done on my Ardtail.
Got the electronics box fabbed up and mounted to the tail:
Got the Rear brake reservoir mounted:
Got the electronics box fabbed up and mounted to the tail:
Got the Rear brake reservoir mounted:
TurboFarviknugn
XS650 Addict
Where did you get that key switch ?
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
It was actually from one of the car washes I do service work for but I have seen them online somewhere. I'll have to do a little research and find it again and I will post a link for you.
here is the link to the type of switch I have
http://jmlock.com/chicago-ace-ii-7-pin-tumbler-switch-lock.aspx
here is the link to the type of switch I have
http://jmlock.com/chicago-ace-ii-7-pin-tumbler-switch-lock.aspx
Last edited:
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
Got a little more done on Deep South XS today. I got the rear fender mounts done and Kikker 5150 rear fender mounted, still need to fab the fender struts.
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
Just a few quick pics for comparison
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
Got a little more done today. I got the fender struts bent welded and put on.
Soon it will be time to weld the tail on and do the finish blending and get it off to powder coat. I am thinking a nice silver frame and tossing a few different colors around in my head. Black and red or a metllic dark green on the tank and fenders. What does everyone think?
Soon it will be time to weld the tail on and do the finish blending and get it off to powder coat. I am thinking a nice silver frame and tossing a few different colors around in my head. Black and red or a metllic dark green on the tank and fenders. What does everyone think?
TurboFarviknugn
XS650 Addict
THANKS for the link on the SWITCH that is EXACTLY what I am looking for as my current switch had to be trplaced due to the keys vibrating out while riding, man THAT SUCKED !!!
BTW, I thing the RED & BLACK combo would rock but then again I am BIASED !!! LOL !!!
Just to let you know METALIC BLACK powdercoat looks AWSOME on a motorcycle frame due to all the small bends and crevices, makes for cool viewing in the sun.
BTW, I thing the RED & BLACK combo would rock but then again I am BIASED !!! LOL !!!
Just to let you know METALIC BLACK powdercoat looks AWSOME on a motorcycle frame due to all the small bends and crevices, makes for cool viewing in the sun.
WickedKlown2
XS650 Enthusiast
Make sure and use rubber washers on your mounting points for the Kikker Fender as they are pretty thin and alot of the 5150 owners have had problems with them cracking and bolts pulling through the metal...
Other than that looking good
Other than that looking good
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
Well I finally got the jets in for the 2004 EX500 carbs I put on my test bed, after having to make 2 orders because I made a mistake and ordered only 1 of each jet 135 & 138, and did a little tuning and running. After putting in the 135's letting the bike warm up I started testing. The results were better but still nowhere near what it should have been. Removed the carbs again and put in the 138's warmed it up again and tested them out. The results were even better just a little breaking up around 5k and just a slight roll off produces a nice hard pull up to about 6.5k. So I am going to have to order some 140's, 142's and maybe some 145's. I really don't want to have to make another order again in a week. So for anyone who is keeping track of this it looks as though the ballpark for pods and open exhaust is going to be 38 pilots, 140 or 142 mains and the needle shimmed up with 2 washers.
