Newbie Yamaha Questions

[YamaYam]

Last week I bought a 1977 Yamaha XS650D from a guy in in the tri-state area. Its a blue beauty and runs well enough.

I plan to get my hands on a manual but I have a few questions:

How do you know when your ignition coil or condenser is going bad? The bike runs fine, idles well enough, but is extremely difficult to start and last weekend it stalled on me when I was on the road, and hesitated a bit when I rolled the throttle, sputtering and whatnot.

The carbs are fine, the mixture is fine as well. I pulled the plugs and they look great. I checked the fuel delivery system and thats working well too.

Another question I have, there is only one brake disc and caliper on the bike, but I noticed on the other fork bolt - holes for another caliper which means I could probably put another brake set up on the other side. I wouldn't want anything aftermarket, I'd just throw on another disc etc. Is this an involved process?

Thanks a million.

 

[fredintoon]

Hi YamaYam,
first, triple-clean the bike's carbs. Completely apart. Every last jet, fuel passage and needle. Consider paying for an ultrasonic cleaning job.
Almost all suspected ignition problems are carb problems in disguise.
Double-disking:-
Nah, not involved at all, everything simply bolts up.
There's a bolt circle for a second disk on the front wheel's left side, pull the plastic mask off to see the tapped holes.
Disk from a '77 or newer XS650 FRONT bolts right on.
Disk from XS650 REAR and ANY disk from an XS750/850 is smaller in diameter and won't work.
Slotted disks from a later XS11 will work and you won't have to drill them like you should the plain disks.
Leftside caliper from a Yamaha 500cc single or from an XS750/850/1100 STANDARD bolts right on.
(note that XS750/850/11 SPECIALS front brakes are a different Weird Harold design and their calipers WON'T work on an XS650)
Brake hoses:- If yours are the original stock hoses they are WAY past their best before date and should be replaced.
Now is the time to upgrade to stainless hoses.
Note that the stock front brake master cylinder was designed to operate TWO calipers.
You'll find it's got a far nicer feel than when it was only operating one.
BUT. (there's always a "but") dual disking considerably increases the front wheel's unsprung weight.
If that's a concern for you, there's an alternative solution to the XS650's poor m/c to caliper ratio
(that you didn't even know the bike had, eh?)
Still do the stainless brake line swap, stay with one disk and swap the over-large master cylinder for one with an 11mm piston diameter.

 

[YamaYam]

Hi YamaYam,
first, triple-clean the bike's carbs. Completely apart. Every last jet, fuel passage and needle. Consider paying for an ultrasonic cleaning job.
Almost all suspected ignition problems are carb problems in disguise.
Double-disking:-
Nah, not involved at all, everything simply bolts up.
There's a bolt circle for a second disk on the front wheel's left side, pull the plastic mask off to see the tapped holes.
Disk from a '77 or newer XS650 FRONT bolts right on.
Disk from XS650 REAR and ANY disk from an XS750/850 is smaller in diameter and won't work.
Slotted disks from a later XS11 will work and you won't have to drill them like you should the plain disks.
Leftside caliper from a Yamaha 500cc single or from an XS750/850/1100 STANDARD bolts right on.
(note that XS750/850/11 SPECIALS front brakes are a different Weird Harold design and their calipers WON'T work on an XS650)
Brake hoses:- If yours are the original stock hoses they are WAY past their best before date and should be replaced.
Now is the time to upgrade to stainless hoses.
Note that the stock front brake master cylinder was designed to operate TWO calipers.
You'll find it's got a far nicer feel than when it was only operating one.
BUT. (there's always a "but") dual disking considerably increases the front wheel's unsprung weight.
If that's a concern for you, there's an alternative solution to the XS650's poor m/c to caliper ratio
(that you didn't even know the bike had, eh?)
Still do the stainless brake line swap, stay with one disk and swap the over-large master cylinder for one with an 11mm piston diameter.

Such a wealth of information. Thank you very much. Based on your reply, for now I will simply upgrade to stainless steel hoses and a master cylinder. I have heard bad things about MikesXS, so may I ask, where would be the best place to get stainless steel hoses and a 11mm piston MC as you say?

Thanks again!

 

[Brassneck]

+1 on the carbs likely being the hard start/stall issue...but without testing, it's hard to tell. I'd follow Fred's advice...clean carbs, clean them again and then check float height, etc. and set them up per stock settings (assuming your bike is stock)...that way you rule out the biggest culprit. Plus, it's something that should be done anyway with a "new to you" bike. If it's still hard to start/stalls...move on to electrical/charging system could be a factor for starting/stalling (if it's not charging and you have a weak battery).

There is a ton of help on this site...do a little searching and you'll find 99.9% of everything you could possibly ask. Like the carb cleaning/setting/adjustments as well as adding a second disk/caliper to the front rim... your bike doesn't need a second caliper (looks cool though). Smaller bore MC is a decent option... Stainless Steel line is a must in my opinion. I got my line from a local bike shop...but I've done a bit of custom work...so length was important for my build.

I got my smaller MC from Mikes... I don't recall off-hand which one, but I'm sure I posted about it.

Good luck!

 

[MaxPete]

I like the blue ones - can you show us a photo of the bike?

 

[YamaYam]

Thanks. I ordered a replacement and ignition coil and condenser just because, and I am going to order stainless brake lines. The previous seller added nice, but shorter handlebars so I need to measure the length in re the brake cables. And, just because I want to start out with a clean slate, Im going to order a new battery as well. Any suggestions?

 

[YamaYam]

I like the blue ones - can you show us a photo of the bike?

I will have to take some. I bought it about a week before the northeast got hit by a snowstorm. I only rode it for two days and then put it in the garage. I brought it out two weeks later and thats when I noticed the sputtering and stalling issues. I'll take some photos over the weekend when the weather is nice.

I have heard Yamahas are finicky. Could a two week sit screw up the carbs? Also I noticed there is a bit of surface rust in the tank. not a lot.

 

[aldo5468]

Such a wealth of information. Thank you very much. Based on your reply, for now I will simply upgrade to stainless steel hoses and a master cylinder. I have heard bad things about MikesXS, so may I ask, where would be the best place to get stainless steel hoses and a 11mm piston MC as you say?

Thanks again![/QUOTE
The master cylinder from Yamaha TW200 is an 11mm unit that is a direct swap. The RH mirror screws right in and the plug for the front brake switch does also. Same m/c used on some other models - check the parts fiche for TW200 on boats.net or other website.

 

[Brassneck]

I have heard Yamahas are finicky. Could a two week sit screw up the carbs? Also I noticed there is a bit of surface rust in the tank. not a lot.

Not more finicky than any other old bike...but if there's rust/crud in the tank, that will cause blockage regardless of the brand of bike. Might consider adding fuel filters after you've cleaned the carbs.

 

[MaxPete]

+1 - these old gals run great with just a little TLC and sitting for a week won't do any harm at all.

One thing to note is that they are not fuel injected and so it's unlikely that they would ever run quite as smoothly as a more modern bike (although many Forum members have their bikes pretty well sorted out).

 

[DanielBlack]

Congrats on adding to the stable. I'd love to see a pic of all three of your XS's. Are they all stock? Having owned two previously, did you find those finicky?

 

[650Skull]

Last week I bought a 1977 Yamaha XS650D from a guy in in the tri-state area..

I will have to take some. I bought it about a week before the northeast got hit by a snowstorm. I only rode it for two days and then put it in the garage. I brought it out two weeks later and thats when I noticed the sputtering and stalling issues. I'll take some photos over the weekend when the weather is nice.
I have heard Yamahas are finicky. Could a two week sit screw up the carbs? Also I noticed there is a bit of surface rust in the tank. not a lot.

Wow got 2 of them now...........What color is the other 77D.............post some pics of the 76C and 2 77D's ............Pretty broad statement saying all Yamaha's can be finicky...................But.........Always a but............Common knowledge is just that..........if you want to learn the truth don't listen to those who don't know, and listen to the guys here and you will be able to trouble shoot, diagnose and repair your 3 XS650s with ease

Such a wealth of information. Thank you very much. Based on your reply, for now I will simply upgrade to stainless steel hoses and a master cylinder. I have heard bad things about MikesXS, so may I ask, where would be the best place to get stainless steel hoses and a 11mm piston MC as you say?
Thanks again!

I have been around for a while now and have never heard of any trouble with MikesXS Stainless brake lines.................

Im going to order a new battery as well. Any suggestions?

You won't get any better info than from your other thread about asking about Batteries.............

 

[TimeMachine]

Are you able to post a pic ? Would be great to see another 77 ! Gallery even.. thx, RT

 

[TimeMachine]

Blue , show it off ! C'mon

 

[MaxPete]

Hey TM: I like your DD setup, but why didn't you drill your disks?

Pete

 

[TimeMachine]

My XS is so light, needed the extra weight to keep the front end planted

 

[YamadudeXS650C]

Pictures ! Pictures !

I just bought 2 SS brake lines for my '83 and '80 from Mikes'. There are fine. I have had very few issues with Mikes and they now have a responsive Customer service dept. THere are plenty of posts here detailing folk's experiences with Mikes. MaxPete wrote up a lot of his purchase experiences, in fact.

 

[YamaYam]

+1 - these old gals run great with just a little TLC and sitting for a week won't do any harm at all.

One thing to note is that they are not fuel injected and so it's unlikely that they would ever run quite as smoothly as a more modern bike (although many Forum members have their bikes pretty well sorted out).

True. The PO before the PO put pods on it. The guy I bought it from, a hipster in brooklyn, told me the original owner is actually somewhere on this forum.

I wish it were stock. It runs well enough but its hard to start. Had the coil, condenser and all that double checked with a mate this weekend. All of that is fine. I noticed the choke lever is all or nothing, either all the way up or all the way down. Is that normal? Is there nothing in between? Im wondering if the starting issue could be related to the choke

 

[DanielBlack]

What is the choke lever like on your other 77? Or is this the same one you had asked about a battery in February? What about the 76?

 

[retiredgentleman]

There is a small fixed jet in the bottom of the float bowls. That is the source of fuel that produces the rich mixture when you turn on the choke. If that tiny orifice is plugged, then engine will be very hard to start. If you have not confirmed that its clear, this is the time to do so.