Is there a PMA which retains the OEM TCI crank trigger? I'm SOL again with a rotor that's NFG.
FML!
FML!
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PMA with TCI
- Thread starter MacMcMacmac
- Start date
ippytattoo
Just another grumpy old hack.
Hugh's has a pma with crank trigger. iirc vape also has crank trigger. Neither retain the oem trigger though. Can't comment on how well they work as I am running a pamco.
VAPE. A good quality product. I have had VAPE on my RD350 for many years now. ZERO problems.
HHB has had some issues, from what I have read.......
HHB has had some issues, from what I have read.......
I'm not sure I trust timing to a rotor with no keyway.
T
If the taper is as it should be, it is no problem. Ever used a drill bit with a Morse taper? I always lap any taper I have spart, using fine valve lapping compound, as a precaution.
Puzzler. I measured the resistance across the slip rings after my last ride and was getting zero ohms, so I thought the windings had shorted out. I pulled the rotor, and the measurements were normal.
Aha! Heat related surely.
Unfortunately, an hour at 200F in the stove saw the resistance climb to 7.8 ohms, as expected when wires heat up.
My new brushes seem to be wearing pretty quickly. I'm wondering if they have shorted out the brush carrier with carbon dust. Slip rings are like new.
Have to keep digging on this one.
Aha! Heat related surely.
Unfortunately, an hour at 200F in the stove saw the resistance climb to 7.8 ohms, as expected when wires heat up.
My new brushes seem to be wearing pretty quickly. I'm wondering if they have shorted out the brush carrier with carbon dust. Slip rings are like new.
Have to keep digging on this one.
Well, lesson re-learned. This pathetic charging system can't handle a 55W halogen in stop and go running. I popped the fuse to the headlight and my voltmeter went from 9.25 to 12.53 and climbing at 2000rpm. Does anyone have a decent LED H3 bulb they can recommend? The last one I bought was terrible. I put a 35W low beam halogen in my bike and it worked well but they vibrate to death in short order.
I think my meter has had the biscuit as well frankly. Maybe new leads at least.
I think my meter has had the biscuit as well frankly. Maybe new leads at least.
My old SH would not cope with an H4 55W Halogen bulb as used on many cars unless I was running consistently above 3000 rpm. So I switched to H4 35W Halogen bulb. When I looked up the light output data I concluded the H4 35W puts out a similar amount of light as the original sealed beam headlight. Maybe there is a 35W option for you?
My (points ignition) XS650D runs just fine with a 55/60W H4 bulb. Does the TCI draw more power than dual points and two coils (more dwell, lower resistance coil, black box draw) ?
Or is it that the Specials have 2 taillight bulbs? Or is there any other significant differences between the various model years?
Or is it that the Specials have 2 taillight bulbs? Or is there any other significant differences between the various model years?
It may just be the twin tail lights even though they are only 5W each. Perhaps that extra 5W broke the camel's back because the sealed beam was 50W I believe. My SH had a new rewound rotor and it struggled with the 55W headlight, but it was good with the 35W. I also had the Boyer ignition so perhaps the stock alternator is always just on the edge at below 3000 rpm especially with any extra load added.
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So with the OEM alternator, LED taillight bulb (s) is a sensible mod. And maybe ensure that the voltage is adjused towards the upper recommended limit.
I also wonder if different voltage regulators can have different current draw. (OEM electro-mechanical vs solid state aftermarket alternatives)
I also wonder if different voltage regulators can have different current draw. (OEM electro-mechanical vs solid state aftermarket alternatives)
Do any of the safety relays draw power on an SH when running? I have a single bulb Brit style tail light. I can't see the tci being much of a draw, there's not much in there. I'd go all led if I could find any decent ones, but those are mostly intermittent loads. A brake lamp gets well used in traffic though. Looks like an 1157 is pulling about 27W with both filaments lit. Damn, that's half the low beam! Taking away half the headlight draw by going LED on the brake light might just be all the difference you need in stop and go.
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In another thread, someone mentioned that the TCI coil has 2.5 ohm primary resistance, and TCI is also wasted spark. While the points coils are 4 ohm, and only fire every second revolution. In addition, the TCI box will have some power requirement by itself. So it seems plausible that the TCI system is drawing more power than a points system. If someone has one XS of each type, it would be interesting if they could measure the actual current draw of both systems.
Well the new led headlight is nice and bright, but it seems my charging system has taken a dump again. I installed a new Rick's rotor thinking my old one was flakey, but no dice. I checked the brushes and had full battery voltage from both the OEM and aftermarket regulator, but no charging. No headlight either. Then I pulled the plugs and started component troubleshooting. The diode test seems to be fine, but I had a few weird things happen. Once while idling with my boost pack attached, I disconnected the regulator plug and the headlight switched on. I disconnected the plug leading to the alternator and checked the white leads. Zero ohms to ground. Aha! Crapped out stator. I pulled the leads out the left side of the bike and measured. Now all 3 leads showed the proper phase to phase resistance and no continuity to ground. Well that's weird. Perhaps it is chafing on the frame when it's in position. Sure enough, when I put it back, I once again had continuity to the motor cases and frame. Then I realized when I pulled the wire out the left side of the bike I was also disconnecting the yellow lead to the headlight relay. I put the alternator lead back in place and disconnected the wire to the relay and presto, no continuity to ground. Testing the wire going to the relay got me continuity to ground. So, should there be a circuit to ground through this wire? I suppose if it triggers a relay it must supply power through a coil to ground to trigger it so there must be some resistance value.
On top of this, when I attempted to charge my agm battery my smart charger gives up with an error message, so it looks like the battery is no good either. I have a spare lead acid that I put in hoping maybe an internally shorted battery was the issue, but it did not fix it.
I'm running out of ideas. I was thinking of buying a 3phase regulator off of Amazon to eliminate the stock regulator to take it out of the equation but I'm not convinced it is the problem, although the headlight coming on when I disconnected it seems fishy.
On top of this, when I attempted to charge my agm battery my smart charger gives up with an error message, so it looks like the battery is no good either. I have a spare lead acid that I put in hoping maybe an internally shorted battery was the issue, but it did not fix it.
I'm running out of ideas. I was thinking of buying a 3phase regulator off of Amazon to eliminate the stock regulator to take it out of the equation but I'm not convinced it is the problem, although the headlight coming on when I disconnected it seems fishy.
Well I have not read all
What bike are we talking here is it 83 Heritage
Stock wiring ? Stock ignition ? Stock charging ?
If it has the old mechanical regulator it needs to go in my opinion
I put in many hours into one of those with shifting parts from three different and had to give up.
Starting from the basics
What is the Voltage across the battery ignition off
What is the Voltage across the battery ignition on
What is the Voltage across the battery ignition on bike running say 2500 rpm
Has the wiring connectors and fuse holders etc been serviced.
Grinding clean . Contact grease.
Considered install a Voltmeter ?
What bike are we talking here is it 83 Heritage
Stock wiring ? Stock ignition ? Stock charging ?
If it has the old mechanical regulator it needs to go in my opinion
I put in many hours into one of those with shifting parts from three different and had to give up.
Starting from the basics
What is the Voltage across the battery ignition off
What is the Voltage across the battery ignition on
What is the Voltage across the battery ignition on bike running say 2500 rpm
Has the wiring connectors and fuse holders etc been serviced.
Grinding clean . Contact grease.
Considered install a Voltmeter ?
Yes, the yellow goes to the starter cutout relay, splits to a doide and across to the headlight relay before going to ground. They're parallel, so whatever the resistance of the two coils paralleled. No idea what the resistance is for those relays. If I had to guess I'd say somewhere north of a 100Ω each. Whatever it is, it's a lot more than zero (short to ground).
My 83 has the solid state regulator. There are no wiring changes except the inclusion of a "Chrysler" style voltage regulator. Since the brushes were getting full battery voltage I assume the regulator was trying hard to get some power out of the alternator. Both the Yamaha and aftermarket regulator were energizing the brushes so I dont think that's the problem. It seems odd the power would get to the rotor and the stator windings would ohm out correctly and the rectifier diodes test okay and nothing works.
No blown fuses.
If there is a short to ground through the headlight relay would that provide enough ground to disable output from the entire alternator? Seems like something should blow or smoke if that was the case. I had the yellow wire off completely while running and it didnt seem to make any difference.
I think I might just buy that rectifier anyway. The diode test doesn't seem particularly exhaustive.
Everything was working well after I swapped in the led bulb. I had wired in a voltmeter into the low beam circuit and was getting 14.5V for about a half hour ride after fully charging the battery which had drained down from the 55w halogen bulb. Then everything went for a crap. I saw 10.5v 1.2v 0v 10.5v and both the battery and alternator LEDs were blinking. I managed to make it back home on 10.5v. This is one reason I want to try a separate rectifier. It had all the symptoms of an electronic component dying.
No blown fuses.
If there is a short to ground through the headlight relay would that provide enough ground to disable output from the entire alternator? Seems like something should blow or smoke if that was the case. I had the yellow wire off completely while running and it didnt seem to make any difference.
I think I might just buy that rectifier anyway. The diode test doesn't seem particularly exhaustive.
Everything was working well after I swapped in the led bulb. I had wired in a voltmeter into the low beam circuit and was getting 14.5V for about a half hour ride after fully charging the battery which had drained down from the 55w halogen bulb. Then everything went for a crap. I saw 10.5v 1.2v 0v 10.5v and both the battery and alternator LEDs were blinking. I managed to make it back home on 10.5v. This is one reason I want to try a separate rectifier. It had all the symptoms of an electronic component dying.
Please inspect the wiring going into the headlamp ..There should be a rubber grommet that can break
and the sharp edges cut into the wiring
Please check so the fuses is sitting OK
A rectifier of a type suggested here on the forum is not so expensive was it $ 10
May be wort it .. if not a solution having one spare is not wrong even if i do believe it is rather robust
Correct if this wrong
2 Rotors has been tested
2 Regulators
There is power on the Brushes
One test of stator is performed ( there is a Service manual on line how that is done and please check that connector so it is cleaned and greased pins not out of place )
I am taking this out of memory so it can be wrong ..the regulator I have has 3 pins
One I do believe is the upside that goes to the alternator
One should go to ground please check that one
and the sharp edges cut into the wiring
Please check so the fuses is sitting OK
A rectifier of a type suggested here on the forum is not so expensive was it $ 10
May be wort it .. if not a solution having one spare is not wrong even if i do believe it is rather robust
Correct if this wrong
2 Rotors has been tested
2 Regulators
There is power on the Brushes
One test of stator is performed ( there is a Service manual on line how that is done and please check that connector so it is cleaned and greased pins not out of place )
I am taking this out of memory so it can be wrong ..the regulator I have has 3 pins
One I do believe is the upside that goes to the alternator
One should go to ground please check that one
Ok. I think my regulator is fubar.
I hooked up my smart charger with the lead acid battery. It had been drawn completely flat overnight by a parasitic drain. I noticed a small spark when I hooked up my ground wire to the freshly charged battery two nights ago. I pulled the ground wire again and tried to measure the leakage current but came up empty. Tonight as i was charging with the ground wire off, I was reading 12.5v. I hooked the ground wire up to the battery and nothing changed. Then I reconnected the 8 pin plug to the regulator and the charging voltage dropped to 8v. This is with the ignition off and the kill switch switched off. To ensure it wasn't the Chrysler regulator, I repeated the test with it also disconnected and got the same result. So it seems there is a short inside the Yamaha regulator. This makes sense since the headlight came on when I pulled the 8 pin plug at idle yesterday. The yellow sense wire showed there was power being generated in the stator coils by the Chrysler regulator but the Yamaha regulator was shorting out. So, I will pick up a 3 phase rectifier from Amazon and connect it with the Chrysler regulator, retire the stock regulator and hopefully I'll be good to go.
It will all work out just fine. Just....fine....
I hooked up my smart charger with the lead acid battery. It had been drawn completely flat overnight by a parasitic drain. I noticed a small spark when I hooked up my ground wire to the freshly charged battery two nights ago. I pulled the ground wire again and tried to measure the leakage current but came up empty. Tonight as i was charging with the ground wire off, I was reading 12.5v. I hooked the ground wire up to the battery and nothing changed. Then I reconnected the 8 pin plug to the regulator and the charging voltage dropped to 8v. This is with the ignition off and the kill switch switched off. To ensure it wasn't the Chrysler regulator, I repeated the test with it also disconnected and got the same result. So it seems there is a short inside the Yamaha regulator. This makes sense since the headlight came on when I pulled the 8 pin plug at idle yesterday. The yellow sense wire showed there was power being generated in the stator coils by the Chrysler regulator but the Yamaha regulator was shorting out. So, I will pick up a 3 phase rectifier from Amazon and connect it with the Chrysler regulator, retire the stock regulator and hopefully I'll be good to go.
It will all work out just fine. Just....fine....
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Did I get this wrong ???
Aeehh..hhhh come to think of it ..Just so we are talking the same thing
" Ok. I think my regulator is fubar. "
Is it not a Unit regulator and rectifier is in the same " Black Box " unit in Your bike stock
On older models there was 2 separate objects
If it is a unit one needs to be careful replacing with .The Chrysler " regulator "
A battery that has gone down below 11 V starts to degrade ( Sulfation ) seldom can be re waked
So the battery connected to the bike after recharging can drop voltage because there can be wiring out pre ignition as to the starter relay
Enclosed service instruction the Unit please check so it is the right type
https://www.xs650.de/literatur/wsh/pdf/06-elektrik.pdf
Aeehh..hhhh come to think of it ..Just so we are talking the same thing
" Ok. I think my regulator is fubar. "
Is it not a Unit regulator and rectifier is in the same " Black Box " unit in Your bike stock
On older models there was 2 separate objects
If it is a unit one needs to be careful replacing with .The Chrysler " regulator "
A battery that has gone down below 11 V starts to degrade ( Sulfation ) seldom can be re waked
So the battery connected to the bike after recharging can drop voltage because there can be wiring out pre ignition as to the starter relay
Enclosed service instruction the Unit please check so it is the right type
https://www.xs650.de/literatur/wsh/pdf/06-elektrik.pdf
