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Right Intake Valve Keepers diagnosis

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by JayR, Dec 3, 2018.

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  1. JayR

    JayR XS650 Addict

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    Hi folks, over the past 5-10 rides a clanging noise has developed in the top end.

    I set out to adjust the intake and exhaust valve gaps according to specifications.

    While doing this I noticed that the valve keepers on the right intake valve seem to be more open/askew compared to the other three valves.

    Are the keepers in the photo the root of my excessive top end noise do you think?

    As always thank you for considering my question. Jay
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Downeaster

    Downeaster Everything in XS Top Contributor

    Assuming valve lash is correct, I wouldn't think that would be the source of your noise. There's usually some gap and that doesn't appear excessive to me. The spring tension would keep them pretty snug.

    Have you checked your cam chain tension?
     
    JayR likes this.
  3. JayR

    JayR XS650 Addict

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    Hey Downeaster - thanks for that I appreciate it.

    Exhausts were .008 - .009 and I reset to .006

    Intakes were .004ish so reset to .0025-.003

    It was late when I finished up last night so I didn’t start the engine yet.

    I did NOT check cam chain tensioner. I replaced the cam tension guide and chain about 1,300 miles ago - but I did not look at that adjustment now. I probably made a mistake by not starting there I think.

    This is a video of the noise I’m trying to identify/eliminate. Thanks again.

     
  4. Downeaster

    Downeaster Everything in XS Top Contributor

    Whoa...that's kinda ugly!

    Definitely check/set the cam chain tension and then re-check the valve lash.

    Sounds awfully "solid" to be valve train to me. I'd be tempted to change the oil and inspect the magnets on the drain plugs.
     
  5. JayR

    JayR XS650 Addict

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    Yeah that’s my concern too - way too funky sounding to be just normal clicking and ticking. Ugh.

    I’ll change the oil and inspect the magnet (afraid to ask what I’m looking for lol). And do a proper cam chain tension check, and reset/check the valves.

    Thanks again!
     
  6. Downeaster

    Downeaster Everything in XS Top Contributor

    Looking for metal shavings. Some fine dust or a paste-like substance is normal. Big chunks are un-good. Bits of plastic usually come from the front chain guide. Some of the after-market guides are less than wonderful and will shed the plastic.
     
  7. 5twins

    5twins XS650 Guru Top Contributor

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    After installing a new cam chain, you have to do a few tension checks within the first few hundred or the 1st thousand miles. The new chains initially stretch quite a bit and quickly. Do the check/adjustment while the engine is idling. Then you can hear if your adjustment (tightening) is eliminating the noise.

    Your keepers look fine. There's normally a space between the 2 keepers on each side where they meet. Yours might be closed up more on the other side which would make the side in your pic bigger.
     
  8. JayR

    JayR XS650 Addict

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    Aha. I should have been more diligent with checking that. It makes sense that the cam chain would stretch. I’ll check oil and cam chain carefully when I get back in front of my bike later this week and report back.
     
  9. JayR

    JayR XS650 Addict

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    I adjusted the cam chain tension and that funky clanking, choking seagull noise is gone now. The engine is quieter and sounds mostly like it should.

    The road test was very much improved. Before with the sloppy chain it sounded real bad - like it was going to seize up or something. Scary. Now it is very quite at speed, but still some ticking to work on.

    Since I tried adjusting the valves first before looking at the cam chain adjustment I think that they need to be redone too to reduce the remaining clicking and ticking that you can still hear. And I’ll double check for any bits of the new guide when I change the oil. Hopefully not.

    Once that’s done then I have a charging system gremlin to run down. I fully tested the system, running like a champ for 1-1/12 years. Now it is not charging. I got as far as identifying that it Fails the slap test. I have new brushes ready too So wish me luck




    Thanks fellas. Jay
     
  10. 5twins

    5twins XS650 Guru Top Contributor

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    Yes, sounds like a loose valve or two. It's important to re-check your clearance after tightening the lock nut. Often times it gets a bit looser. I think that may be because the screw gets pulled up as you tighten the lock nut down. A little trick I employ if that happens is to put a box end wrench on the lock nut and tap it a wee bit tighter with a rubber mallet. That will often tighten the screw a little with the nut and that can put your loose adjustment back where you want it, with a nice slip-fit to the feeler gauge.
     
  11. JayR

    JayR XS650 Addict

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    Hey 5Twins thanks for listening in on that clip. Yes I noticed that upon final tightening that the tolerances would widen to a reading that was too loose when I checked the final product. I futzed around with it on each valve a few times - ultimately setting it about .001 - .0015 narrower than spec, so when I tightened the lock nut it would eventually “lock up” at the desired setting. Learning as I go. In any event it was all for naught since I have to redo the valves because I negelected to do the cam chain first (the majority of the issue).

    So with your box wrench/rubber mallet trick you are NOT holding the tappet head in place is that right?

    Cheers.
     
  12. 5twins

    5twins XS650 Guru Top Contributor

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    Correct, you want the adjuster screw to turn in tighter as you tighten the nut a little bit more.
     

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