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Scratching my head so bad I'm gonna start bleeding soon Won't stay running

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by Noidea, Mar 30, 2017.

  1. Noidea

    Noidea XS650 Addict

    so i bought a 1973 tx650 on ebay like a dumbass for my first motorcycle unfortunately some people suck and sell things to you by lying and saying they work when they don't. The dude said it ran and drove just fine but when it got turned on it kicked over but defiantly did not go into 1st anyway what I did in order to try and fix it was change the clutch wire and it still just jerks into 1st then turns off stalls out.I also did valve adjustment, new battery, cleaned the carbs, new spark plugs.<--- i did that cause one big problem Im having is the engine misfires and is running too rich so the spark plugs come out oil fouled and black i did a compression test and the compression is A+ both cylinders bieng 170. I also did a wet test came out perfect as well. Im not sure what other test to run to see exactly whats going on with it but if someone would be able to help me out that would be tittsss. Ive looked through this forum and learned a lot from not knowing anything to knowing at least a little something. this site has helped a lot in terms of learning this bike and what it has to offer i figured it about my time to add some more stuff to the threads and maybe helped someone else having the same problem asa well as help my own problems thnkk u
     
  2. gggGary

    gggGary Stop that! XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    " the spark plugs come out oil fouled and black" oily or wet with gas? Big difference. Pretty typical for a cracked valve seal to pump in oil, could be a leaky head gasket. If it's fuel, a leaky float or float needle valve could be at fault. Grab a set of hotter plugs, try BP6ES lower number is hotter..... See if they will let it keep firing. Sometimes, oil consumption slows, after some riding. Clean, gap points, check timing with a light. Test and or replace condensers, Ohm ignition and kill switches looking for corroded contacts. Watch for proper advance action. New plug caps.
    Yeah you are getting the shotgun motorcycle maintenance 101 course. Welcome aboard. An early XS is a pretty steep slope for a first bike, 40 years of progress HAS made a lot of stuff more reliable on newer model bikes. Make a plan and stick with it. Test fix and VERIFY one item at a time. Then try the next thing. That's just how it is with old motorcycles.
     
  3. YamadudeXS650C

    YamadudeXS650C Central New York XS650 XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Welcome to the Forum ! You are doing the best thing, that is, doing a bunch of reading, here. Its got a great Tech section.

    " kicked over but defiantly did not go into 1st anyway what I did in order to try and fix it was change the clutch wire and it still just jerks into 1st then turns off stalls out" >> I'm wondering if you are clearing the clutch plates prior to trying to start the bike. If not, it will jerk into gear and maybe stall. Clearing them involves putting the bike in gear, first or second, clutch pulled in, and rocking bike forwards and back until it pushes freely. THEN start the bike. In neutral. The more you run the bike the easier the plates will clear in this manner. And finding neutral and 2nd gear will get easier.

    Your good compression numbers are a really good sign for the potential of this bike.
     
  4. fredintoon

    fredintoon Fred Hill, S'toon. Top Contributor

    Hi Noidea and welcome,
    Perhaps first buying a beater lightweight dual-purpose machine to learn on would have been a good thought but WTF, starting at the deep end is OK too.
    And oh yes, a seller's definition of "It runs good" may well be different to yours or mine.
    So, it starts, runs and has good compression? That's good.
    Misfires could be spark or carbs or a combination of both. Sooty plugs is carbs.
    Oily plugs AND good compression is most likely failed valve stem oil seals.
    A new clutch cable, provided it's properly lubricated and not forced into tight bends, will give a lighter pull.
    It won't fix the sticking clutch. Proper adjustment and regular use is the fix.
    The list's search button will let you find excellent "how to" information about all of your problems.
    &BTW, if you ever owned a Velocette, you had clutch adjustment problems. Otherwise, you only thought so.
     
  5. YamadudeXS650C

    YamadudeXS650C Central New York XS650 XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Fred has a good idea; pick up a cheap runner so that you can have some fun this season, while you are tinkering with the XS650. That way you won't get frustrated with it and create negative vibes towards it. Nothing worse than a build-up of negative vibes :devilish: to undermine ur efforts.

    Then, you can later sell of the runner for more than u bot it for, cuz you cleaned it up and took care of it.

    How 'bout posting a pic of ur Yamaha?
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2017
  6. xjwmx

    xjwmx It's just the unknown. Top Contributor

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    Check to make sure there's nothing wrong with your float valves (in carbs). If it is leaking freely it will cause something like what you describe.
     
  7. Noidea

    Noidea XS650 Addict

    Hell yea I'm fuckn way hyped I got responses so fast. This is way tight I didn't expect responses so soon. Im gonna do all the basic maintenance over again like gggGary said im not sure if the spark plugs are oiled or gas fouled have to double check on that one. I also haven't tried clearing the clutch plates when i went to my local motorcycle shop they told me to put the bike into gear and basically rev it and drop it into first to clear the plates but that did not work. Alllsoooo when i was cleaning out the carbs now that i think about it one of the needles sort of just stayed up from time to time so i just dropped it back down thinking it would stay down my thought is it most likely didnt stay down got stuck up so ill check up on that. and to Yamahadude I really should buy a runner bike everything i see on craigslist I am not backing though or its just straight too expensive ill keep lurking and heres a pic of the ol'rust bucket ;) (and me of course in some strange photo exorcism i seem to be caught in)
     

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  8. fredintoon

    fredintoon Fred Hill, S'toon. Top Contributor

    Hi 'dude,
    thing is, the OP sez the TX650 is his first bike. And while by today's standards a 650 is a middleweight, it still weighs well over 400 lbs.
    I reckon a person's first bike should be lighter and less powerful than a 650. Say a 250cc dual purpose machine. Ideal for learning the basics
    of riding and far better suited to back country dirt roads and no! You don't sell it, you keep it for Sunday trail rides.
    And Noidea,
    love the photo, HTF you do that?
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2017
  9. YamadudeXS650C

    YamadudeXS650C Central New York XS650 XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Looks to me like you've got one hell of a nice bike !

    And I enjoyed the reverse imagery of the photo.
     
  10. angus67

    angus67 Welder's penetrate deeper!!

    This is how you "clear" the clutch...
    First , leave the bike powered off. Kill switch engaged, key off, ignition off.
    Pull in the clutch lever, kick the kicker untill it goes limp. Now plates are separated, and should be able to put in first after starting.
    This is my routine for my 3 xs's . And at the same time, it charges the cylinders for a easy start.
    This is a very active forum. I have other makes/models of bikes, and those forums for those bikes are slow. Usually you can expect a reply in abour 12 hours sometimes 5 minutes.
     
  11. YamadudeXS650C

    YamadudeXS650C Central New York XS650 XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Call me opinionated, but....
    That person at your local bike shop shouldn't have anything to do with motorcycles, or any machine whatsoever.
    I would hand them a shovel and point them towards the nearest cow barn to fulfill their destiny in life: moving the stinky, soft stuff to the next spot in its destination.
     
  12. fredintoon

    fredintoon Fred Hill, S'toon. Top Contributor

    Hi Noidea,
    the best lies have the most truth in them.
    So "the bike ran and drove just fine" may well have been true but it's meaningless without saying how long ago that was.
    The clutch may have had years for it's plates to stick (or even rust) together.
    If angus' unsticking procedure don't work for you I'd advise against using more drastic methods, they may work or they may break something and parts ain't cheap.
    Best you remove the case and dismantle the clutch. Be careful. Read up on the methodology and beware of the pitfalls.
    And meanwhile, shop around for a bargain bogwheel to learn on.
     
  13. XSLeo

    XSLeo XS650 Guru Top Contributor

    On your carbs www.amckayltd.com/carbguide.pdf is our carb bible. Read it, print it out and read it, read it a few more times till it starts to make sense.
    Now use it to tear down, clean and inspect your carbs. Once you get things inspected you will know what you need to buy. These carbs or variations on these carbs were used on many bikes. Most kits come with generic parts that won't work in our bikes, might on some bikes just not ours. Buy just the parts you need. Mostly gaskets and seals. Jets both pilots and mains may be needed. The carb guide covers this in the :Tuning for Mods " section.
    When you do the tune up procedures go by this list, Cam Chain tension, Valve adjustment. points gap then timing.
    A repair manual is a good first step in fixing most anything. The book specs and procedures on everything.
    Factory books are best followed by the Clymer and Hayne's books. There are a few mistakes in all of them, mostly I translation.
    biker.net has some years for free downloads. any book that covers the points bikes, 70-79 pretty much covers your bike. A few differences in carb specs are the big differences in years.
    Welcome to our little slice of the XS650 life.
    Leo
     
  14. Noidea

    Noidea XS650 Addict

    I was literally just looking at that from a different thread I believe about float needle adjustment you joined in on and you posted about that there
    solid reference. I took the carbs apart again and the jets were stripped so i just ordered new main and pilot jets that same size as the stock size that I have now. Im just learning how to adjust the floats but besides that everything else is looking good clean and usable, also going back to gggGary talking about the spark plugs mine are BP8ES Im gonna order a set of 6's and 7's and see how those turn out. Feel like all this should sort out the rich fuel mixture then I'm onto the clutch. Im gonna try the method that Angus talked about when I get everything put together and see how it goes. Unfortunately if that doesn't work I'll be heading down the rabbit hole with the whole clutch mechanism. Maybe its not adjusted correctly? The clutch lever has some play towards the screw to tighten and loosen it. (That pieces name seems to leave my mind at the moment) its also either too hard or too lose when pulling on it depending on how I adjust it , just never seems to be quite right. Thats all i got for now I'll let you guys know how it all turns out when I can.
     
  15. Paul Sutton

    Paul Sutton Sprained Ankle Top Contributor

    I know it is disappointing to buy a bike you cannot ride straight away. I worked on mine for approx. 2 hours most nights for 5 months before I had it ready to ride. I enjoyed pulling everything apart and discovered that even the most trivial things needed attention due to the bikes previous 36 years of PO tinkering. But the good bit about the long wait was that I ended up very confident about the bikes mechanical condition. I suggest you just start with gggGary's list from the start of the thread. It will be worth the work in the end. Perhaps start with the spark plugs and decide if it is petrol or oil e.g. leave the wet plug in the sun for a few minutes and petrol will evaporate. If oil then track down the source, if petrol then it may be faulty ignition or an issue with the carburetor etc........

    If you are not sure of the names of various parts then go to Shopyamaha.com and under parts and street bikes you will be able to enter your bikes year and model and then access all the exploded diagrams with part numbers and names. I learnt this on this forum and use it regularly.

    Good luck and keep reading and asking questions.
     
  16. gggGary

    gggGary Stop that! XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    The threaded collar at the clutch perch is a cable adjuster. The clutch adjuster is found under the dollar sized chrome cap on the LH cover. The lock nut is usually bugger all tight. I like a deep 12mm socket on an air impact wrench to loosen it. There are lots of threads on how to do the adjustment toomanyxs1bs delves deeply into the clutch release system.
     
  17. On your first post with no picture added I imagined some hacked up boober project....so glad to be wrong. A buddy of mine had one of those new back in the day. The last I knew of it the Millville P.D. had it.....and that's a story for beers around the campfire......
    She'd look and sound sweet with a set of Commando muffs on her.
    Good luck and welcome aboard!
     
  18. gggGary

    gggGary Stop that! XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    And it's the very rare Home Market LH model!
     
  19. Left Hand model? What the h e double toothpicks you talkin' 'bout G? lol
     
  20. bighairyralph

    bighairyralph XS650 Addict

    Left hand model because his bike was made by "ahamaY" according to the tank badge.

    Definitely very rare (although I'm pretty sure it is a "World Market" model, not the "Home Market" model, but it's very easy to confuse the two (then again it's tomorrow is April Fools and that may have something to do with it)).
     

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