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Thaddeus’s ‘77 Survivor

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by tzimmerm, Aug 6, 2018.

  1. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    0984A4A0-6B44-403C-B9E8-76C04E1BACDC.jpeg
    You must not have been paying attention lately Gary.....
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2018
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  2. gggGary

    gggGary Stop that! Top Contributor XS650.com Supporter

    That's great! and yes after a retorque you tend to see oil for a bit, squeezed out of gaskets maybe??
     
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  3. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    I’m gonna pull an “old schooler” line and suggest you “read through the thread”. Lolololol yeah, last week after the retorque I noticed a bit of oil at the basegasket, but it seems to have slowed or stopped altogether, and I aso theorized that it may have been the coating of oil from all over the engine slowly dripping down to the base gasket. I cleaned it off pretty good the other day. I’m really happy with where my bike is at and it’s current state of tune.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2018
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  4. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    I should note that I used 5TWINS’ head retorque method; just the 8 acorns on top and the two under the plugs. Reading 5TWINS’ head retorque advice is what prompted me to buy the brass washers in the first place. They had been patiently waiting in my tool box along with some other parts from my first mike’s order right after I bought this bike. It just took a while to finally get to a point where I wanted to put them on, what with all the riding I was doing.:laugh::laugh::laugh::wink2:
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2018
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  5. gggGary

    gggGary Stop that! Top Contributor XS650.com Supporter

    I thinkggGary was 5twins, I'll pull an old timer and suggest you reread the thread. :laughing:
    I'm all OK with the rubber washers and harp about ever so carefully getting at that 6mm over the cam tensioner. :cautious:
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2018
  6. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    Shit! You may be right.... well played. Honestly, without gettin all mushy, you two are probably the two gurus that have helped me the most, which is probably why I made the mixup. I pretty much take both of your advice as the final word on what to do (and not to do) with this bike. Now I need to edit that post before 5Twins logs on.....
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2018
  7. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    Looking over the bike yesterday, and I bent down to look at the fins I had cleaned. I ran my finger across them and it reminded me of the post about the tuning fork- my clean fins ring surprisingly loud when you drag your fingernail across them. I guess I had a pretty thick film of oil coating them all. I need to buy some better cleaning tools and really go at the whole thing and get it completely spotless. Yesterday afternoon I bought some 15 weight fork oil, but I forgot I need to find a way to take off those fork caps. Do they make that large of an Allen socket? Anyone know what size that is on a ‘77 exactly?
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2018
  8. 5twins

    5twins XS650 Guru Top Contributor

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    I think it's 17mm and I think HF has a set with that size in it (socket style). 10 wt. is the normal fork oil spec. The forks will work better if you use a little more than the around 6 ounce per leg spec. Try 6.5 to 7 ounces.
     
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  9. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    Thanks 5Twins. I decided to go with 15 after reading about forks in the forums and learning that 77 was the only year to spec 20 wt, and later 10. I read (your?) theory about the beveled holes possibly flowing better, so it was logical to me to go with 15 since it was between both specs. I was planning on adding exactly 7 oz. to each fork; I’m just going to remove the drain screws, pump out whatever’s in there, and add new. I don’t have the ability to make my own fork disassembly tools right now, so there’s no point in taking the forks off the bike. I’ll see what improvement I get from this first. I’m sure performance will be better than what I have now; I can bounce the bike all the way up and down its travel.
     
  10. Jim

    Jim The thrill of victory and da agony of da feet. Top Contributor XS650.com Supporter

    A note of caution here... when you pull the last cap, the forks will collapse. It's gonna "really" want to roll forward and off the main stand... :yikes:
     
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  11. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    Wooooaahhh! Good lookin out Jim! Thanks for the heads up. Are you saying that I basically DO need to take them out of the trees or is there a procedure you recomend? I have jack stands that I could rest underneath the engine guard, if nothing else.
     
  12. Jim

    Jim The thrill of victory and da agony of da feet. Top Contributor XS650.com Supporter

    That would work.
     
  13. 5twins

    5twins XS650 Guru Top Contributor

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    You might want to use just 6.5 ounces after doing just a normal oil drain. Yes, I do put 7 in but that's after a total tear down and cleaning. The forks are completely empty inside, yours won't be.

    '77 was the first year for the 35mm forks and I think Yamaha may have gotten the oil weight wrong. In '78 and for all later years, the spec was changed to 10 weight. But sure, give the 15 a try. As you'll find out, changing it is no big deal.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2018
  14. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    Can I drain/fill each fork seperately to avoid the front end “collapse”? Open the left drain hole, pump the front end until nothing comes out, replace drain hole screw, remove top fork cap, add 6.5 oz oil, replace cap, repeat other side?
     
  15. Jim

    Jim The thrill of victory and da agony of da feet. Top Contributor XS650.com Supporter

    I don't see why not.
     
  16. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    THAT is a grand idea.
     
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  17. gggGary

    gggGary Stop that! Top Contributor XS650.com Supporter

    Oh just jack it up and pull the tubes. Trust me it's the simplest way. hint the forks are pressurized enough that removing the drain screw will "lubricate" a wide area. Are you sure the seals aren't leaking? Leaky seals on bikes this old is near 100% Don't attempt to remove the caps until you first loosen the top pinch bolts, the bolts squeeze the tubes enough to jam the cap threads.
    You might want to do this also.

    So support the front of engine til the front wheel is off the ground
    remove fender. speedo drive and brake caliper.
    loosen axle
    do the "are my forks bent?" per video.
    now remove the wheel and remove fork tubes drain pump out refill.
    Really? do the full monte, replace the seals.
    PS: you need a build thread LOL
     
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  18. MaxPete

    MaxPete Life with Lucille...I suggest, she decides. Top Contributor XS650.com Supporter

    Now THAT is a clever idea - thanks Gary!

    Pete
     
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  19. weekendrider

    weekendrider Iron Horse cowboy Top Contributor

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    Thank You.
     
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  20. tzimmerm

    tzimmerm XS650 Addict

    Okay, okay, I see this is NOT just a simple 20 minute drain and fill operation. I do have new seals, retaining clips, and dust Boots sitting in the tool box waiting for installation, but the home-made tools that require welding and grinding are what’s got me hung up. You may be right about the build thread.... Aside from an engine rebuild, charging system and the swing arm bushings (Next
    Big project) I’ve pretty much been into/rebuilt most every system on the bike. Front caliper rebuild, rear shoes, both tires replaced, all cables, instruments swapped, chain, cam seals, ignition swap/installation, timing, valve adjustment, new bars, new seat. Yup, good thing I bought an “All original, doesnt need much” bike.
     

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