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The ergonomic experiment

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by Mailman, Feb 21, 2020.

  1. GLJ

    GLJ Never go faster than your guardian angle can fly. Top Contributor

    You got to get those 4 wheel things "out of your shop."
  2. Mailman

    Mailman Hardly a Guru Top Contributor

    I know right? Then I could really go two wheel crazy!
    GLJ, MaxPete and Jim like this.
  3. JAX71224

    JAX71224 jax71224

    Personal choice....Maxima Chain Wax....a parrafin kinda lube , if applied when chain is warm and allowed over nighd cooling will no make a mess...
  4. Mailman

    Mailman Hardly a Guru Top Contributor

    Ding Ding Ding! My personal choice too! That’s what I’ve always used and been happy with it. I ran low and saw that stuff when I was in Walmart and thought “ how bad could it be?”
    Greyandridin likes this.
  5. MaxPete

    MaxPete Lucille, Betty & Demi - I suggest but THEY decide. XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    MUCH better parking job Robert - much more in keeping with your usual standards.

    However, I do have a little bone to pick with whoever wrote that little note on Delrin.


    The tensile strength of a material is expressed in units of pressure (psi) not units of force (lbs). So, while it may be correct to say that a tensile strength of 11,000 psi is more than a tensile strength of 9500 psi, it is not necessarily correct say the a structure made from the stronger material can withstand an extra 1500 lbs of force.

    That would only be true if the structure had a cross sectional area of exactly 1 sq.in.

    Anyhow - I don’t want to split hairs, but I also wouldn’t want anyone to break something and get hurt.
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2020
    gggGary, GLJ, Mailman and 1 other person like this.
  6. arcticXS

    arcticXS XS650 Junkie

    And that's what engineering is about. Getting things done exactly right, and avoid mistakes :)
    But I really, really wish the US could bin all those impractical imperial units, and get on with SI units. Once you get used to SI, you realize how extremely impractical units like inches, feet, yards, pounds, gallons, BTU, TONS (!) of AC capacity, and so on. Using both fractions and decimals. And loads of factors and constants. I could continue ranting about this all day...
    I mean, when an extremely conservative, and at times backwards, country like UK managed to go (mostly anyway) metric, then it should be possible in the US too
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2020
    MaxPete, GLJ and TwoManyXS1Bs like this.
  7. TwoManyXS1Bs

    TwoManyXS1Bs BBQ Hunter Top Contributor

    I'd love to switch over, but the concrete has set and not enuff flexible brain cells left.

    I guess we'll just have to die-off first...
  8. GLJ

    GLJ Never go faster than your guardian angle can fly. Top Contributor

    I googled Delrin. It was on the internet so it has to be true. :rolleyes:
    Does anyone know of a better product than Delrin to use?
    I also have some UHMW coming to try.
    gggGary and Jim like this.
  9. Mailman

    Mailman Hardly a Guru Top Contributor

    That one that you showed me reminded me of this, I’d seen this on HVC’s website. I always thought that looked like an improvement over that stock metal piece.
    MaxPete, Jim and GLJ like this.
  10. 2XSive

    2XSive At least one screw loose behind the handle bars XS650.com Supporter

    I figured you'd like the 31T sprocket. When I combined that sprocket with Mikes 5th gear OD and matching pinion gear, it really makes a nice difference at cruising 65mph.
    Mailman, Jim, GLJ and 1 other person like this.
  11. arcticXS

    arcticXS XS650 Junkie

    That RD part is just a rubber boot (at least the oem part is), to keep sand and dust away, the chain on an XS would eat it in no time.
    Jim and Mailman like this.
  12. Mailman

    Mailman Hardly a Guru Top Contributor

    Today was beautiful.....weather wise, 70 degrees and sunny so I finally had the opportunity to take my bike out for an extended high speed run and see how all of my changes worked out. First a little recap of the work done.

    1. New Emgo Goldwing replica bars, same grip position as stock, but more rise and a little more pullback.
    2. New , longer brake line.
    3. Emgo foam grips, to insulate vibration.
    4. New sprockets, standard 17T up front, and an “ overdrive” 31T for the rear
    5. New X-Ring chain

    6. Used highway pegs, with assorted new hardware necessary for mounting.

    Not related to the ergo experiment, but also done,
    7. Bronze swingarm bushing and swingarm pivot bolt

    Riding impression:
    I got it out for a 55 mile highway run , this is what the changes were aimed at, increasing comfort at highway speed.

    I am for the most part happy with all the changes, some more than others, as with many things....changing one thing leads to unintentional changes in the way other things work. Let’s go through them,

    1. The handlebars, I really do like these bars, they’re comfortable without looking like I have ape hangers. The seating position is more upright, and it’s more comfortable for my neck and shoulders. Sitting upright increases wind drag on your body, but once I put my windshield back on, all is well. I should say that at any speed lower than 55 mph the bars would feel just fine without the windshield. At highway speeds I found them comfortable. On a long ride that more upright position could move strain to my lower back, but I knew that going in. An unintended consequence is that sitting more upright moves my body further away and higher from the pocket of calm air that my small windshield provides and I have some increased buffeting.

    2. The brake line is a little on the long side, but it fits/ looks/ and works perfectly

    3. The foam grips, I know I know they look like an old mans velcro tennis shoes and I don’t care, absolutely no vibration gets through them, they are extremely comfortable to hold and the were a huge contributor to the bike being more comfortable at speed. They do such a good job of isolating vibrations that I found myself revving my motor higher between shift points unintentionally. I like them!

    4. Taller gearing, ding ding ding! We got a winner.....I’m loving the 31 tooth sprocket. Today depending on the grade of the highway, at 65mph my bike was running between 3500 rpm and 4000 rpm. That sounds like a lot of disparity, but I was in mountain foothills, lots of ups and downs. The motor easily pulls the taller gearing even in stop and go traffic around town.

    5. The X-Ring chain, boy this thing is a bruiser. It is big, wide and heavy, and I had to make some adjustment to my shift shaft guard or it will saw right into it. I’m wandering if a 520 X-Ring chain might’ve been a better choice? This one is overkill and rated ( I believe ) for up to a 1000cc bike.

    6. The highway bars......hmmm. I’m a little disappointed on these. I did use them , just to get the feel and a couple of things. One, they are all steel, directly mounted to the frame and they are really buzzy at speed. The other thing, try as I might to create the effect of a feet forward cruiser like 2M’s Victory, it’s not the same. The seat is too high and frankly to me the bike feels like I have better control of it with my feet on the stock pegs. I’m going to keep them, they are fine for stretching out your knees occasionally, but I can’t leave my feet there.

    7. The bushings were, well, just a necessary maintenance thing, that didn’t affect the feel at all.

    It was a fun project for me, it did create a more relaxed feel at high speeds which was my goal. I didn’t get around to modifying the seat this time, maybe a future project? My two 650’s now have more distinct characters, which I like. I also got to do a lot of detail work which I enjoy, so winner winner chicken dinner.
    Later! Bob :bike:
    ( some before and afters )
    1075B4DA-5F86-456D-A661-E041C4D5F231.jpeg 36764A93-D8D9-4B7E-9519-7DF6736F6609.jpeg 777F0F9D-F096-4BC2-BF17-D3E4EC90226A.jpeg 21F38807-B66F-4295-B1A3-A70214B382A1.jpeg
    tzimmerm, Raymondo, 2XSive and 6 others like this.
  13. TwoManyXS1Bs

    TwoManyXS1Bs BBQ Hunter Top Contributor

    I googled "delfin" and got some Ecuadorian football team.

    Don't recommend them for shaft protection.

    Bob, just for fun, remove your seat, lay a towel or piece of carpet atop the frame, try the ride...
    GLJ, MaxPete and Jim like this.
  14. Mailman

    Mailman Hardly a Guru Top Contributor

    Ha! I might have to try that. This bike has always sat high, you really feel like you are on top of it when you’re riding.
    MaxPete, Machine and TwoManyXS1Bs like this.
  15. TwoManyXS1Bs

    TwoManyXS1Bs BBQ Hunter Top Contributor

    I recall that stock seat height is about 31".
    Removing the seat should drop it down 3", to about 28".

    My Vegas seat height is about 27".
    My XS1B hardtail is about 25"...
    MaxPete likes this.
  16. arcticXS

    arcticXS XS650 Junkie

    "Delfin" is Norwegian for dolphin........
    TwoManyXS1Bs, GLJ and MaxPete like this.
  17. MaxPete

    MaxPete Lucille, Betty & Demi - I suggest but THEY decide. XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Delfin / Delrin ...bloody iPad spell checkers.....:cussing::wtf:

    On the bike: great review Bob. I also tried highway pegs on my XS650B back in the 70s and I found that I simply could not use them at all. Overall, it sounds as though the key things are the bars and the gearing change were the most effective updates.
    Great info!
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2020
    Raymondo, TwoManyXS1Bs, Jim and 2 others like this.
  18. 2XSive

    2XSive At least one screw loose behind the handle bars XS650.com Supporter

    I wanted a feet-forward relaxed, more cruiser-type bike but something that had some gitty-up. Gotta build yourself a bobber, MM. ;) Feet sit flat on the ground when still. Seat height is very low. Only down side is the seat could use some more cushion for any ride longer than an hour.
  19. Mailman

    Mailman Hardly a Guru Top Contributor

    You did such a nice job on that bike, I especially like the gas tank choice and the paint job is crazy nice! It’s a two wheeled classic hot rod! I had a modern low seat / feet forward cruiser ( Triumph ) that I dearly loved and probably should never had sold it. I spent a boatload of money customizing it. It was hands down the most comfortable bike I’ve ever owned ( and one of the prettiest too!)
    GLJ and Jim like this.
  20. 2XSive

    2XSive At least one screw loose behind the handle bars XS650.com Supporter

    Thanks MM. I didn't post it to "show off". A lot of better builds out there for sure. This one was done on the cheap, honestly. Most parts including gas tank/fender and exhaust were purchased used from members on this forum. I think I paid $50 for the motor and frame (motor was seized) but came with a title. This bike doesn't hold a candle to the quality of work you've done on your bikes, and I mean that. Was just poking at you...a lot of folks would love to see you start a new build thread.
    Mailman, GLJ, Jim and 1 other person like this.

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