Troubleshooting Reliability of Kickstart

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Tony Jara

XS650 Member
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Does anyone know if I need to Re-Time my engine....because I have a PMA(permanent magnet alternator) installed upon my bike and upgraded with electronic ignition W/capacitor...which requires no battery...Anyway...when I start my bike from cold it starts within 2 to 3 kicks....but after riding for about 45 min...stopping...then try to kick over again after a short cool down period....as well as walking the bike a few yards....I can't seem to engage and my kicks are too fluid....Compression starting always works....but only if I'm on a hill or someone pushing my fast enough...What else should I consider?....worn down Kickstart gears?...I also have new miniki 34 carbs on...My bike inches along when idling on the center stand sometimes?...could anyone give me any good ideas of what to do?????
 
Does the clutch slip? The kickstart runs through the clutch, so if it slips you'll get a kickstart that doesn't feel engaged.

The inching along on the stand is just vibration, nothing you can do about it.
 
once warmed up.. ck clutch adjustment.. first at the left engine side....then the h/bars... sounds like once the engine gets to operating temps.. clutch expands
 
:agree: clutch adjustment. Follow complete best practices on clutch perch, cable lube,route, worm adjustment, etc.
 
Yep, if something was wrong with the kickstarter itself it would slip at any temp.
 
Anytime a PMA & ignition has been installed, a hard stop TDC needs to be determined. permanently marked, correct timing marks established, timing set and checked at idle and full advance.
 
I think I'd be taking the bike back to that shop. Putting new timing marks on is part of the PMA install process and they should have done that. You paid for the job but they didn't complete it. You need timing marks to perform the routine maintenance on this bike (valve setting, timing check and adjustment). Granted, with an electronic ignition, you don't have to check or adjust it much, but sometimes it does need to be. And these bikes like their timing set exactly, which yours probably isn't. But there's no way to check that because you have no timing marks, lol.
 
There's a whole lot of stuff in your post that could be an issue...not even sure where to begin.

Get a manual if you don't have one and get familiar with your bike. If a shop did the work, then you may NOT want to take it back there but rather figure it out on your own...because the reality is, old bikes will need constant attention and maintenance. And learning every aspect will ensure you can handle things when you're stranded on the side of the road not to mention the cost to have someone else eff things up. :)

I guess I would start with a basic tune up, although as GGG mentioned, with a new ignition/charging system you'll need to find TDC and establish if it's correct since the stock components that made that easier aren't there anymore. However, it's not that hard with a little know-how & a home-made piston stop. For the carbs, you'll want to check if they've been balanced/synced and tuned...which lends itself to a ton of questions but perhaps that's down the road....since your issue is starting the bike. Did your starter get removed or simply bypassed without battery? If it's still there...you may want to install a battery temporarily to help with troubleshooting.

Just a few of my thoughts anyways....good luck
 
But advanced timing usually shows up as kickback, you stroke the lever, then immediately notice your right foot is flopping uselessly on the end of your leg. If in ignorance you had your knee locked while kick starting, you are posting during the ambulance ride to the hospital for surgery and months long "recovery".
 
Brassneck said:
There's a whole lot of stuff in your post that could be an issue...not even sure where to begin.

Get a manual if you don't have one and get familiar with your bike. If a shop did the work, then you may NOT want to take it back there but rather figure it out on your own...because the reality is, old bikes will need constant attention and maintenance. And learning every aspect will ensure you can handle things when you're stranded on the side of the road not to mention the cost to have someone else eff things up. :)

I guess I would start with a basic tune up, although as GGG mentioned, with a new ignition/charging system you'll need to find TDC and establish if it's correct since the stock components that made that easier aren't there anymore. However, it's not that hard with a little know-how & a home-made piston stop. For the carbs, you'll want to check if they've been balanced/synced and tuned...which lends itself to a ton of questions but perhaps that's down the road....since your issue is starting the bike. Did your starter get removed or simply bypassed without battery? If it's still there...you may want to install a battery temporarily to help with troubleshooting.

Just a few of my thoughts anyways....good luck
Click to expand...
No battery already spent money on 2 battery s in 5years....not an option.
 
Had a manual...its too complicated....need someone who knows what the hell their doing to show how....what is a Tdc....already had 4 sets of spark plugs changed and wires changed....new carbs are from Tc bros....to of which have already been conditioned for this engine....the starter was removed...could not find a decent one as a replacement....Can't figure it out on my own I don't have the guidance/training to do so.
 
Tony Jara said:
No battery already spent money on 2 battery s in 5years....not an option.
Click to expand...

Hi Tony,
2-1/2 years per battery in St. Paul Mn? Lucky you! Over-winter bike battery death is the usual thing in a cold climate.
Before swapping to a sidecar installed car battery I was avoiding the winterkill by tossing the bike's battery
in the fall and buying a new one in the spring.
 
Tony Jara said:
Had a manual...its too complicated....need someone who knows what the hell their doing to show how....what is a Tdc....already had 4 sets of spark plugs changed and wires changed....new carbs are from Tc bros....to of which have already been conditioned for this engine....the starter was removed...could not find a decent one as a replacement....Can't figure it out on my own I don't have the guidance/training to do so.
Click to expand...

I think you need to adjust your attitude............

You have the experienced guys on here, and they will help anyone with no knowledge of mechanics or any experience............tossing the manual is a no no because no one is going to want to help if that person doesn't want to help them selves......if your illiterate say so and that will make a difference.
 
650Skull said:
I think you need to adjust your attitude............

You have the experienced guys on here, and they will help anyone with no knowledge of mechanics or any experience............tossing the manual is a no no because no one is going to want to help if that person doesn't want to help them selves......if your illiterate say so and that will make a difference.
Click to expand...
Its
 
Seems like a tough spot to be in...over the 5 yrs you've had the bike it sounds like you haven't picked up much knowledge about the XS... they really are pretty simple bikes to work on. With some guidance from this group, we can probably walk you through every aspect that needs to be done...but we can't do it for you. So if you find that you are indeed interested in getting into the weeds with your bike, let us know and I'm sure you'll get a whole lot of ideas/advice from guys/gals that are more than happy to help.

That being said, and with all sincerity, my feeling is that you should probably sell it and get a modern bike...I think you'll be much happier in the long run. If you like twins, then a modern Triumph may be the best option. Furthermore, most shops these days don't really focus on vintage bikes and if they do, they're in high demand and charge a pretty penny for their work/knowledge....whereas a modern bike is much better supported by the big shops/dealerships.

Good luck with whatever direction you go with it.
 

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