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WELSH FLAT TRACK REVIVAL

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by Adamc, Aug 24, 2021.

  1. Mailman

    Mailman Hardly a Guru Top Contributor

    Your carbs look great, I hope they work perfectly when you reinstall them. A little tip on re installing them, a little dielectric grease smeared on the inside of your rubber carburetor mounts, makes the installation much easier and helps to get a nice seal when you tighten your clamps down.
     
    gggGary, Adamc, Raymond and 2 others like this.
  2. Jan_P

    Jan_P XS650 Guru Top Contributor

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    Not whining and complaining but can save a problem further on
    It looks on the picture that the right butterfly ( left in bike ) valve is not in line with the left.
    I would check that before installing.The carburetors ( Can be the picture angle )

    Also not seen diaphragms mentioned .. It is not so difficult to inspect them later .But again it is simpler to do it now when the Carburetors are on the
    Work Bench.
    Maybe write down at what slot the Needle is sitting in.
    And what jets are in .
    Making adjustment / re jetting plans simpler if one aims at perfection .
    I don't but some do.
    Those diaphragms can wear and even have holes . I cant remember anytime the bike fires right up after a Rebuild. So having the basic checks done now rather than When everything is installed. Can be an advantage.
    Having said that I cant see anything problematic in the carburetors .. Even if the Butterfly seals are old I think it will run
    Maybe not perfect but run.
    And the Problem with clogged carburetors can be an USA Problem with warmer climate and more additives in fuel
     
    Jim likes this.
  3. Adamc

    Adamc XS650 MEDDLER XS650.com Supporter

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    Thanks Jan
    Done all that stuff during the rebuild.
    Butterflies and needles all matched up and synchronised.
    Fine tuning the jetting etc when back on motor.
    It’s never been matched to the custom exhaust so will need doing.
    A.
     
    gggGary, Raymond and Jan_P like this.
  4. Adamc

    Adamc XS650 MEDDLER XS650.com Supporter

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    TWIDDLING THE JETS.........
    Sorry for disappearing but work comes first, and pays for the toys.
    The carb rebuild went fairly easily; pre-ordering the rebuild kit before beginning the job was well worth it.
    The old main jets that came out were somewhat oxidized and dirty. The size being 132.5 mains / 42.5 pilots as below.
    MAINS 1.JPEG MAINS 2.JPEG PILOT.JPEG

    By the way if you do not possess carb cleaning tools; then dental cleaning products make good substitutes:D
    Available in different sizes, they are great to get in the fiddly bits and bobs.
    IMG_1060.JPEG

    Diaphragms were in great condition, as were the needles (Used the new needles anyway / middle groove to start).
    Plastic floats were reset to BS34 spec @ 22mm from gasket deck (No gasket fitted when setting).
    Put all the new kit bits in. New gaskets, reassembled and we were ready to go.
    All other settings butterfly's etc were matched on the bench, as per Mr Miyagi on you tube.
    Mixture screw set 3&1/2 turns out.

    I had purchased new intake rubbers from Yambits to go with the refurbished original heat-shields and clamps.
    New metal braided fuel hoses (May change to fabric braided later?) New hose clips to finish.
    I reattached the old K&N pod filters; which were a pig to fit & foul the center frame tube (New Uni Foam ones on order).
    IMG_1044.JPEG IMG_1045.JPEG IMG_1053.JPG IMG_1055.JPEG

    Hooked up my off board fuel supply, checked all connections for security and leaks.
    Waited a few minutes for carbs to fill, and floats to do their job.
    Ignition on: CHECK
    Neutral light on: CHECK
    And fire her up: CHECK........
    AND SHE REVVED HER NUTS OFF!!!!!!
    :wtf:HIT THE KILL SWITCH.
    Mr Miyagi he tells lies.... regarding the idle setting and
    butterfly's.
    Backed off the idle screw and try again


    Started up nicely and ran without the pops and roughness of old; nor dying when throttle off as before.
    A few tweaks with the idle screw, and she runs great, revs up and returns to idle nicely.
    I will fine tune the carbs balance; but its not far off as is.

    I am a very happy chap, with a big smile to show for my efforts.
    Thanks to all on the forum who pointed me in the right direction; long may it continue.
    A.:smoke:
     

    Attached Files:

    thuban, Mailman, gggGary and 5 others like this.
  5. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Wohoooo!! :laugh2:
     
    thuban and gggGary like this.
  6. Mailman

    Mailman Hardly a Guru Top Contributor

    Congratulations on getting your carbs sorted, that’s a very satisfying feeling the first time you start it up! :thumbsup:
     
    thuban, jetmechmarty and Jim like this.
  7. Adamc

    Adamc XS650 MEDDLER XS650.com Supporter

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    Thanks Bob
    And to all those who have offered advise and encouragement so far.
    Next thing to tackle is the messy wiring loom.
    It works as the bike is currently configured. However, due to the custom build with non-standard switch-gear the loom has been hacked.
    I need to tidy up the messy bits and would like to install Moto-Gadget indicators.
    More to follow.
     
    Jim, Raymond and Mailman like this.
  8. Raymond

    Raymond XS650 rider & fettler XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Offered for what it might be worth. The wiring on my XS was a mess, due to having been hacked about by POs so something Had To Be Done.

    One approach is to buy a full wiring loom and try to work out what goes where.

    But the approach I took was to dismember the wiring, pulling out one cable at a time, taking notes and drawing diagrams. Took the opportunity to eliminate things you don't need such as lights checker, self-cancelling indicators and various safety relays to end up with a simpler wiring diagram. Then I bought tracer wire, Japanese bullet connectors and a crimper from Vehicle Wiring Products https://www.vehiclewiringproducts.co.uk/c-82-motorcycle-parts (other suppliers are available) and rebuilt it all. Resulted in a much simpler wiring system and which I can understand.
     
  9. Adamc

    Adamc XS650 MEDDLER XS650.com Supporter

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    Raymond,
    Thanks for this info; no doubt I will follow your lead.
    My initial look at the loom has the following connectors:
    Ejector seat.
    Exhaust smoke screen deploy (might be valve guides).
    Rear oil slick deploy (leaky gear selector seal).
    Cigar lighter.
    Front screen Demister.
    Rear massage function.
    Willy warmer attachment!
    This message will self destruct in a few hours
     
    Mailman, GLJ, Raymond and 1 other person like this.
  10. Raymond

    Raymond XS650 rider & fettler XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Adam, your bike has clearly had a distinguished career in film! Might have been Cubby Broccoli's on-set bike?
     
    Mailman and Jim like this.
  11. Adamc

    Adamc XS650 MEDDLER XS650.com Supporter

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    Honey Rider gave it to Sylvia Trench as her doctor said No. She auctioned it to Miss Taro. Tatiana Romanova stole it and Zora used it in From Russia with Love; Vida won it from her in a fight. Pussy Galore (Oh yes please!) swooped on it, Jill Masterson saw gold and nicked it. Tilly Masterson took a shine to it. Bonita & Dink hatch a plan to acquire it, but Domino Derval Thunder balled their plans. Fiona Volpe & Patricia Fearing feared the worst. Mademosielle La Porte thundered in with a French twist. Kissy Suzuki (a bit of a bike), Ami & Ling, nearly Lived Twice. Before Helga Brandt delivered it to Stavros, Onatop missed out.
    Now I own it.
     
    Raymond and Jim like this.
  12. Raymond

    Raymond XS650 rider & fettler XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Re-covering the seat is not in your plans then.
     
  13. jetmechmarty

    jetmechmarty Project collector XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    You kill me, Raymond. :laugh:
     
    Jim and Raymond like this.
  14. Adamc

    Adamc XS650 MEDDLER XS650.com Supporter

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    BRIGHT SPARK!

    Now my Welsh Flat Tracker lives again, and runs nicely; I'm looking to improve the reliability and safety of the electrical system.
    The wiring loom looks like the bastard son of Frankenstein's monster and Dracula's bride.
    FRANK.PNG + BRIDE.PNG = IMG_1069.JPEG
    As this bike was a custom build and the loom has been hacked into and 'made to work' with a collection of non-original lights and switches.
    The headlight and rear light suit the build but I cannot find any manufacturing marks to identify their origin.
    IMG_1078.JPEG REAR LIGHT.PNG
    Front light has main & dipped beam working off the left hand switch.; but the 'pass light' is not operational.
    Rear light works as does the brake light from front lever & foot brake.
    Lights are constantly on when the ignition is turned on; engine running or not.

    Currently no indicators are fitted, front or rear. The wiring for them seems to be present in both the switch and the loom.
    My intention is to install a discrete set of LED indicators from Motogadget; this will add some safety to the ride making me more visible to the myopic boneheads, both male and female, that drive 4 wheel boxes around these parts.

    My problem is that I'm unsure if the LED indicator kit will work with the loom bits and bobs currently on the bike (Images below):
    IMG_1069.JPEG IMG_1070.JPEG IMG_1071.JPEG IMG_1072.JPEG IMG_1073.JPEG
    1. Shows general view
    2. Beige box named 'Reserve Lighting Device' & two other small items?
    3. Regulator / Rectifier, Starter Solenoid & 'Hitachi Ignition Unit.
    4. Ignition Unit & Fuse Box.
    5. Connector for rear light. Also has I believe unconnected Indicator cables tied.

    Switch Gear is not branded; is decent quality, but looks to be from another machine.
    All cables are intact inside including the indicators left / right pan - push to cancel.
    Pass light on front is inoperative.
    High and low switch is connected and works.
    IMG_1076.JPEG IMG_1077.JPEG IMG_1074.JPEG IMG_1075.JPEG

    So my Question is do you think the LED's would work with the current Franken-Bride loom?
    Would I need a Motogadget Flasher / Resistor thingy?
    Or should I go the whole nine yards and install a full Motogadget Kit / Loom to replace the stuff I have?

    Your input is greatly valued......:umm:......:banghead:
    Keyboards at the ready.... Start Typing!
     
    Jim likes this.
  15. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    When working on someone else's spaghetti monster, there's a point of diminishing returns where you wish you'd just have ripped it all out and started from scratch. Knowing if you'll reach that point or not is crystal ball stuff. Unfortunately, mine has parts on backorder. :cautious:
    Yes, you'll need an LED compatible flasher... there's tons of 'em out there.
    I've always wanted to play with an M-unit Blue. :sneaky:

    Lose the "reserve lighting device." It's not working with the LED's anyway.
     
  16. Adamc

    Adamc XS650 MEDDLER XS650.com Supporter

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    Thanks Jim,
    You quoted on this thread at post #2 ''You have the 80 and newer factory TCI. It's a first generation electronic ignition. It's a good system''.
    Would this older system, which seems to work fine, be compatible with the M-Units?
     
    Jim likes this.
  17. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    I don't know enough about 'em to give a definite answer, but I'd be inclined to say yes. At it's basic, the M-unit is nothing more than a glorified switching unit. The TCI needs a switch to turn it off and on... so yeah, can't see why it wouldn't. :shrug:
     
    Adamc likes this.
  18. Adamc

    Adamc XS650 MEDDLER XS650.com Supporter

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    OK thanks Jim
    I will probably go the whole hog and do the lot......Yikes!!!
    Mybe try the indicators first and do the M-Unit over the winter.
    Cheers
    A.
     
    Jim likes this.
  19. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Iggy output is 10A.... more that enough for your TCI system.


    Untitled.png
     
  20. Adamc

    Adamc XS650 MEDDLER XS650.com Supporter

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    Nice one!
     
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