White Trash Bobber Resurection and Top end rebuild...IT RUNS!!!!!

[lidirtrider]

Alright, I got more done than I expected today. I cut the rings, and installed them on the pistons, and I was able to get them in the cylinders, and get the cylinder on and set in place. Jim, your engine assembly thread was a massive help!! I inserted the pistons and lowered the cylinder in place and used some 1/2 inch pvc as spacers while I installed the wrist pin circles. That works like a charm. My neighbor I share the garage with said the rubber band trick for the con rods was the smartest thing he's ever seen, and he's been a deisel mechanic for a long time!

Once that was all done, I cut some of the pvc into about 6 inch long pieces and slid them down over the cylinder studs, put some big 1/2 inch fender washers on the tops of the tubing and tightened the head nuts by hand to clamp the clyinder in place. That was the perfect stopping point until I can reassemble the head and istall the rest of the top end.

I've learned so much on this forum and if not for the help I've gotten here, I would have given on this bike a long time ago. I'm sure I'll have more questions soon, but untill then, THANKS EVERYONE!!

 

[Jim]

My neighbor I share the garage with said the rbbuer band trick for the con rods was the smartest thing he's ever seen, and he's been a deisel mechanic for a long time!

Thanks. Wish I could take credit for that little trick... but it's straight outta the Lycoming Engine overhaul manual...

 

[lidirtrider]

On a side note, just observing things as I disassembled the engine, I KNOW what some of the issues were. As nervous as I am about wat will happen when I finnaly start this bastard back up, I'm sure that I'm correcting numerous problems, and "shouldn't" have any more major smoke issiues. Some things that were arwry: no sealant on base gasket, missing several cylinder dowel pins, I definetly did not gap the rings, did not hone cylinder, and in general probably some sloppy work all around. So again, thanks to everyone here, this is finally going together the correct way.

 

[lidirtrider]

Got the head assembled tonight. New valve seals all around, and had already lapped the vavles. Everything went together fairly easily, and poured some denatured alcohol into intake and exhaust ports to check for leaks. I'm happy to report that not a single drip came through. Little by little, I'm getting there.

 

[lidirtrider]

Just had a thought, I know, hard to believe right? Anyway, I sent my carbs out to Rick West at Oldskoolcarbs, and I'm sure they're gonna be as good or better than new. I'm running a set of Pandemonium Ya Mama pipes. Straight open pipes, and Cone shaped pod filters. Should have him jet it differently, or ask to include some extra jets in different sizes when theyre done? What sizes should I get to have on hand?

 

[Jim]

Just had a thought, I know, hard to believe right? Anyway, I sent my carbs out to Rick West at Oldskoolcarbs, and I'm sure they're gonna be as good or better than new. I'm running a set of Pandemonium Ya Mama pipes. Straight open pipes, and Cone shaped pod filters. Should have him jet it differently, or ask to include some extra jets in different sizes when theyre done? What sizes should I get to have on hand?

Prolly best to ask Rick that question.

 

[lidirtrider]

Finally got some spare time to get out in the garage today. Got everything all buttoned up, thanks extensivly to Jims rebuild thread. I followed his instructions, and used exactly the same products and methods he used, so hopefully when I get this fired back up, everything works just the way its suppsed to. I still have a few things to do, first and foremost is putting the engine back in the frame. But other than that its all little things like setting the valves, and reinstalling the pamco and advance unit and things like that. Unfortunately, I also snapped one of the banjo bolts for the oil delivery pipe. FORTUNATELY, I was able to easily get the broken portion out of the rocker cover by gently tapping a small, but just larger than the hole in the bolt, star drive bit into the hole in the banjo bolt, and was able to unscrew it and remove it. Now I just have to order a new one, which is fine cause I'll be away for a few days anyway, and I wont have much time for the couple weeks anyway. with all that said, I'm excited that I got as far as I have, and it shouldnt be too much longer now.

So anyone got a spare oil pipe banjo bolt they'd like to donate?
Mikes wants 10 bucks for a pair and 8 bucks for shipping.

 

[5twins]

Don't buy the ones from Mike's, they're total shit. Get used originals if possible.

 

[Jim]

So anyone got a spare oil pipe banjo bolt they'd like to donate?
Mikes wants 10 bucks for a pair and 8 bucks for shipping.

Partzilla has OEM's for 6 bucks...

 

[lidirtrider]

Don't buy the ones from Mike's, they're total shit. Get used originals if possible.

It was a mikes bolt that broke. Wasnt even trying to torque it yet. Got it in finger tight then a few turns with a 17mm socket and poof. Thought i stripped the head cover at first. Thankfully was easy to get it out.

 

[lidirtrider]

Been a little while and havent got too much else done. I got new bolts for the oil pipe so I buttoned eveything up on the engine, and actually got it back in the frame by myself. Laid the frame on its side and shimied the engine and frame around till it dropped into place. Wasnt to bad. I took some pics of putting the head and rocker cover on and how I used some 1/2" pvc as spacers to clamp it down so I could work the cam in and get chain back in place without breaking the chain. Still waiting on my carbs from Rick at Oldskoolcarbs, so as soon as I get those I'll be able to start it up. Got a few odds and ends to do, like put the foot controls back on, and the left side cover and adjust the clutch, and pipes and stuff like that. Hopefully I can tackle that today.

Here's some pics.

 

[lidirtrider]

OK so long overdue update. I finally got my carbs back last night from Rick at Oldskoolcarbs. He had some issues going on and it took quite a while. I'm off work tomorrow and Saturday, so hopefully I'll be able to get outside and I'll finally be able to start this baby up and see if all my work was done properly. So...fingers crossed. Otherwise I'm gonna have to find someone with a bugle to play Taps for this old girl, cause I've had it.

 

[lidirtrider]

I got out in the garage yesterday and got everything all buttoned up. I tried to start and no go. Before I put the engine back in the frame, I spun it through a bunch of cycles so I know it was turning freely. I adjusted the valves and in doing that I had to crank the engine over several times, and I visually inspected everything so I know the pistons are not hitting a valve or anything like that. Once I had it back it the frame I kicked it over a few times and it kicked smoothly and freely, and I tried the electric start and everything worked fine.

So now heres the problem: It kicks and cranks fine with the ignition disconnected. Once I connect the ignition and try to start it its like the starter doesnt have enough power to get past the compression. I tried to kick start it and it kicked back so hard my ankle is still sore and a little swollen. I pulled the rotor off the PAMCO, and rotated it to the other notch and then it cranked fine and would pop (like a backfire) loudly every once in a while. I set back to original position and 1 or 2 cranks then stuggled to pass through compression.

Here my thoughts:
1 - I'm going to double check that the advance mech is installed correctly, and the springs and weights are good.
2 - I'll double check the valve settings
3 - Retard the timing as much as possible on the PAMCO plate
4 - Battery SEEMS good. Ballistic 8 cell - always kept on battery tender - the lights barley even dim when I hit the started button.

The carbs are basically brand new, fully rebuilt by Rick at Oldskool, so they SHOULD be fine.

I know its probably something simple, but any thoughts or ideas would be a big help.

 

[5twins]

Unless you're dealing with a re-phase, the Pamco rotor position shouldn't make any difference. It should work the same in either of the two positions available. I see you have a PMA. Is the PMA flywheel keyed to the crank or just a wedge fit? If no key then maybe it spun. If so then your cam timing could be off. You should probably verify that TDC according to the marks is indeed TDC in the motor.

 

[lidirtrider]

Unless you're dealing with a re-phase, the Pamco rotor position shouldn't make any difference. It should work the same in either of the two positions available. I see you have a PMA. Is the PMA flywheel keyed to the crank or just a wedge fit? If no key then maybe it spun. If so then your cam timing could be off. You should probably verify that TDC according to the marks is indeed TDC in the motor.

Forgot to mention that YES, it is a rephase. PMA is Hugh's, so its a press fit, and it secure on the crank. Triple checked TDC on crank/cam when installed. Was just out in the garage and re-adjusted cam chain tension. Readjusted valves. Removed and reinstalled advance unit and PAMCO. The valves seemed way out. It's pouring rain out today so cant take it outside just yet to give it try. I'm just leary about gasoline and hot things in enclosed spaces.

I did crank it over a couple time times and try the kick lever and it feels much better. Seems like less resistance than before. Maybe the cam chain and valve adjustment helped. The valves did seem pretty off. Hopefully it clears up enough to push it out and give it a try.

 

[lidirtrider]

forgot to ask...Looking at the PAMCO from the left side of the engine, which way do I roate the PAMCO plate to Advance/Retard the timing?
Counter clockwise = Retard? ... Clockwise = Advance?

 

[5twins]

Yes, the motor turns counterclockwise so rotating the timing plate clockwise will make it fire sooner or more advanced.

I understand that you aligned the cam properly (notch straight up) with the PMA flywheel mark set on the case TDC mark. But if the PMA flywheel has spun and moved on the crank, it's timing mark is no longer correct. You need to verify it by looking at the piston and making sure it is at TDC when the marks say it is.

Yes, the Pamco rotor mounting will matter with a re-phase, but I'm not familiar enough with them to be able to tell you which way is right. But luckily, you've only got two options, one's right the other's not. Sounds like you may have had it wrong initially.

 

[lidirtrider]

Yes, the motor turns counterclockwise so rotating the timing plate clockwise will make it fire sooner or more advanced.

I understand that you aligned the cam properly (notch straight up) with the PMA flywheel mark set on the case TDC mark. But if the PMA flywheel has spun and moved on the crank, it's timing mark is no longer correct. You need to verify it by looking at the piston and making sure it is at TDC when the marks say it is.

Yes, the Pamco rotor mounting will matter with a re-phase, but I'm not familiar enough with them to be able to tell you which way is right. But luckily, you've only got two options, one's right the other's not. Sounds like you may have had it wrong initially.

Thanks. I u nderstand about the pma moving and timing mark being off. Even with the marks that I made, I still always watch the intake valve open and close a watch through the spark plug to verify that the piston is at TDC when doing the vlave adjustment.

Could it just be that the valves needed an adjustment AND its just pretty high compression with the fresh rebuilt 750? Maybe the starter is just having trouble keeping up?

 

[5twins]

I suppose that's possible. I've never done a 750 kit but all the stock 650 ones I've done fired right up pretty much immediately.

 

[lidirtrider]

Carbs were also just rebuilt by Rick at Oldskool, but I suppose it is possible there a carb issue?

Prior to the engine rebuild it fired right up, so I'm a little lost now.