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Yam_Tech314's official build thread

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by G_YamTech_314, Nov 28, 2018.

  1. 5twins

    5twins XS650 Guru Top Contributor

    That seal ring isn't threaded, it just kinda looks that way. It's made of layered sheet metal and gasket material, asbestos maybe.

    Raymond and G_YamTech_314 like this.
  2. Do I need any kind of oil or lubricant on the cylinders when reinstalling the sleeves? I feel like I don't, but I want to be sure I'm asking
    Raymond likes this.
  3. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    I lube 'em more as a corrosion preventative measure than anything else. They are dissimilar metals in contact. Just any light oil/motor oil will work.
    Raymond likes this.
  4. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Make sure the sleeves are well seated as they cool. Have you read here?
    Raymond likes this.
  5. I have! Just did another quick skim and feel pretty prepared if I need to persuade them in... I had labeled them before removal so that's a check too.

    Filled a dropper with some oil to ensure I have no issues. I should have figured going in dry was a bad idea... Pretty much a rule with most things...
    Raymond and Jim like this.
  6. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Um... yeah... I ain't goin' there... :sneaky: :whistle:
    GLJ and G_YamTech_314 like this.
  7. Fair enough, lol. I'll update progress when these cylinders have sleeves in em'
    Jim likes this.
  8. And just like that, they slid right in. Gave each of them a good spin and moved them around in their bored pretty good to ensure even lube.

    30 minutes at 300° is the perfect number, as stated in your thread on how-to.

    Set my vice up to let them drop the whole way in. Made sure the notches were aligned with the respective holes, and now I just gotta wait for cooling.

    Attached Files:

    Raymond likes this.
  9. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    As was pointed out in that thread, they might (probably?) ride up slightly as they cool. Just keep an eye on 'em and tap 'em back down flush if they do.
    G_YamTech_314 likes this.
  10. They SEEM pretty good to me. I can't see a difference with the naked eye or by feel. They're still pretty warm so I can't get a long feel on them but I can't visibly see a difference in height
  11. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    Put a straight edge on 'em when they're cool enough. They look good.
  12. I'll be preparing a list of tools I'll need to purchase in order to properly rebuild my top end. How necessary is a ring gap filer?

    Also on the list is a piston ring compressor (which I know is NOT necessary, but surely handy to have for the future.)

    What recommendations do you all have for the brand of chain breaker and riveter you use for the cam chain install, and could I get one that works for a motorcycle drivechain as well?

    I'll be getting a torque wrench so my uncle doesn't get annoyed with me taking his all the time. I know snap on is expensive, but is it worth it, or is a HF special good enough?

    Just some thoughts.
    Raymond and Jim like this.
  13. Mailman

    Mailman Hardly a Guru Top Contributor

    I never used a ring gap filer, it wasn’t necessary for my build. It’s a pretty specialized tool and there are workarounds if you need to gap your rings.
    The ring compressor, didn’t buy one of those either. I put my pistons in from the bottom of the cylinders, the cylinder walls are tapered, larger at the bottom of the sleeve, they go in easily from the bottom. I used the popsicle stick method, but honestly I could’ve put them in with my fingers. If you put the pistons in from the top of the cylinders then a ring compressor would probably be a help.
    My chain breaker/ riveter came from Cycle gear, I can’t remember how much it cost me now, but it works for both drive and cam chains, just remember to grind the head off of the rivets you are trying to push out or you will put too much strain on your breaker.
    And as far as your torque wrench goes? Snap on is a great product, if I were a professional mechanic or money was no object, you bet! Me , I’m a cheap meat, I’ve got a 1/2” , a 3/8” , and a 1/4” all from Harbor Freight and they work just fine for a shade tree mechanic such as myself.
    Good luck buddy! The fun is just beginning! ;)
    G_YamTech_314, Raymond and GLJ like this.
  14. Jim

    Jim Beyond the edge is the unknown. Here be Dragons XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    I suppose it's a nice toy to have, but I just use a cutoff wheel chucked up in a die grinder.
    What Bob said above on the rest of the tools.
    I know in my buildup thread I used a ring compressor, but that's just because I've used it forever. If I didn't have it, I would have just used the stick method rather than buying one.
    G_YamTech_314, Raymond and GLJ like this.
  15. SomervilleXS650

    SomervilleXS650 XS650 Addict XS650.com Supporter

    Can’t speak for other bikes, but concur with Jim and Mailman that the XS ones can easily go in by hand from the bottom, or the popsicle stick technique is pretty easy too.

    While the standard “Pittsburgh” stuff from Harbor Freight is probably fine for the casual mechanic (like myself) I waited for a coupon and ended up getting one of the new Icon ones at HF (their new ‘premium’ line meant to compete with Snap On). Have to say, the fit and finish on them is pretty nice. You can get them for less than $100 with a coupon.
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2020
    G_YamTech_314, Raymond and Jim like this.
  16. 5twins

    5twins XS650 Guru Top Contributor

    Don't rule out a nice used Utica off eBay. These are high quality $200+ torque wrenches that can often be had for a song off eBay ($20 to $30). Keep in mind that a torque wrench operates best and most accurately in the middle of it's range. That means that eventually, you'll want to have several. A small one that goes up to 150-250 in/lbs is the ticket for the little bolts like the M6's that abound on these bikes. I use my little one probably the most of any I have. A 10-75 ft/lb model will cover most of your other needs.

  17. In school we just used ft lb wrenches and did math to convert to in/lb or vise versa. Honestly, I'll have more than one eventually, that being said, They need recalibrated after awhile anyways right? (Right..?) Or so I've been told that's the "right thing to do" I reckon I'll save my dollars and use popsicle sticks or my own two hands for the piston insertion. Just tried it with the old pistons and alas, it was simple. As far as a ring gap filer, are they gapped from factory?? How would I not need it? I'm so inexperienced it hurts lol
    Jim likes this.
  18. Raymond

    Raymond XS650 rider, fettler, setting out on a journey XS650.com Supporter Top Contributor

    In my limited experience, the rings are usually gapped about right when supplied, but obviously correct gap will depend on how the barrel is worn or what spec was used by the engineer who re-bored it.

    So you need to check the rings gaps but you might well not need to alter them. Take each ring and fit in the barrel it where it will end up living, use the piston to push the ring about 1/2" down the bore from the top, that way ensures the ring is square to the bore. Measure the end gap with feeler gauges. I can't remember the spec. But if there is no gap, or the ring overlaps itself (you've been sent the wrong rings!) it should be obvious that will cause a problem when the engine is run. A gap that is too small might vanish when everything gets hot. Less serious but if the gap is too large, there will be blow-by, loss of pressure.

    I am sure you will have read that when you fit the rings and pistons, the gaps need to positioned so that they do not align with each other. Using a clock face analogy, I think people place the gaps at 10, 2, 8 o'clock? Somebody will correct me . . .
    Jim and SomervilleXS650 like this.
  19. Yeah, I'm aware the gaps get positioned differently on the piston, though I'm not sure this matters for long because they can spin (wash) in the bore. I guess it's to ensure a good first start and break in...

    I'll check the gaps and hope they're right naturally.

    I guess I cant gap them properly until I get the cylinders rebored anyways.
    Jim, Raymond and SomervilleXS650 like this.

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