Are all center stands created equal? 1975B.

TFR Aussie

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I bought a new center stand & bolts for my 1975 B model, frame #447 123 750 from XS650 Direct and have problems with the stand being very vertical and the bike can rock forward off it.
I contacted them and they pointed out it states on the ad -

I do not remember why but we do have listed in the items description. "Replaces Stands on All North American 1974-84 XS650's". So, it appears it may not be compatible with European versions.

By the look of the below chart it is a US model. (I thought it may have been a Euro model).

I put a feeler gauge between the stand and the frame and there is a small gap, I would have thought it would be up hard on the rectangular stops welded into the frame. But even it there was no gap the stand would still be very upright.
As you can see in the attached pics it is very upright. I have never had a center stand fitted to this frame before as it didn’t come with one.


1654666895373.png

I thought they were the same across all models? This frame has not had a center stand since I've owned it so I have nothing to compare it too.
1654667267289.jpeg
 
Yes, it's not rotating forward enough. The stops on the fronts of the stand tubes should be almost parallel to the square stop in the frame .....

83StandInstalled3.jpg


Being an aftermarket part, maybe it's not made quite right? I can probably get you some measurements off an original for how much the stop sticks out from the tube.
 
No idea on any differences between European or American models, but keep in mind, Yamaha manufacturing processes at the time we're as rough as guts, I don't see any difference between Yamaha or after market parts quality. As long as one wheel is clear of the ground that's all you need and the gap may be due to the frame mounts spreading, rather than the stand mount area being too narrow, put a calliper between and measure I'd put my money on the mount spreading, given Yamaha's build quality.
That said, I'd be welding in some strengthening gussets between the toe hook and the stand, the toe hook has a tendency to separate from the stand ripping a hole in the stand leg.
 
Yes, it's not rotating forward enough. The stops on the fronts of the stand tubes should be almost parallel to the square stop in the frame .....

View attachment 216069

Being an aftermarket part, maybe it's not made quite right? I can probably get you some measurements off an original for how much the stop sticks out from the tube.
As I said above mate. I don't recon it's even touching the frame.
"I put a feeler gauge between the stand and the frame and there is a small gap, I would have thought it would be up hard on the rectangular stops welded into the frame. But even it there was no gap the stand would still be very upright."
 
Well, it's obviously hitting on something, stopping it from rotating forward enough. Are you using the proper shouldered mounting bolts? If not, maybe loosen them a bit and see if the stand will rotate forward more then? Here's the area on your repro stand that may be off, may be too wide. Also, on the left (yellow arrow) is the area that should hit the stop .....

StandStops.jpg
 
Well, it's obviously hitting on something, stopping it from rotating forward enough. Are you using the proper shouldered mounting bolts? If not, maybe loosen them a bit and see if the stand will rotate forward more then? Here's the area on your repro stand that may be off, may be too wide. Also, on the left (yellow arrow) is the area that should hit the stop .....

View attachment 216113
I bought these bolts from XS650 Direct to go with the stand and have loosened them etc, nice snug fit. I am going to get it off and have a good look.
1654737481186.png
1654737365700.png
 
I bought the same stand from XS650DIRECT for my ‘76 XS650C a while ago and noticed the same thing when the bike is on the stand. I haven’t really looked at it closely but I don’t think mine is that close to vertical, but it is super easy to push it forward off the stand. I’ll have a look to see if I can figure out what’s gone wrong. I still use the stand in the garage but wouldn’t trust it on a non level surface with the bike pointing downhill.
 
So Today I had a good look and the front of the stand is just coming into contact at the proper spot on both sides, but only just, right at the top and to the outside of the face, see attached pic. No play in the bolts and going by bosco659's comment above it looks like I'm not the only one with fit problems.
I still haven't heard back from XS650 Direct but I will send them this pic and the fact that I'm not the only one with this problem.
Looks like it might be out with the grinder on my new stand... :(
1654761685627.jpeg
 
I still use the stand in the garage but wouldn’t trust it on a non level surface with the bike pointing downhill.
In general with centre stands and side stands I only trust them on a level surface or with the bike pointing up any slight slope.

Wouldn't use the centre stand on anything other than a very slight upward slope, otherwise too difficult to pull it off the stand again.
 
Looks like the grinder is coming out.
So I have heard back from XS650 Direct which is where I bought this stand.
BTW, I didn't say they were different on different models, they did.
Their reply is below.

"Hi Greg,

I have looked into this for over an hour now and can't figure this out. It looks like some stands have a slight "bend" one way but then others are straight and then others have a slight bend the other way. So, I really do not know if the OEM should be or did have a slight bend somewhere. I also tried looking for a picture of an OEM piece but that apparently does not exist on the web to help give me a look. We have sold these for years and this is the first I have heard but as you said maybe certain models are slightly different and they are not perfect for some years? I am at a loss here.

If you think you can make it more sturdy some way I would go ahead and make the mod as this seems like a mystery as to what exactly is going on here.

Sorry I can't provide more insight into this, I have tried hard to find more information.
 
Yes, it looks like a little grinding on the spot it's making contact at now will allow it to rotate forward more. You can see in my pics how it should make contact farther down.
 
Yes, it looks like a little grinding on the spot it's making contact at now will allow it to rotate forward more. You can see in my pics how it should make contact farther down.
I haven't even mentioned yet how both legs also seem to come down on a different angle. Look at my original pic, I thought I was imagining it at first.
Sigh...
 
I think that you're going to have to "fettle" your new stand in order to get it to work properly.
Not the sort of thing that you expect in this age of "plug and play" consumer durables.
I wonder if a genuine NOS Yamaha stand would work perfectly, straight out of the box.
Yamahas original assembly and welding jigs were probably more accurate and more substantial than the ones 650 Direct use (or rather their supplier)
Never mind, if you get an acceptable result, after your efforts, it will be worth it.
Only to be expected on a 40/50 year old bike
 
On the later stands, it's normal for the left leg, the one with the tang, to angle out a little bit. See Grewth's thread on the '70-'73 stands for a little discussion on that.

All I've ever dealt with were '74 and newer used originals. I've repaired and braced the tangs on probably half a dozen, also did the grease fitting mod. Keeping the pivots well greased makes a big difference in how easily the stand deploys. I believe the braced tang makes it easier to deploy as well. I quite like this stand once it's been modded. My 650s are the easiest bikes I've ever owned to put on the centerstands.

The only difference I've noticed is the tang tube diameters. Some are the same for the whole length, some taper down to smaller tubing out at the end. I think the tapered ones look a little better.
 
Not only are some of the tangs made from tapered tube, but the tube is oval in cross section too.
The cross tube is straight round tube, but the main legs are larger section oval.
A real pig to fabricate if you wanted an authentic replica.
I welded a length of electrical conduit (at least I think it was) onto my stand as a tang, then used oxy-fuel to heat and bend it to the correct shape.
Cut to length then a 17mm nut welded on and ground down as the little cap on the tang.
Easy enough because I had a good stand to copy from, otherwise it would have been a nightmare.
But I didn't appreciate the gusset mod then, so now I've got rework it.
 
I have the same centre stand and shoulder bolt set up from XS650 Direct on my 1979 and it did take some minor fettling to fit.

Most notably, I had to get the floor jack out and slightly tweak and increase the distance between the two stand mounts (as out of the box they were too narrow/ splayed inward to fit into the tabs on the frame).

I’m wondering if this also might be part of the problem you are facing and the stand is binding before it can reach its full range of motion.

Maybe it is just the angle of your last photo but the mount looks tight to left within the frame tabs.
 
On the later stands, it's normal for the left leg, the one with the tang, to angle out a little bit. See Grewth's thread on the '70-'73 stands for a little discussion on that.

All I've ever dealt with were '74 and newer used originals. I've repaired and braced the tangs on probably half a dozen, also did the grease fitting mod. Keeping the pivots well greased makes a big difference in how easily the stand deploys. I believe the braced tang makes it easier to deploy as well. I quite like this stand once it's been modded. My 650s are the easiest bikes I've ever owned to put on the centerstands.

The only difference I've noticed is the tang tube diameters. Some are the same for the whole length, some taper down to smaller tubing out at the end. I think the tapered ones look a little better.
The angle its out is fore and aft, not out to the side. I knew about that one.
 
I have the same centre stand and shoulder bolt set up from XS650 Direct on my 1979 and it did take some minor fettling to fit.

Most notably, I had to get the floor jack out and slightly tweak and increase the distance between the two stand mounts (as out of the box they were too narrow/ splayed inward to fit into the tabs on the frame).

I’m wondering if this also might be part of the problem you are facing and the stand is binding before it can reach its full range of motion.

Maybe it is just the angle of your last photo but the mount looks tight to left within the frame tabs.
I got the grinder out and removed under 1mm from both the stand and where it rests on the frame and it is now a LOT better. I could have gone a little more but I will see how it settles in first.
 
Does anyone happen to know if the center stand from a 1978 XS1100 might fit a 1978 XS650? It seems that several parts are interchangeable between those two bikes but I'm guessing that the center stand is not one of them.
 
Does anyone happen to know if the center stand from a 1978 XS1100 might fit a 1978 XS650? It seems that several parts are interchangeable between those two bikes but I'm guessing that the center stand is not one of them.
XS650Direct are manufacturing them for standard models. I think they fit both standard & special.
 
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