First bike. New to me 1977 XS650. Have some questions

bhall1222

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Hey there guys. This is my first post on here and I am ready to dive into this world of the xs650. Here's a little background on me: I'm 26, have never owned or ridden a motorcycle (only dirt bikes years ago). I've always loved the looks of them and finally decided to pick one up. I'm not a gearhead at all... so this is a learning process for me.

I picked this bike up from a local guy in Orlando, FL, off of craigslist. He built the bike himself this past year and just rebuilt the motor, only has about 30 miles on it. I went and looked at it yesterday and he kick started it up and let me ride it (first motorcycle ride ever). Took a couple minutes to get used to it and I'm looking forward to learning to ride. He delivered it to my house last night. This morning I woke up all giddy and ready to at least take it for a spin around the neighborhood but for the life of me I can't get it started. I did everything he said as far as turn gas lines on, open choke, turn electric on, and kick the hell out of it. After doing it for a while with no result I called him and he said I may have flooded it. I emptied the bowls of gas which there was quite a bit in there. Tried it again and after maybe 10 kicks I finally got 1 to start it up. Idled super high for a quick couple seconds but then died. Tried a handful more times and no luck.

So, couple questions:
-is there any tricks to the kick start that I should know? I'm only 165lbs and honestly just don't feel like I have enough power in me to effectively kick it.
-This bike has no electric start on it, but I'm very interested in adding one as I'd really like to be able to ride it (obviously). Is this possible? and if so, how easy, or how much $ to do it through a shop? Doesn't seem like the kick start is for me.
-the previous owner didn't use a battery on the bike, but has this rectifier system I'm not familiar with whatsoever. Thoughts on this?

I know I'm completely new to this so any advice is much appreciated. Pics below for reference. Learning process for me, so please bear with me! Thank you all in advance!

Brian

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These bikes aren't hard to kick at all. Just gotta get the hang of it. I don't think you are but you can't hold the clutch in while trying to kick. I'm only 180lbs, your plenty big enough to kick start it

It appears you have a Pamco ignition and a PMA charging system. Not sure if you can run a starter with that set up or not, some one more knowledgable will come along.
 
Style be damned! Get a working front brake on that ride!
 
First thing is, 156ibs is 11 and half stone and I'm that. I can start mine fine. Most should start after two or three kicks. You're plenty big enough.

It may be that when you get it running properly it does require a certain technique. (I always need to open the throttle just a slight crack whereas I'm told thats not the way to do it.)

If it doesn't start easily there may be a a slight problem but this can lie in one of three areas. As a general rule if you have fuel, a spark and compression it ought to run (not necessarily very well but at least it should run).

Curious why the PO sold it after a build up with only 30 miles on it. I wouldn't say that was a sorted bike. Not saying that someone who knows what he's doing can't build a bike and get it running right right off the bat but us normal mortals might need a few hundred miles and some fiddling before we could declare it a reliable runner.

If you don't have ANY experience of engines you may have a long learning curve here but basically you need to check three areas:

Presence of a spark and that it occurs at the right time in the cycle (search for "timing" and PMA)
Presence of fuel and that the mixture of fuel and air is in the correct proportions (search for "carb quide")
That the fuel and air is being compressed (search for "checking compression")

If there is anyone near you who knows about bikes (even in general) you will be onto a winner but the information is all here. Just use the search button. Gonna post some more ....
 
Welcome to motorcycles and especially XS's. That's a pretty cool bobber, but unfortunately, not really a beginner bike, in my opinion as it's had a lot of the "comfort options" removed, like the electric start, etc. However, it's not impossible to learn on, and very basic as far as motorcycles go.

For starting, it would be a lot easier to kick start with the center stand in place, but since that's been removed, you're dealing with balance as well as compression on the kick...you'll get the hang of it with some practice.

Here's what has worked for me:
-Make sure its in neutral,
-make sure the kill switch is not on,
-make sure the gas is on,
-pull/turn the choke lever on,
-give it one or two twists of gas
-pull the kick lever out, put weight on it with your foot so that it rotates down and should at some point not want to keep going without a strong kick...
-then with all your weight, thrust down on it! (You may need to lean to your left to keep the bike from falling over. Also, mind your right hand isn't twisting on the throttle, which means you're giving it more gas).
This should get the bike to rumble, and if all goes well, start up....(if it rumbles and wants to start, you can give it a twist of gas at the same time you kick...this is more of a game to see what works for your bike)

Once started, let it run/get warm, with the choke still on... after a few minutes and if it's running good, turn the choke off, and that's pretty much it.

Notes:
-You may need to prime the kicker a few times to build up compression by letting the lever come back up and putting pressure to rotate it down again before you do that big thrust/kick.
-If you've given it plenty of gas (4 twists or more) then I wouldn't give it any more gas as that may cause flooding...(If it's flooded, you can just wait a bit and then try again... just don't give it more gas after that. If you drain the bowls then you need to switch the petcocks to prime to fill them back up...the bowls fill up with gas, that's normal...with flooding, you're essentially spraying gas into the intake valve/spark plugs get fouled and can't spark...thus, waiting helps dry them out).

Good luck
 
Let's not be pessimistic here. The seller was able to start it. You were able to ride it and it was delivered. It failed to start and he was able to diagnose that you'd flooded it. After a delay you were able to start it again but could keep it running. Nothing ringing alarm bells here.

Great advice from Brassneck. These bikes can take a bit of getting used to and each one is different to an extent (you have bought a "custom" bike).

Don't start pulling it apart until you are sure its more than just lack of "the knack".

"Flooded it" BTW doesn't mean the carb bowls are full of petrol (they're supposed to be). It usually means that by kicking repeatedly the plugs are now too wet with petrol to start. After a rest .... you messing with the bowls ... they've had a chance to dry out and will fire again. If you think you've got to this point again take the plugs out for a while. Go and have a cup of tea (LOL) and put them back in, and try again.

Looks like a well built bike. Hope you have a great time on it. I'm sure you will.

Come back if you need help. Lots of good people here.

Welcome to the forum.

Dave

(get a front brake)
 
With respect to Brassneck, I would see no value in twisting the throttle before starting as there is no accelerator pump in the carb and the slides rise by vacuum rather than a cable.

Other than that you are in good hands here for info; I admire your initiative in starting with a custom old bike, each has its own quirks. Looks like the seller got tired of trying to tame it, if you go through it methodically, it will take some time, but you will have a cool machine. Just hope you don't have to ride it to work Monday!
 
Al I can say is :yikes:. That cut-up contraption is totally wrong for a newcomer, with no mechanical experience. You're saying you will pay a shop to do mechanical work for you......................well that's going to cost you big time. These old bikes are really only suitable for people that have mechanical/electrical skills, so they can do their own work.

You would be much better off to buy a bike that was originally built in this century. With that newer bike, you stand half a chance of getting a bike that you can ride on a regular basis.

Could you get that bike to run reliably??............................maybe, but it will be lots of aggrevation and lots of money, if you think you can just take it to the local bike dealers.
 
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Prove them all wrong!! My first bike EVER! Only just got my licence, AND I have never done anything mechanical in my life before!! IT CAN BE DONE!!

The kickstart is a bit tricky, but the info above should get her going. You definately need a rear mudguard, unless you like your crack widened!!! I would also suggest a front brake of some form,the XS's rear brake is pretty much only good for holding the bike still on an incline!

As for the electric start, you will have to get a battery for that as that Cap will not be sufficient. Not that hard to do , you just need the motor, and the gears that go with it. Save yourself some bucks and get your hands dirty, that way you will also get to know your machine! You can read up all about it on this forum, loads of info to help you out. Besides, if an idiot like me can do it, it can't be that hard!!!!!

Good luck and keep us posted!!!

Bike looks nice BTW!!:thumbsup:
 
Looks like snow on that bike in one of the pics. Orlando get much snow?
BS34 carbs, pleated air filters, no mufflers and a gas stain on the spray bomb paint job on the left engine sidecover. Can't tell what kind of petcock.
Stick with it, get this one ironed out and you'll have a wealth of knowledge and experience.
Wishing the best for ya and welcome aboard.

Actually can't tell if they're tin tops or not.....
 
If you can tell me why that towel has been placed on the engine then you may, (long shot), be able to dig your way out of the hole your in.

That is going to take a lot of time and possibly money, not possibly money if your going to rely on a mechanic, lots of money.


If you cant tell me why the towel is placed there then SELL IT and get something more suited to your skills
 
If you can tell me why that towel has been placed on the engine then you may, (long shot), be able to dig your way out of the hole your in.

That is going to take a lot of time and possibly money, not possibly money if your going to rely on a mechanic, lots of money.


If you cant tell me why the towel is placed there then SELL IT and get something more suited to your skills

Heck, I thought that was snow........beer time for me, over.
 
Thank you guys for the kind words and advice so far. I understand this is something new for me, but that's why I bought it. I like learning and have no problem getting my hands dirty. I didn't mean to say I'm in no way mechanically inclined, I also own a boat with 40hp 2 stroke engine that I've done a fair share of work on (impeller, fuel pump, carb clean and tune, fuel pump, trim/tilt motor... etc.), of which it just took time to learn it all and now it runs great. That's the same outlook I have on this bike.

Yes I'm a looks guy, and I'm very happy with the look of this bike. The previous owner rode the bike for awhile after he was done building it, he just recently rebuilt the motor and said it's been running great. Hell, it ran great yesterday when it was up and running and it only took him maybe 3 kicks to get it started. Seemed rather easy yesterday, that's what has me confused today. Yes he told me it's a bit tougher to start cold.

I have a block to put under it which has helped me avoid the balancing act and that was how it was when I got it to start once. I guess I'm going to keep trying it tomorrow and see what happens.

If I do want to install an electric start, can anyone point me to a good thread for it? I searched but after looking at a few, I'd prefer to be guided to a good one by someone knowledgable on here if possible. It sounds like I'd need to change over to a battery system as well. Again, this is all new to me so I do appreciate the patience.

As far as why is the rag there... the brass screw in the bottom of the right bowl is leaking just a little. The PO made me aware of this and noted he tried a couple different washer types but it's still leaking just a hair. He's going to help me locate one that should finally seal it better. Any suggestions you have, I'm all ears.

Thank you guys again!

Brian
 
I agree with the others on....you probably bought a project. Who knows how well its tuned....any xs in a poor state of tune will be a bear to start. Pma systems with a cap can be a headache especially with all the Chinese junk as of late. You need to buy a manual, read the carb guide and probably buy a voltmeter or open your wallet to a shop that probably will suck and not do much to it. Old bikes take a skilled hand....none better than your own. Or...you buy a new bike.
 
If all else fails, and you can't get it to kick...you could always build one of these:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MOTORCYCLE-...pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts_13&hash=item259b2b9a42

Hey that looks looks like mine. but cleaner. that thing will start up a big engine.
http://www.xs650.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38834

bhall1222, Welcome to the site.
I wish you were just a bit closer I could help you out.
At 30 miles there still is work to do.
Right now before you ever try for a start. get your self a GOOD torque wrench I will bet you 10 to 1 the head needs to be retorqued. You need a manual at least the free download one which I use alot. I also have a hard copy. After you retorque the head check all the hard ware. Also the engine still needs to be broke in. A search in the forum will give you insite to that. I just went through the breakin process. After 20 or 30 miles would change that oil and clean the 2 screen filters. That needs to be done to get rid of rebuild and breakin debris. There is great info the tech section. You will be having to readjust the camchain and the valves at some point. There are videos on that. A lot to be learned. But if your up for it I'm sure we can help you with your learning process.
 
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