Front axle sleeve length vs bearing to bearing flange distance ????'s

gggGary

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Not an XS but I don't have a hard answer for this, the set up should be mostly universal?
While changing a tire, I felt a bad bearing in the front wheel. New to me bike 2008, 16K street miles no obvious water intrusion. Ordered new bearings and pulled the old, yup one was well on the way out felt rough and notchy, pulled a seal and it was ugly in there, bearing was too close to failure for my taste, inner race sloppy loose. Before pulling the old bearings I had noticed one race was sitting proud of the wheel flange, the other side flush, the axle sleeve was a bit loose. I tapped the bearing til the sleeve was snug but the bearings felt awful. So new bearings, put one in side set the sleeve in and things just didn't look right. Got out gauges and found the sleeve is .014" strong of the flange to flange distance. Now I don't know the engineering, but it seems like those two dimensions should be the same? anybody know?
old bearings, bad on the right.
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Measuring, zeroed at the flange, consistent at zero all the way around.
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then the end of the sleeve .013" to .015" tall of the flange.
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Got out gauges and found the sleeve is .014" strong of the flange to flange distance. Now I don't know the engineering, but it seems like those two dimensions should be the same? anybody know?
old bearings, bad on the right.
Only reason I can think of is if the inner race(s) are inset the same amount the sleeve is strong. If inner races are flush to outside races... then yeah... flange to flange and sleeve should be identical.
 
pretty much standard bearings 6005 flush inner and outer races.
the replacement bearings, these are deep groove the originals (NTN) look like they are not?

FAG 60052RSRC3 BEARING RUBBER SEALED 6005 2RSR C3 6005 2RS C3 25...
these are deep groove going by the thickness of the race faces, the originals (NTN) look like they are not?
 
Fersa sez they're deep groove. No call out for diff. inner race dia. If it were me, I'd prolly put the sleeve on a lathe. Might be why bearing went bad?

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Rethink.

Check the depths of the bearing recesses in the hub, see if they match, how far off from the bearing widths.

The question is,
Is the spacer too long, or
Are the bearing recess(es) too deep?
will do. one new bearing is in but the race thickness is quite acurate so it should be easy.
I'm with Jim thinking the "too long sleeve is causing bearing failure. more to come but gotta go make a chicken dinner.
Dragged in an XS650 front hub for some checking also.
 
Is the spacer too long, or
Are the bearing recess(es) too deep?
Either way... at the end of the day, flange to flange and sleeve have to match or you side load the inner races. If the recesses are too deep, that could be shimmed out on the axle..... outside the bearings.
 
Could be, it's intended to be that way. You can torque the axle nut fully and not worry about putting a load of side thrust on the bearings, a tiny bit of room for the outer race to seek its proper placement for the balls to roll freely isn't a bad thing. The outer races can't really go anywhere anyway with the axle bolted up.
 
Admit it, this is a Harley isn't it. Time to grab the 32oz. ball peen I think, lol.
 
Could be, it's intended to be that way. You can torque the axle nut fully and not worry about putting a load of side thrust on the bearings, a tiny bit of room for the outer race to seek its proper placement for the balls to roll freely isn't a bad thing. The outer races can't really go anywhere anyway with the axle bolted up.
I've considered that, but... Unless the outer races are seated on the hub flanges there is nothing to keep them from "cocking" in the hub bore. Front bearing wear is so common on this brand that changing bearings when you change tires is common.
 
Oh yeah, 1125 with that fine Aprillia motor! I almost bought a new one when Hardly Ableson put Buells on clearance, a dealer in the area had one marked down to around 6K out the door. The only thing that stopped me was Hardly QA--if the company survives it may someday reach Chinese standards.
 
Was directed to this from a "Buelly"
Info from a post by Al Lighton who ran American Sport Bike: “The design of the wheel shoulders and internal spacer tube are such that in the worst case tolerance stackup of NEW wheels, bearings, and spacer tubes, the inner race on the bearing OPPOSITE the caliper/rotor will be seated against the inner spacer with just less than 0.5mm clearance between the rear wheel shoulder and the outer race, and just less than 0.25mm on the front wheel. All of this assumes that the bearings are installed correctly (rotor side bearing seated in wheel, spacer installed, opposite bearing installed until inner race seats against spacer tube). What this means is that IF the bearings are installed correctly, AND the spacer tube is not damaged, overtorquing the axle slightly shouldn't cause an inelastic deformation of the spacer tube. If Mongo gets a hold of it and gets brutal with the breaker bar during installation, all bets are off. “

After chewing on all this I machined the spacer tube to match the flange to flange distance and assembled by driving the second bearing in till it seated on the flange. The tube is lightly captured between the races. I'm confident this is a better way to assemble the wheel.
Thanks for all the help and comments.
It appears Eric is not a follower of Mr Deming.
 
I'm confident this is a better way to assemble the wheel.
Me too. All that Buell engineering gobbledygook sounds like.... gobbledygook.... :rolleyes:
Best bet when using a spacer... is having the correct spacing. ;)
And... you said these were notorious for eating bearings. What does that tell you 'bout their way of doing it....
 
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