Miss November XS2 tribute

[gggGary]

Yes check for +12 on the green wire (outer, lower brush) when the ignition is turned on.
If there's no +12 then check for +12 on the brown at the regulator with ignition on.

 

[Raymond]

Thank you for the suggestions but further investigation will have to wait for a few days . . .

 

[gggGary]

Since you were in the bucket the reg brown wire/ terminal block connection would be my first guess.

 

[Raymond]

I have just checked voltage across the battery - with engine running at tick-over shows 12.01 v, revving to ~ 3,500 same, well the meter flickered to 12.03 but that's probably an artifact due to vibes. Bike is not charging.

Looked at wires to regulator - the brown feed wire shows 12.02V, the green out shows 0V - that's iggy ON but not running.

Looked at wires to the brushes. Both 0V show with bike ON but not running and still 0V with engine running.

Next will take tank and air filter boxes off to look at the fives wires running up from the alternator - three white, one green one black.

 

[Its been a long time]

Oh dear. I'm certain you'll soon be charging again

 

[Raymond]

Shade tree mechanic at work




Well, bit of more further poking about. Removed the brush holder so's to get at the slip rings - resistance between inner and outer 6.7 Ω, a little bit high? Both showed infinite resistance to ground. Then took the air filter box off and looked at the bundle from the alternator - resistance from the green wire to the outer brush ~ 1 Ω and to the inner brush 123 Ω but I don't know what that signifies.

Then I spotted this




Brown wire from the alt not plugged in - must have missed it when I did up all the earths. Which has me feeling cautiously optimistic. Tank off to get a better look, plugged into an earth socket that just happened to be available nearby, tank back on, started er up and went for a short blast along the bypass. The volt meter was reluctant to go above 11.5V but with a few revs did see it jump to 12.0V a couple times.

Not fully satisfied the charging is all it should be but I'm happy for today. Onwards and upwards - ain't said that fer a while.

 

[gggGary]

The volt meter was reluctant to go above 11.5V but with a few revs did see it jump to 12.0V a couple times

Yeah no charging, you need to see a solid ground on the top brush, then any time the iggys on the regulator should provide +12 to the lower brush as needed.

 

[Jim]

I have just checked voltage across the battery - with engine running at tick-over shows 12.01 v, revving to ~ 3,500 same, well the meter flickered to 12.03 but that's probably an artifact due to vibes. Bike is not charging.

Looked at wires to regulator - the brown feed wire shows 12.02V, the green out shows 0V - that's iggy ON but not running.

Looked at wires to the brushes. Both 0V show with bike ON but not running and still 0V with engine running.

Next will take tank and air filter boxes off to look at the fives wires running up from the alternator - three white, one green one black.

Raymond, that looks suspiciously like a type A regulator. Was that installed prior to your current** problem?

** No pun intended.

 

[Jim]

Raymond, that looks suspiciously like a type A regulator. Was that installed prior to your current** problem?

** No pun intended.

View attachment 376257

Brown wire from the alt not plugged in - must have missed it when I did up all the earths. Which has me feeling cautiously optimistic. Tank off to get a better look, plugged into an earth socket that just happened to be available nearby, tank back on, started er up and went for a short blast along the bypass. The volt meter was reluctant to go above 11.5V but with a few revs did see it jump to 12.0V a couple times.

'K... went back through this thread and you are indeed running the type A reg.

So... top inner brush (brown wire) is switched power. Should be 12V there
Bottom outer brush (green wire) is a regulated ground going to the regulator.

With the key on, try jumping the green wire to ground momentarily and see if your rotor magnetizes itself. ?

 

[Raymond]

Raymond, that looks suspiciously like a type A regulator. Was that installed prior to your current** problem?

** No pun intended.

View attachment 376257

Yes, I've had that reg for years since i first wired the bike. I remember discussion of Type A and B and I can't remember what Missy has - will look back over this thread tomorrow - going to bed now.

 

[Raymond]

Well, from my confussed understanding, I need a solid battery voltage at the inner brush as soon as the ignition is on but I've got none.
I assumed the brown wire was an earth but now I'm thinking otherwise - could that be the feed I need so to speak. To late now but that's where I'll start tomorrow.

Been out along the bypass on my Peugeot - it's windy today but managed a lot better on a bike you can change gears compared with the fixie.

 

[Wagner73]

Well, from my confussed understanding, I need a solid battery voltage at the inner brush as soon as the ignition is on but I've got none.
I assumed the brown wire was an earth but now I'm thinking otherwise - could that be the feed I need so to speak.

I know you're done a tonne of rewiring, but in the stock configuration a brown wire would be switched 12V.

 

[Raymond]

Fixed. First confirmed the obvious - the brown wire under the tank is from the inner brush. Took the power feed to the regulator, cut and inserted a double socket, to hook up the brown wire as well as the reg.

Then came the annoying bit - refitting the l/h air box. Sometimes a dirty, sweary struggle can be fun, ahem, but not in this context.

With everything back t'gether, kicked the bike into life and, as by now fully expected, the el cheapo voltmeter on the handlebar showed proper charging - just a few revs put it up to 14.1 volts. Whatever the actual voltage, that proves the fix is right.

So Miss November ready for her next outing, plus I have a more fuller understanding of alternator and exciter circuits, might even write a note to self.

 

[Raymond]

Lovely autumn morning, Missy back from a quick trip to the shops in Gala, first useful outing this year.

After the W800, the XS feels ruff . . .

 

[Its been a long time]

Pleasingly ruff, or simply ruff?

 

[Miker Vee]

Pleasingly ruff, or simply ruff?

Tina Turner ruff!?

 

[Raymond]

Ruff as in - not as sophisticated as the W800. A fair comparison, they're both middleweight twins, but the XS has a raw edge. More vibes, more clunky on/off the power, noisier, but manages to be fun. Which is better? Which is your favourite child?

 

[Its been a long time]

Ruff as in - not as sophisticated as the W800. A fair comparison, they're both middleweight twins, but the XS has a raw edge. More vibes, more clunky on/off the power, noisier, but manages to be fun. Which is better? Which is your favourite child?

Fairy snuff then.

I won't bore you repeating a story, but my ownership of a Hinckley Bonneville (faux 1970s bike) led directly to me buying the 650D back from the dead project bike. So I think I understand exactly where you're coming from with "ruff".

I'd be very worried for Kawasaki if 50 years of progress led to them making a ruff W800.

 

[Raymond]

Well, Missy got a good soak today - just a shopping trip to Gala, and the skies opened on the way home. But as Mrs pointed out, at least the XS didn't cough or splutter in all that rain, unlike some previous bikes.

Earlier, another ride along the by-pass on the Peugeot. The loop - down to the A68, along the bypass, which is slightly uphill, back through the village, 1.8 miles according to Google maps. As well as the slight incline on the by-pass, there's two short steep pitches in the village so I think it's a good workout for that distance. Five times in the past seven days - soon, I'll see if I make to to Tweedbank to say 'Thank you!' to the chaps at Just Cycle - about 5 1/2 miles each way.

 

[Raymond]

Last few days, Missy has been bopping for the shopping. Just over to Gala. But yesterday, had to use the W800 instead. The XS had petrol dripping down from l/h carb.

Today, tried taking float bowl off and gave up - awkward access, can't see what yer up to, so ended up taking off seat, tank, side panels, air boxes, and the flaming carbs. Not flaming as 'on fire' but as PITA to wiggle em out.

Couldn't see anything wrong, the floats float, no leaks, no detritus in the float bowl. However there is a just discernible ridge on the needle - would that be enough to cause the old girl to, ahem, leak so to speak?

AI asst says you can polish out a wear ridge on the float needle but not too sure.

And looking to see what's available in the way of replacement float needles, drew a blank. I don't think even Yambits has XS650 float needles. Are they unobtainium? Might try Steve at Motocarb.