Newbie to the xs world and bikes

650Skull

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all 4 ...........20amp :yikes:fuses

1x20 amp fuse for the ignition and 10amp every where else
xs12 82J-SJ-SK crop.jpg
 

Jan_P

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Ok ..
Are you trying to start the bike with the starter motor ?
That can be near impossible with an old bike with poor wiring and sub 12 V at the coil Even with no short in the starter circuit
The starter motor takes all the power .. ..Are you a kicking man ??
I have an 1980 but with no relays and stuff I would consider to disconect the starter motor and circuit temporarily.
Please sum up what you have done
Carburetors was cleaned
Is Spark plugs and gas tank and so OK.
I assume this being an electronic ignition I would take out the spark plugs and rest them against the cylinder head and
Look for sparks while kicking .
Please be careful and do the read up how it is done so the ignition wont get destroyed.
Since it ran a while there is something
Insert the plugs and try to Kick start report if bangs in the exhaust or kickback
Measure voltage across battery everything off
And measure Voltage ignition On .
Please report what you find
If it starts please measure voltage across battery.
 

fredintoon

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Ok ..
Are you trying to start the bike with the starter motor ?
That can be near impossible with an old bike with poor wiring and sub 12 V at the coil Even with no short in the starter circuit
Hi JosephP,
try jumping the bike's battery with your car's battery or even the "emergency start" setting on a good quality battery charger.
Like they said, an XS650's starter can suck up all of the stock battery's power so there's not enough left over to run the ignition.
Back when my own XS650 was shiny new it'd crank and crank on the starter but not fire up until I took my thumb off the button
with the engine still spinning over. Switched to a big ol' car battery in the sidecar and no more starting problem.
 

JosephP87

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I have a brand new battery that I just put in a few days ago. Tested the voltage and checks out good. I’m thinking it might be a ground issue or something simple. The bike runs (when I jump the points on the solenoid) just nothing happens when I hit the electric start button. I tested voltage and getting 11.6 at the coil when the switch is in the on position.
Bike has spark I pulled plugs payed them next to the motor and yup plenty of spark. I’m just trying to get the bike to start with the electric start button.
 

650Skull

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Loosing a volt to the coils...............have you cleaned the kill switch and ignition switch and connections inbetween
 

JosephP87

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Loosing a volt to the coils...............have you cleaned the kill switch and ignition switch and connections inbetween
Yes have done that…. Instead of using the harness in the headlight can I just wire the start/run switch direct? I’m not good with electrical but im sure there is a way to get it to work. Do you think the coil maybe bad? It appears to be the original
 

Jan_P

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So this is a running starting bike but it wont start with the starter button.
Nothing happens. The video is short please tell if that is right.
81 SH according to # 25

The video is to dark cannot see what is done where you start.
Please give info or a better video

If you found the wiring schematic please give info
It is a case of electrical fault finding in the starter circuit and yes it can be simpler to bypass it
It can even be a typical case where it is a good idea temporarily

Instead of using the harness in the headlight can I just wire the start/run switch direct?

via separate wires and a switch
Do you have a voltmeter and /or or test lamp
 

5twins

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The solenoid is nothing more than a big heavy duty switch that connects the heavy cable from the battery to the heavy cable running to the starter once it is triggered. What triggers it is the two small wires connected to it. One is a R/W wire coming from the starter/headlight safety relay. The other is the L/W wire coming from the start button. The R/W is power and the L/W puts it to ground and "flips the switch" on. These two small wires are the ones you need to check to figure out why the solenoid isn't being "triggered". As I tried to explain to you in an earlier post, that R/W power wire runs through a relay on it's way to the solenoid. You made no mention of even looking for that.
 

JRay77

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Unhook your Speedo and tach cables. Lube them well. They will break if you start this and they’re bound up. Also, the worse thing to do is start this without going thru it. Thing is 40 yrs old. Lube cylinders and turn over by hand a bunch. Like mentioned carbs need rebuilt. Think logically, rubber rots. Plastic insulation on wires rots. These starters draw a lot of amps. Got a leaky carbs and a starter short….. I know it sounds bad but re wire the thing. It’s 40+ yrs old. Then go thru fork seals, hydraulic brakes, bearings, blah blah. It’s a fun rewarding experience. You’re saving something.
 
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JosephP87

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The solenoid is nothing more than a big heavy duty switch that connects the heavy cable from the battery to the heavy cable running to the starter once it is triggered. What triggers it is the two small wires connected to it. One is a R/W wire coming from the starter/headlight safety relay. The other is the L/W wire coming from the start button. The R/W is power and the L/W puts it to ground and "flips the switch" on. These two small wires are the ones you need to check to figure out why the solenoid isn't being "triggered". As I tried to explain to you in an earlier post, that R/W power wire runs through a relay on it's way to the solenoid. You made no mention of even looking for that.
I did what you had suggested. As far as bypassing it and making a complete circuit. Sorry forgot to mention I did that.
 

JosephP87

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So this is a running starting bike but it wont start with the starter button.
Nothing happens. The video is short please tell if that is right.
81 SH according to # 25

The video is to dark cannot see what is done where you start.
Please give info or a better video

If you found the wiring schematic please give info
It is a case of electrical fault finding in the starter circuit and yes it can be simpler to bypass it
It can even be a typical case where it is a good idea temporarily

Instead of using the harness in the headlight can I just wire the start/run switch direct?

via separate wires and a switch
Do you have a voltmeter and /or or test lamp
Yes it’s a running bike it just won’t start with the new hand controls. Sorry the video was dark. I jumped the two bolts on the tarter solenoid to fire it up.
 

Jan_P

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OK Now If I am thinking out loud here

Firstly you have an electrical fault somewhere and I don't know what wiring you have and who knows what has been changed
Finding that fault I assume you want to get around

1642197419225.png


Consider this as a first step ( if you are willing to take the risk )
Disconnect the R/W from the solenoid -- cap it so it wont touch the metal or frame
Have a wire from + on battery again not touching any other things
One end on battery.
With the other end you touch the place where the now removed R/W was
Report if the starter spins and even better if the bike starts.
Obviously being careful not getting current into yourself
And after the test remove the wire altogether

Dont do this immediately so others have time to protest ,those with better knowledge about the other features that can prevent startup
and if this is wrong

look at post # 34

If it works a piece of wire with a springed starter button and a fuse can solve it.
 

JRay77

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My God. Just strip all the wiring out and start over. It’s not that hard. There’s simple bare bones diagrams. You’ll be chasing gremlins for months with this stock stuff. It’s old. Start over with all new. Reg/rec on. That’s if you’re rotor and stator aren’t bad too.
 

JosephP87

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My God. Just strip all the wiring out and start over. It’s not that hard. There’s simple bare bones diagrams. You’ll be chasing gremlins for months with this stock stuff. It’s old. Start over with all new. Reg/rec on. That’s if you’re rotor and stator aren’t bad too.
Well as mentioned before I am not an electrician and I have a wiring diagram but I’m not that confident in rewriting the whole bikebecause I’m not sure how to make everything work. If it’s not that hard than tell me good sir, how exactly should I wire the bike to make the hand controls, headlight, tail light/brake lights, turn signals, horn, etc work? Can you provide a diagram on how to do it if it’s so easy? Never wired a bike before so sorry for the ignorance.
 

JRay77

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It’s not ignorance. It’s just time consuming, if you’ve never done it before. One thing at a time. First look into your stator and ignition systems. Do they work? Look on here on how to test by using search engines. Then go on to your reg/rec. Still good? Upgrade to shunt style combo? Type of battery? Ignition switch? Then to upgrade fuse box? From there to components. Led turn signals and headlight? I honestly had a heck of time the first two. There are simplified diagrams on here. Use you manual as well. How much do you want to spend? Motogadget has some awesome stuff. I got some things at my local Autozone. Fuse box, led turn signal relay, wire connectors, etc. 12v dc is 12 vdc. Look into an aftermarket wiring harness. Surely they sell them.
 

JosephP87

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It’s not ignorance. It’s just time consuming, if you’ve never done it before. One thing at a time. First look into your stator and ignition systems. Do they work? Look on here on how to test by using search engines. Then go on to your reg/rec. Still good? Upgrade to shunt style combo? Type of battery? Ignition switch? Then to upgrade fuse box? From there to components. Led turn signals and headlight? I honestly had a heck of time the first two. There are simplified diagrams on here. Use you manual as well. How much do you want to spend? Motogadget has some awesome stuff. I got some things at my local Autozone. Fuse box, led turn signal relay, wire connectors, etc. 12v dc is 12 vdc. Look into an aftermarket wiring harness. Surely they sell them.
I unwrapped the whole harness and going wire by wire from a stock diagram now. Making sure everything is connected where it should be. I did find some splices so the old owner had to have gotten into the harness at some point. Yes time consuming but I want to make sure it’s correct.
 

Jim

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I did find some splices so the old owner had to have gotten into the harness at some point.
Not necessarily the PO doing the splicing. There's several splices from the factory in there. Mainly the brown (power) and black (ground), but there's others too.
 

JRay77

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It’s likely my attitude comes from the region I live in. Lol Bikes being left outside for decades. Even barn finds wiring is chewed up. I haven’t read this whole thread. I see Jim has chimed in. He rebuilds rotors. Who does that? Just sayin’ help is here.
 
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