Side to side play on swingarm pivot?

[jetmechmarty]

Just be sure that needle bearing kit doesn't use a needle thrust bearing like the kit Mike's sold back in the day. Directions said to limit torque on the swingarm bolt to 25 ftlbs. That's not enough to stabilize the frame at the swingarm pivot, and if you apply book torque you destroy the needle thrust bearings. Been there, done that, wiped my behind on the ugly T-shirt, installed bronze bushings and never looked back.

Arctic, to answer your question, that particular kit was not designed to take thrust loads on a bushing flange and a thrust plate (AKA grease seal), preventing lockup with an inner bushing ("tube") long enough to maintain clearance between nylonor bronze outer bushing flange and torque plate. One more time: Thrust load in that particular kit, which Mike's sold back in the early 90's, is taken up by sealed needle thrust bearings which replace the OE thrust plates. There are no thrust plates for a longer "tube" to engage. The fatter, shorter tube in the kit engages the needle thrust bearings. The needle thrust bearings can survive no more pressure than what is applied by tightening the swingarm axle to 25 ftlbs. 25 ftlbs is not enough to stabilize the frame at the swingarm pivot. Needle bearings in that locatiion provide no advantage over bronze bushings anyway. To sum up, the kit is not defective, it's simply wrong for frames in which the swingarm pivot requires adequate pressure to avoid excessive flexing.

The master’s words.

 

[JNaw]

The master’s words.

If I'm reading this correctly, is he referring to a kit that has flat washer style bearings on either end of the swingarm in the pivot area?

Cause if so, that's not what is installed in mine. It's a tubular needle bearing on either end of the shafts, from what I can tell anyways.

Looking at the kit, it's got nylon thrust washers instead of needle thrust bearings,

 

[gggGary]

there are two different clearance/forces dealt with here.
the tubular part of the bearings keep the swing arm from shifting up down fore aft yet allow smooth rotation
the end plates keep the swing arm from moving side to side while also allowing free rotational movement.
thnx Marty I vaguely remember those mikes parts now.

Bronze bushings

An AllBalls needle bearing kit with plain steel flanges to handle side loads.

 

[JNaw]

there are two different clearance/forces dealt with here.
the tubular part of the bearings keep the swing arm form shifting up down fore aft yet allow smooth rotation
the end plates keep the swing arm from moving side to side while also allowing free rotational movement.
thnx Marty I vaguely remember those mikes parts now.

Bronze bushings

View attachment 326580

An AllBalls needle bearing kit with plain steel flanges to handle side loads.
View attachment 326581

Yep that looks more like what was installed.

So, even after torquing to within spec and it getting rid of the Freeplay (my simple mind days that the pivot nut was just loose) it's still could be indicative of worn out bearings and should be replaced anyhow?

I'm reading that there's issues with the bearings flat spotting too, due to the bearings not able to complete a full rotation. Since the bikes not a track bike, may be best to just toss in the bronze bushings and call it a day.

 

[gggGary]

Yeah I'm not a fan of needle bearings in a limited motion pivot like these. BMW used needles on their swingarm pivots, Doesn't work well for them either.