That weird starter gear friction clip and a flooding question

[jurgenkoppen]

So I managed to solve the pesky starter slip issue on my bike, and now I have a buddy's bike in my shop with the same problem. However, when I squeezed his starter gear friction clip ( from Mike's XS) it went to far, cracked, so I had another old one , same thing. I feel that is is rediculous that this is still necessary to do this. Are there no good aftermarket clips which have the right tension without me taking it to the vice? Anyways I ordered 2 more, hoping that one will work out and give me the 7lb tension required, to be save . The 2nd issue is that Brian's bike floods when he stops for a while. He lets the gas out the bottom of the carbs and then it starts again. His is a 1976 with carbs that look like mine, in my 1978. I suspect that his flooding issue is a combination of his pet cock remaining on Prime since he has no vacuum activation lines hooked up, and evidently a sticky needle valve allowing the gas comes in. Or would it be a float issue...but then it would not run well at all... Any thought on these 2 issues?

 

[SteveP]

I had similar issues after rebuilding my carbs. Giving the float bowl a sharp tap with the handle of a screwdriver (or something similar) often frees up a stuck needle valve and stops the petrol flow. If that works it'll give you an idea that it's the float valve that's the problem. I found new float needle valves that came in rebuild kits did not work. I cleaned up the original mikuni valves and that sorted it.
I always turn off the petrol tap (petcock) when I stop.
I've got a similar issue with my drag clip. So far I haven't seen a solution, other than a vice.

 

[gggGary]

Starter spring; are you using a drill bit at the U to stop cracking? That part of the procedure was arrived at long ago.
Shut off manual petcocks when you stop the motor, it's part of the drill.
But yes BS38 needles and seats depend on metal to metal contact, they need close examination, replacement if worn.
Use the hot water float test, brass floats are often micro cracked where they are deep drawn formed in manufacture. New floats is usually part of my carb overhauls. Also check set float levels.

 

[jurgenkoppen]

Hi Steve and Gary, thank you for your input. I did try both approaches with the starter clip,1. the one with squeezing while on the cog without the drill bit , on the Mike's XS aftermarket clip, and broke that one. I never did get the 7lb tension, and then went too far .... Then I tried the other old OEM clip , but this time removed from the cog, and with the drill bit in the tight curve, but that one broke as well. The later one may have been compromised already, as it had come out of my bike, on a previous starter slip repair. Now I have some old new stock coming and intend to use it on one of Mike's aftermarket cogs. One the flooding front I will have a look inside the carbs today. They have aftermarket carb kits in them, according to the owner, but I also have some old original carbs here, maybe I will try the old stock needle valves it they seal better, as Steve mentioned. Also I intend to install 2 carb-cylinder boots from a 78 engine, with the barbs, and install proper vacuum lines, so that the petcock can do its thing with its vacuum activated flow....Hopefully that will resolve that issue.

 

[onkelheri]

here in germanys twin shop is a "electronic soft start relais" aviabele...
that made that the full electric Power gets free, after a blink of the eye, when the gears full engaged...

greetz heri

 

[jurgenkoppen]

here in germanys twin shop is a "electronic soft start relais" aviabele...
that made that the full electric Power gets free, after a blink of the eye, when the gears full engaged...

greetz heri

Hi Heri, so please tell me more. Where can I have a look at your solution? Es kann auch ruhig in Deutsch sein. Ich war selber mal ein Deutscher vom Kohlenpott in Duisburg....

 

[onkelheri]

Hi Heri, so please tell me more. Where can I have a look at your solution? Es kann auch ruhig in Deutsch sein. Ich war selber mal ein Deutscher vom Kohlenpott in Duisburg....

na dann glück auf jürgen,

https://www.twins-inn.com/epages/78210236.mobile/de_DE/?ObjectPath=/Shops/78210236/Products/AN031


hier der link dorthin.
in meinem scrambler ist es verbaut und wenn ich den anlasser denn mal benutze, dann klappt das ganz gut. besser wie das zufallgeschepper

 

[gggGary]

Vacuum petcocks should stop flowing when turned to on or reserve when used without vacuum lines....
Aftermarket kits are notorious for having wrong brass in them. confirm they match specs.
Around these parts only genuine Mikuni jets, no aftermarket.

 

[onkelheri]

hier das thema im deutschen forum

https://forum.xs650.de/viewtopic.php?p=289218&hilit=anlasser#p289218

 

[onkelheri]

https://forum.xs650.de/viewtopic.php?p=241660#p241660

 

[jurgenkoppen]

na dann glück auf jürgen,

https://www.twins-inn.com/epages/78210236.mobile/de_DE/?ObjectPath=/Shops/78210236/Products/AN031


hier der link dorthin.
in meinem scrambler ist es verbaut und wenn ich den anlasser denn mal benutze, dann klappt das ganz gut. besser wie das zufallgeschepper

Vielen Dank für den Link."Zufallsgeschepper", ein klassisches Deutsches Wort, gibt mir Nostalgia. Random-rattle would be the translation, I suppose... Alles Gute, J

 

[onkelheri]

also wenn du das filmchen nicht sehen kannst , musst du dich anmelden.
wollte es grade hochladen ... ist aber zu groß

 

[jurgenkoppen]

also wenn du das filmchen nicht sehen kannst , musst du dich anmelden.
wollte es grade hochladen ... ist aber zu groß

The German forum is interesting. However, at Euro 120 for the soft start relay, I am still wondering: I do not understand why the clip cannot be produced with the proper tension, so we do not have to squeeze it in a vice to make it work. Surely after 5 decades, someone ought to have been able to produce the clip that works off the shelf...? And thank you for the film clip, it is working

 

[SteveP]

My clip seemed to work well, without resorting to the vice.
I have used it loads. I've done around 250 miles since a total rebuild.
The starter has been used for priming the engine with oil, setting the camchain tension a few times. And loads of starting to adjust the carburettors.
I'm going to tension the clip when I change the oil to check everything is OK after the rebuild.
I'm hoping that the next 250 miles will only see the starter used maybe 5 times

 

[onkelheri]

i also use my 200 pound for the kicker

 

[onkelheri]

i presume the spiralfether is to strong ..

 

[cycleranger]

I recently repaired my starter drive using a Mike's XS gear and a NOS OEM clip.
I checked the clip drag and it was in spec without having to squeeze the clip.
(How long with it last? Time will tell.)
I measured the OEM clip wire diameter at 2.90mm and the Mike's clip at 2.80mm.
On the left is the OEM clip, on the right Mike's.

 

[onkelheri]

this fether make only friction that the "bendix" system would work. the bendix need to press also the spiralfether between the two gears. lf the tension of the Spiralfether went less, not much friction of the clip is needet. if there where more Space i would install a electric coil as magnet ... but i have too much work with carb's ..

greetz heri

 

[Wingedwheel]

I just picked this up for just such a situation. I’ve not had great luck with the Mikes springs.

 

[arcticXS]

I guess it should be possible to make these clips from larger diameter spring steel stock, and either grind the sides flat, or machine the groove wider (to allow a 0.5-1 mm thicker spring) There would be a fair bit of trial and error involved in making bending dies/ fixtures for this...