What have you done to your XS today?

[Lou_TX]

Took my XS to a car/moto show on Sunday and she developed some new squawks that needed addressing.
So I fixed a few, like a broken wire, loose mirror and an incorrectly routed throttle cable.

The biggest problem I found was that the digital speedometer kept intermittently cutting out and eventually reset itself to factory defaults. How, I haven't got the faintest clue.
So off with it, bring it in, hook up to a square wave generator and run it up to proper mileage (and set it to mph).
The intermittent cutting out was caused by an overly stretched power wire that I fixed and now it's all good again.

 

[FrankS]

While working on finding a short in the wiring, I'm waiting for the mail to deliver a carb float from ebay, and a bare metal gas tank for my 1978 xs650 Special. To match the new tank, I'm stripping the paint off the side covers. I'll clear coat the tank and panels after a mild scrub. I don't want to say polish. Going for a bare metal look. This pic is after 3 applications. Did 3 more and am ready to finish tomorrow after I get some steel wool Side covers were painted black. The bike was originally red.



Almost finished




Side covers and tank, bare metal. (oiled)

 

[Flash1977]

new for 2024

 

[Flash1977]

View attachment 334575

New for 2024

 

[NP2650]

The headlight switch was getting sticky on the XS1, and the associated high beam switch was also iffy (in high beam position the head light would occasionally go out). Figured it was time to take the assembly apart and clean/relube it. Having worked on something like this before, I disassembled it in a plastic tub, lest one of the small springs, clips, detent balls, etc. got a notion to fly off. It was full of 50 plus years of old grease and dirt, which was all removed and replaced with new grease. All the contacts also needed cleaning. I also took the time to replace the gray plastic sheathing that covers both sets of wire bundles. The old sheathing was dry and cracked, and someone at some point had taped them up and painted the tape gray - they looked pretty dodgy. Switches work perfectly now and the new sheathing looks great.

 

[FrankS]

The headlight switch was getting sticky on the XS1, and the associated high beam switch was also iffy (in high beam position the head light would occasionally go out). Figured it was time to take the assembly apart and clean/relube it. Having worked on something like this before, I disassembled it in a plastic tub, lest one of the small springs, clips, detent balls, etc. got a notion to fly off. It was full of 50 plus years of old grease and dirt, which was all removed and replaced with new grease. All the contacts also needed cleaning. I also took the time to replace the gray plastic sheathing that covers both sets of wire bundles. The old sheathing was dry and cracked, and someone at some point had taped them up and painted the tape gray - they looked pretty dodgy. Switches work perfectly now and the new sheathing looks great.View attachment 334641View attachment 334642

Where do you get this sheathing?

 

[NP2650]

Where do you get this sheathing?

Vintage Connectors has it in various diameters:

https://www.vintageconnections.com/products/copy-of-black-pvc-sleeving

 

[Vincenthdfan]

Vintage Connectors has it in various diameters:

https://www.vintageconnections.com/products/copy-of-black-pvc-sleeving

Great folks to deal with, I've purchased several sizes of vintage connectors and sheathing from them in the past...pretty quality stuff.

 

[FrankS]

And a few ounces of unwanted weight and 47 year old electronics removed. That's the turn signal cancellation and the stop light monitoring nonsense

View attachment 323157

I've disconnected the turn signal cancel box. Where do I find the stop light monitor thingie?

 

[Its been a long time]

I've disconnected the turn signal cancel box. Where do I find the stop light monitor thingie?

From memory, at the back of the battery box. Remove the plastic upper section of the rear mudguard (fender) and look at the upper back of the battery box. Just take a look to check, it's a few weeks since I did it and my memory isn't always perfect. Looks like the unit on the right of the picture in this post of mine -

https://www.xs650.com/threads/what-have-you-done-to-your-xs-today.32082/post-835359

 

[Its been a long time]

Not much time recently for XS650 stuff. This morning I investigated why it felt like the back brake was dragging slightly. Turns out it's not the brake dragging. When I loosen the rear wheel spindle nut, the dragging feeling goes away. When you tighten it, it comes back. There's a number of spacers in the assembly that could lead to preload on the wheel bearings as you tighten the spindle nut. It doesn't drag more as the nut is tightened. So I suspect spacer item number 7 is a little short due to past over tightening. But I think it could be any of the various spacers. I think the drag is enough to lead to premature bearing failure. I think I am going to have to remove the entire rear wheel assembly and rig up a jig where I can tighten the assembly like when it's in the swing arm. Then go through each spacer until I find the culprit. Doesn't sound like an easy fix to me. Bummer. I thought I was getting to the point I could ride this bike

 

[Raymond]

. . . then go through each spacer until I find the culprit. Doesn't sound like an easy fix to me. Bummer. I thought I was getting to the point I could ride this bike . . .

From what you say about the symptoms and your investigations so far, it sounds like your gloomy assessment might be correct.

But hopefully you will land on the culprit early on. I wonder if it might be worth taking a good look at the various components in that area, see if any look damaged, marked, forced, see how they sit next to each other. Do you need a special jig or can you use the swing arm? Plank under the centre stand gives more room, thin planks and wedges can help hold the wheel at needed height? Loosen off slowly, try and feel for probs? Might not take as much time as you think?

 

[Its been a long time]

From what you say about the symptoms and your investigations so far, it sounds like your gloomy assessment might be correct.

But hopefully you will land on the culprit early on. I wonder if it might be worth taking a good look at the various components in that area, see if any look damaged, marked, forced, see how they sit next to each other. Do you need a special jig or can you use the swing arm? Plank under the centre stand gives more room, thin planks and wedges can help hold the wheel at needed height? Loosen off slowly, try and feel for probs? Might not take as much time as you think?

Thanks for the comments. Actually, now I think about it, I just need to remove the wheel and brake plate. Leave the chain tensioners off, push the spindle through and fit washers under the spindle nut sufficient to let me tighten the assembly up. If my thinking is correct, tightening the spindle is the same like that as when it is when in the swing arm. I am pretty sure that's going to cause a drag/preload on the bearings like I'm seeing now. Since the drag doesn't increase with nut tightening, I am pretty confident in the diagnosis. What's a bit more difficult then is identifying the culprit component. My money is on spacer piece shown as number 7 on the exploded diagram. I have seen it before where overtightened spindle nut crushes the spacer and causes bearing preload, then early bearing failure.

At the moment, I think the best way to sort this out will be to strip the whole thing right down, refit new bearings and check it all as I go rebuilding it. That's a shame because the bearings in there look new and I just cleaned and greased them then fitted new seals which will now most likely need replacing again.

I said a while ago and it seems true. On this bike nothing is fixed at the first attempt. It always seems to take more than one attempt at anything to get it right.

Looking on the bright side, there's not much left on the entire bike that I haven't already gone through at least twice. I guess that's the risk I took buying a bike with no history and quite obviously been off the road for maybe 15 years.

What would be useful to hear is if anyone else has seen this on an XS650.

 

[FrankS]

If you think part #7 is slightly squished/shortened, could you add a shim washer to make up for that?

 

[Its been a long time]

If you think part #7 is slightly squished/shortened, could you add a shim washer to make up for that?

You could. But it wouldn't be a very long term solution. From experience, you would only expect a couple of thousandth crushing. Putting a thin shim in there is what you would do before selling it to someone else.

If I find a crushed spacer, I'll have a new one made to suit.

 

[Its been a long time]

You could. But it wouldn't be a very long term solution. From experience, you would only expect a couple of thousandth crushing. Putting a thin shim in there is what you would do before selling it to someone else.

If I find a crushed spacer, I'll have a new one made to suit.

And here's a link showing me the length of the spacer I suspect is the problem. Thanks of course, go to the usual suspects

https://www.xs650.com/threads/bearing-spacers.60224/post-704300

And -

https://www.xs650.com/threads/bearing-spacers.60224/post-757973

 

[Adamc]

Thanks for the comments. Actually, now I think about it, I just need to remove the wheel and brake plate. Leave the chain tensioners off, push the spindle through and fit washers under the spindle nut sufficient to let me tighten the assembly up. If my thinking is correct, tightening the spindle is the same like that as when it is when in the swing arm. I am pretty sure that's going to cause a drag/preload on the bearings like I'm seeing now. Since the drag doesn't increase with nut tightening, I am pretty confident in the diagnosis. What's a bit more difficult then is identifying the culprit component. My money is on spacer piece shown as number 7 on the exploded diagram. I have seen it before where overtightened spindle nut crushes the spacer and causes bearing preload, then early bearing failure.

At the moment, I think the best way to sort this out will be to strip the whole thing right down, refit new bearings and check it all as I go rebuilding it. That's a shame because the bearings in there look new and I just cleaned and greased them then fitted new seals which will now most likely need replacing again.

I said a while ago and it seems true. On this bike nothing is fixed at the first attempt. It always seems to take more than one attempt at anything to get it right.

Looking on the bright side, there's not much left on the entire bike that I haven't already gone through at least twice. I guess that's the risk I took buying a bike with no history and quite obviously been off the road for maybe 15 years.

What would be useful to hear is if anyone else has seen this on an XS650.

I had exactly the same symptoms with Taffy on my new disc wheel build with custom made spacers to fit (Didn't happen with the old stock wheel/spacers).
I now adjust the wheel for alignment and then tighten the spindle nut until the dragging begins and back off an 8th. Its still bloody tight enough to prevent spindle movement.

 

[Its been a long time]

I had exactly the same symptoms with Taffy on my new disc wheel build with custom made spacers to fit (Didn't happen with the old stock wheel/spacers).
I now adjust the wheel for alignment and then tighten the spindle nut until the dragging begins and back off an 8th. Its still bloody tight enough to prevent spindle movement.

Thanks. Sadly, not an option on this one. As soon as you snug the nut up with a spanner, the dragging starts. Doesn't get any worse as you fully tighten which suggests to me the bearings are taking a thou or two of preload when they shouldn't do.

 

[atom4488]

Haven't had much time for bikes lately, as I'm in up to my eyeballs on a boat build project. Did take a little time tonight to turn up some front spring pre-load spacers for a set of forks that are getting overhauled and lightly modified for my next build.

 

[Oldfartaussie]

Not much time recently for XS650 stuff. This morning I investigated why it felt like the back brake was dragging slightly. Turns out it's not the brake dragging. When I loosen the rear wheel spindle nut, the dragging feeling goes away. When you tighten it, it comes back. There's a number of spacers in the assembly that could lead to preload on the wheel bearings as you tighten the spindle nut. It doesn't drag more as the nut is tightened. So I suspect spacer item number 7 is a little short due to past over tightening. But I think it could be any of the various spacers. I think the drag is enough to lead to premature bearing failure. I think I am going to have to remove the entire rear wheel assembly and rig up a jig where I can tighten the assembly like when it's in the swing arm. Then go through each spacer until I find the culprit. Doesn't sound like an easy fix to me. Bummer. I thought I was getting to the point I could ride this bike

View attachment 334734

View attachment 334735

Thanks for the comments. Actually, now I think about it, I just need to remove the wheel and brake plate. Leave the chain tensioners off, push the spindle through and fit washers under the spindle nut sufficient to let me tighten the assembly up. If my thinking is correct, tightening the spindle is the same like that as when it is when in the swing arm. I am pretty sure that's going to cause a drag/preload on the bearings like I'm seeing now. Since the drag doesn't increase with nut tightening, I am pretty confident in the diagnosis. What's a bit more difficult then is identifying the culprit component. My money is on spacer piece shown as number 7 on the exploded diagram. I have seen it before where overtightened spindle nut crushes the spacer and causes bearing preload, then early bearing failure.

At the moment, I think the best way to sort this out will be to strip the whole thing right down, refit new bearings and check it all as I go rebuilding it. That's a shame because the bearings in there look new and I just cleaned and greased them then fitted new seals which will now most likely need replacing again.

I said a while ago and it seems true. On this bike nothing is fixed at the first attempt. It always seems to take more than one attempt at anything to get it right.

Looking on the bright side, there's not much left on the entire bike that I haven't already gone through at least twice. I guess that's the risk I took buying a bike with no history and quite obviously been off the road for maybe 15 years.

What would be useful to hear is if anyone else has seen this on an XS650.

Good luck finding the solution to the binding issue.
My 78 special has a recurring rear axle side play issue that has returned.
I have replaced the bearings and seals barely six months ago and also the dust covers that I got from csml with the one collar that is still available. I have also replaced the rear brake calliper hanger as well as the swing arm bearings and shaft.
I have previously added a shim washer to the rear axle on the outside of collar 22 which helped for a while.
Any ideas are appreciated and I will soon be swapping out the standard wheels for new wire spoke wheels and looking at the aluminium swing arm from Motolana.