XS Valve

Wally

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Ha Gents

My XS café has over sized valves in it 2mm over on inlet & 1mm over on outlet I need to replace them & don't know were they came from, I hear its a early mod does anyone know what these may have come out of or did they make them up in the day???
 
Hi Wally,
I have the same in my bike. The inlet came from 650 Central and the exhaust from Dave Rayner when he was trading as XSories. Perhaps you could try them and they may be able to point you in the right direction. 650 Central does not list them on the website any more and I don't think XSories is still trading.
It would be good to know if you find a source just in case...
 
There's a vendor on eBay, smw70ss, that sells XS oversize valves and 'beehive' valve spring sets. He sell the valves as full sets of 4, or will make a custom size at $55 each...
 
There's a vendor on eBay, smw70ss, that sells XS oversize valves and 'beehive' valve spring sets. He sell the valves as full sets of 4, or will make a custom size at $55 each...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/YAMAHA-XS650-XS-650-OVERSIZE-VALVES-INTAKE-EXHAUST-NEW-/300493792787

Still needs a valve job. I'd recommend splurging and dealing with a high end racing machine shop with a Serdi to do one.

I've bought retainers and seals from that seller. Super fast shipping and a nice guy to talk to via phone. The parts look great as well.
 
when you buy Mikes stainless steel valves do you also change to valve guides to bronze as well
 
Not sure, but you need to fit the guides to the valves. Usually it's just easier to have the old ones knocked out, new ones installed, and have gr guides reamed to size. Keep in mind bronze guides need a little more clearance. Any machine shop doing performance work knows this.
 
when you buy Mikes stainless steel valves do you also change to valve guides to bronze as well

Wally, I would advise you to look else where for valve replacement as Mikes valves aren't manufactured to the greatest quality of a comparable stock replacement or aftermarket supplier.I have seen what happens when these valve's decide to take a crap and you don't want to experience this by any means. The exhaust guides are where you want the best materials and hardest due to the extreme heat and resistance of the port which can lead to a valve guides short life expectancy and a Manganese exhaust guide or liner would be a optimal choice to look at and due to the lubrication properties of bronze you can tighten up the clearances a tab to stabilize the valves and to reduce oil seepage past the valves.
 
due to the lubrication properties of bronze you can tighten up the clearances a tab to stabilize the valves and to reduce oil seepage past the valves.

Bronze has a higher coefficient of thermal expansion. Run tighter clearances and you stand a good chance of seizing a valve. This is especially true with iron heads. I've seen that play out a few times at the track.

To the op, guide clearance depends on a lot of things, partly on valve seat contact width (how hot the valve gets), material of the valve, use (running WOT for miles at a time like land speed racing is going to make for a hotter valve), and material of the guide.

Your best best if you contact Chris @ Schumann is to let him do it. He knows where clearances should be for his stuff. Edit: It also looks like he has a Serdi and does valve work. Honestly, I would just send him the head tell him you want his valves, liners, and a valve job, and be done with it.

Note exactly sure what the motors want on angles. Probably go with a full radius with a 45* seat on the exhaust (no back cut! you don't want to promote better flow in the opposite direction). A a 3-5 angle on the intake valve, with a back cut. Go with a 45* seat on a street bike, 50* seat on a race set-up.

edit: I see you're in Australia. I guess your best bet is to call him up, ask where things need to be and have a local component machinist do the work. Lots of race engines being built there, so there are some great performance machinists around.
 
Last edited:
Bronze has a higher coefficient of thermal expansion. Run tighter clearances and you stand a good chance of seizing a valve. This is especially true with iron heads. I've seen that play out a few times at the track.

To the op, guide clearance depends on a lot of things, partly on valve seat contact width (how hot the valve gets), material of the valve, use (running WOT for miles at a time like land speed racing is going to make for a hotter valve), and material of the guide.

Your best best if you contact Chris @ Schumann is to let him do it. He knows where clearances should be for his stuff. Edit: It also looks like he has a Serdi and does valve work. Honestly, I would just send him the head tell him you want his valves, liners, and a valve job, and be done with it.

Note exactly sure what the motors want on angles. Probably go with a full radius with a 45* seat on the exhaust (no back cut! you don't want to promote better flow in the opposite direction). A a 3-5 angle on the intake valve, with a back cut. Go with a 45* seat on a street bike, 50* seat on a race set-up.

edit: I see you're in Australia. I guess your best bet is to call him up, ask where things need to be and have a local component machinist do the work. Lots of race engines being built there, so there are some great performance machinists around.

I know some well to do established engine builders who us bronze guides and run the clearances super tight down to .008 intakes and 1.2 to 1.5 for the exhaust and me I'll run'em tighter than a virgin at .005 for intakes and .001 for the exhaust and have yet to experience valve seize under any condition. When you start mixing opposite materials of coefficient thermal expansions, you open the door to seizer problems.
 
I know some well to do established engine builders who us bronze guides and run the clearances super tight down to .008 intakes and 1.2 to 1.5 for the exhaust and me I'll run'em tighter than a virgin at .005 for intakes and .001 for the exhaust and have yet to experience valve seize under any condition. When you start mixing opposite materials of coefficient thermal expansions, you open the door to seizer problems.

Agreed. Not here for pissing contest but will share the following: Most of my experience with altering stem to guide clearance has been with 11/32" stems but obviously the clearances would get tighter the smaller the diameter. That being said, I have typically been able to run tighter clearances with bronze guides, .0015 intake and .0018 exhaust for n.a. application up to 1.5 hp/c.i. and used more clearance with titanium valves.

I have found manganese bronze to be tougher than phosphorous bronze and have been able to run tighter clearances with this material. I have not had the best of luck with aluminum bronze guides and have experienced galling even with .002 clearance.

In all this time I have only had one valve stick on a circle track application but I have it on good authority that he broke the engine in using fuel in cell from last season. Plus it was an intake valve. Fuel causes more sticking than you may believe. I do cold cranking tests on sbc engines in 20 below zero conditions using different fuels and it is quite common to have a "sticker".

But, am new to xs650s so thanks for all the help from you guys.
 
Agreed. Not here for pissing contest but will share the following: Most of my experience with altering stem to guide clearance has been with 11/32" stems but obviously the clearances would get tighter the smaller the diameter. That being said, I have typically been able to run tighter clearances with bronze guides, .0015 intake and .0018 exhaust for n.a. application up to 1.5 hp/c.i. and used more clearance with titanium valves.

I have found manganese bronze to be tougher than phosphorous bronze and have been able to run tighter clearances with this material. I have not had the best of luck with aluminum bronze guides and have experienced galling even with .002 clearance.

In all this time I have only had one valve stick on a circle track application but I have it on good authority that he broke the engine in using fuel in cell from last season. Plus it was an intake valve. Fuel causes more sticking than you may believe. I do cold cranking tests on sbc engines in 20 below zero conditions using different fuels and it is quite common to have a "sticker".

But, am new to xs650s so thanks for all the help from you guys.

Same here,just trying to pass along informative feed back from real life experiences like yourself. Don't visit here often,so let me say welcome aboard.
 
Yep I was looking at them as well,,,, but besides all the great info provided
Yes Or No do you need to replace valve guides if using stainless valves

http://valvetrain.kpmivalvetrain.com/category/alvetrain-components-yamaha-xs-650-br-1970-to-1983

I f you plan on twisting the throttle WFO frequently while using stock quide's,it would good insurance to have the stainless valve stems chromed plated running stock clearances or galling could become an issue. When selection valves you need to remember that you have TWO different environments hot and a cold that require two different metal alloys with the emphasis on the exhaust valve importance and I've had bad luck with Kibblewhite E/V faces sinking to a cup like appearance after 15,000 miles of cycles, just cuz you pay an overly outrageous price doesn't make the valve a good choice,I know I'll never use those valves again. Stay away from Phosphor bronze guides or liners,it's to soft for street use and will wear quickly over cast iron guides. It's ok for race engines but not street.

http://caddy500.com/index.php?topic=68.5;wap2
 
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