CDNTX650
XS650 Guru
A buddy has a Gas Gas 450 enduro...Magnetti Marelli EFI with Kick and Electric. Will not even remotely think of firing with the Kicker. E-start fires it right up. Apparantly they all do it too.
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2013 XS650
- Thread starter Atrvo
- Start date
Scrambled
Motorcycle Man
Nostalgia, same reason we XS owners have for owning our obsolete antique bikes. And , back in the day the kick start would get you going if your battery was low or your starter motor quit . ( I actually owned motorcycles that didn't even have electric start )
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Why in the world someone would kickstart when all they have to do is push a button is a mystery to me and most other riders...........
Think of it as "foreplay".
Scrambled
Motorcycle Man
Hey, did you get those tank badges ready yet Resto ? You can PM me with details .
ProSimex
XS650 Addict
kicker turns it over way faster for sure.
because race car..
because race car..
Purplezinger
XS650 Addict
For whatever reason the W650 simply didn't sell. Our local Kawasaki dealer had only one. It was in the showroom for a couple of years. They finally sold it heavily discounted. Sad, but the market is not here.
daroberts3
XS650 Addict
Crazy idea........
How about taking our beloved XS650, adding all of HHB's improvements (rephase, PMA, solid bushings, etc), adding Pandemonium Brembo brake upgrade, PAMCO ignition, upgrading suspension, Mikuni Carbs, better oil pump and filters, basically all the improvements that the aftermarket has created, new tires, fork brace......and so on. Would that be a viable motorcycle to sell/ride?
Have any members done this? Without cutting the frame up?
How about taking our beloved XS650, adding all of HHB's improvements (rephase, PMA, solid bushings, etc), adding Pandemonium Brembo brake upgrade, PAMCO ignition, upgrading suspension, Mikuni Carbs, better oil pump and filters, basically all the improvements that the aftermarket has created, new tires, fork brace......and so on. Would that be a viable motorcycle to sell/ride?
Have any members done this? Without cutting the frame up?
Yup there's a market for that, at least until the latest and greatest is regularly topping 100 MPG which will happen.
If you are selling then stock is the mantra. Yes you can make an XS "better" in a lot of ways but you are doing it for your personal satisfaction. It'd be tough to get to the point where you can roll reliable "updated" XS650's out the door at a profitable price point. Not impossible but building the rep that would have guys plunking down big cash for an "old bike" is a big hurdle. If there is a bike that works on, the 650 is as good a starting place as any and better than most.
If you are selling then stock is the mantra. Yes you can make an XS "better" in a lot of ways but you are doing it for your personal satisfaction. It'd be tough to get to the point where you can roll reliable "updated" XS650's out the door at a profitable price point. Not impossible but building the rep that would have guys plunking down big cash for an "old bike" is a big hurdle. If there is a bike that works on, the 650 is as good a starting place as any and better than most.
Scrambled
Motorcycle Man
That is exactly what some of us are doing/have done except I know I am never going to make any money at it. Just a hobby for me.
I think the best way to make money with motorcycles is to develop a superior part /parts that are in demand and sell those. Hugh's and Pamco being the best examples.
jd750ace
Front Toward Enemy
I think the best way to make money with motorcycles is to get ahold of whatever the RUBs are buying at the lowest possible price and sell it to them at the highest possible price. There's no big profit in the full time enthusiast's pocket. It's the dabblers that throw out the high margin prices that make stuff worthwhile. A sure way to ruin a great hobby is to turn it into a business! I do a few mods on piece parts and make enough off them to buy stuff for my bikes. It's fun at that level because there are no deadlines, and the money that keeps the lights on and beer in the fridge comes from somewhere else.
Scrambled
Motorcycle Man
I hate dealing with yuppies ,and motorcycle riding yuppies are almost as bad as horse riding yuppies. Once you do a deal with them they hold you responsible for every other thing that may go wrong from that point on.
I would sell a bike for less to someone who has a clue before I would deal with some rich kid that can't even/ wont even change their own oil.
Just my opinion.
Just as Scrambled said, we are already doing many improvements to these old bikes. However, what you consider an improvement, is subjective.
Imho, many lads are buying parts with a "follow the herd" mentality. I don't consider rephase, PMA, hydraulic clutch cable replacement, 750 big bore kits etc. to be an improvement. If you like to have new or different parts, then yes these parts will satisfy that inclination.
I like to add parts to my bike that I feel add reliability,ease of operation, and/or safety. My choices have been blade type fuse holders, strong ignition coil, Pamco, new solid state regulator, new modern rectifier, LED tail/brake light, a real paper oil filter, tapered roller steering bearings,and Brembo 4 piston calipers.
I can't see any need for a better oil pump (unless you race at race tracks). An oil cooler would be a good addition for those that live in the warmer climates. I find the 650 cc engine has enough power, but yes I know lots of guys want to have more power. But then if you want more power than our stock bike, why are you even riding a 30 year old 650.................many other bikes available with more power/torque.
Improve these bikes for your own enjoyment.................not for profit.
ProSimex
XS650 Addict
PMA is the sweetest thing Ive ever done to my bike.
Scrambled
Motorcycle Man
We are lucky that there are so many bolt on performance upgrades for these old bikes. The PMA and a Pamco makes for a reliable bike.
Why no kicker on current bikes? Engine design may have something to do with it. Modern combustion chamber and piston design combined with EFI and ECU allow much higher compression ratios in engines rated for 87 octane pump gas than you could possibly run on anything but race fuel back in the day. I can't speak for anybody else, but if my 2003 SV650 had a kicker on it, I wouldn't be putting my boot into a CR of 11:1 very often.
No kick starter on modern bikes.
I'd say its just the slow evolution of powered vehicles. The early years of cars/trucks were started with a hand crank. They soon invented the electric starter motor (people are lazy and didn't like to crank engines). However, even with the starter motor, the hand crank mechanism was still present for quite a few years (people,why still lazy, don't like change). The manufacturer may not have had total faith in the electric starter motor reliability, so they kept the hand crank as a back-up. Try to find a hand crank on to-day's cars.
Motorcycles followed the same path as cars/trucks. Kick starting was considered the normal way to start a bike. Actually pedaling the bike with the engine compression release was one of the first methods (I had a "Mo-ped" that worked that way. Oops..............I guess that means I'm really old) .
Again, electric starter motors appeared on bikes, and lazy riders were so happy. But manufacturers kept the kicker for a while, just in case the starter motor couldn't get the job done, or the battery got tired.
Once the electric starter motors proved their reliability, those clever manufacturers saw a way to say money by deleting the kicker. Yamaha and Honda accountants like to save money, so gone was the kicker. Manufactureres also wanted to sell to women, and women would likely buy an electric start bike, while a kick start bike would not get bought.
I'd say its just the slow evolution of powered vehicles. The early years of cars/trucks were started with a hand crank. They soon invented the electric starter motor (people are lazy and didn't like to crank engines). However, even with the starter motor, the hand crank mechanism was still present for quite a few years (people,why still lazy, don't like change). The manufacturer may not have had total faith in the electric starter motor reliability, so they kept the hand crank as a back-up. Try to find a hand crank on to-day's cars
.Motorcycles followed the same path as cars/trucks. Kick starting was considered the normal way to start a bike. Actually pedaling the bike with the engine compression release was one of the first methods (I had a "Mo-ped" that worked that way. Oops..............I guess that means I'm really old
) .Again, electric starter motors appeared on bikes, and lazy riders were so happy. But manufacturers kept the kicker for a while, just in case the starter motor couldn't get the job done, or the battery got tired.
Once the electric starter motors proved their reliability, those clever manufacturers saw a way to say money by deleting the kicker. Yamaha and Honda accountants like to save money, so gone was the kicker. Manufactureres also wanted to sell to women, and women would likely buy an electric start bike, while a kick start bike would not get bought.
Scrambled
Motorcycle Man
Women seem to suck the fun out of so many things.....
