tonyc
XS650 Guru
How could one ever re-build his reputation with multiple complaints from the same forum? I think it is impossible. I believe in a second chance but this is beyond a second chance.
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Ardcore stole money and now i'm out a hardtail
- Thread starter Jpikus
- Start date
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- Tags
- bobber build fabricating frame
Jpikus
XS650 Member
Well like I said this is my first build and I fell in love with the look of the Ardtail otherwise I probably would of been on here seeing what people had, I am however looking for a Cole Foster Bobber tank though. I don't know how he can rebuild his rep really, I don't even know the actual story of what happened at the shop. Only thing I heard was that everyone quit but I'm not sure if that hold any merit to it. I will however have it Monday, so if it is what it's supposed to be i'll let everyone know on here that I did receive my order. I do hope things turn around for Ardcore.
Jpikus
XS650 Member
It did come today, I can finally get my 650 project rolling now! Honestly such a relief!
Congrats! Good luck with the build.
well lets see , since you guys started voicing concern about the turn around times i have had 3 frames ordered and two received, the first frame i called him all the time changing shit, musta drove him crazy . Probably why he does not answer the phone , he can get more done.... I still have the second frame not even touched set up for internal fork stop for a custom front end I am making. he still gets my money but I am in less of a hurry since I figured good work takes time. I too have built and then rebuilt bikes because .....ya know you buy all these parts ya put them on and they look like shoit, so you take em off and start looking for other parts. thats the way I am, Jon after the first frame I figure is the same way we had lots of conversations , about the new shop, employees that were just not where you need them to be, and I got to say times have changed. you cant get good people now a days, and most times you have to do it all yourself because 1) you cant afford mistakes. 2) its just easier and less stressfull. 3)Every frame is different. 4) if I got a tone of work just sitting there waiting for me to do it that would be my motivation to do it. Presently he has a roadstar frame to do for me it might be a ardtail, it might be a modded soft tail I dunno its gotten to the point I just trust him to build something nice. so I guess there is a yin and yang to everything.
chizler62
XS650 Addict
well lets see , since you guys started voicing concern about the turn around times i have had 3 frames ordered and two received, the first frame i called him all the time changing shit, musta drove him crazy . Probably why he does not answer the phone , he can get more done.... I still have the second frame not even touched set up for internal fork stop for a custom front end I am making. he still gets my money but I am in less of a hurry since I figured good work takes time. I too have built and then rebuilt bikes because .....ya know you buy all these parts ya put them on and they look like shoit, so you take em off and start looking for other parts. thats the way I am, Jon after the first frame I figure is the same way we had lots of conversations , about the new shop, employees that were just not where you need them to be, and I got to say times have changed. you cant get good people now a days, and most times you have to do it all yourself because 1) you cant afford mistakes. 2) its just easier and less stressfull. 3)Every frame is different. 4) if I got a tone of work just sitting there waiting for me to do it that would be my motivation to do it. Presently he has a roadstar frame to do for me it might be a ardtail, it might be a modded soft tail I dunno its gotten to the point I just trust him to build something nice. so I guess there is a yin and yang to everything.
Not buying that. I'm 18 months out on frames. I would never take money, full payment especially, for a frame that I knew couldn't be completed in the time frame I give my customer.
I have a wait list and a progress list with photos for my customers to check in weekly with a password on my web page.
Things happen. Storm puts out the power for the day, ole lady gets sick, employee's get sick, I get sick, but a strong business model takes those issues into account. I've missed completion dates. My last one was in 2004 on a frame that I keep destroying Strawberry hole saw cutters and the hydraulic motor went on my tubing bender. I kept the customers UPDATED with issues and push back dates. Didn't let it go to some PayPal arbitration. LOL
It takes me 22 hours to build a frame from full size sketch customer sign off and It takes 60 hours of daily operations within those 22 hours to complete frame to send for paint. I would never schedule more work than there are hours.
Not buying that. I'm 18 months out on frames. I would never take money, full payment especially, for a frame that I knew couldn't be completed in the time frame I give my customer.
I have a wait list and a progress list with photos for my customers to check in weekly with a password on my web page.
Things happen. Storm puts out the power for the day, ole lady gets sick, employee's get sick, I get sick, but a strong business model takes those issues into account. I've missed completion dates. My last one was in 2004 on a frame that I keep destroying Strawberry hole saw cutters and the hydraulic motor went on my tubing bender. I kept the customers UPDATED with issues and push back dates. Didn't let it go to some PayPal arbitration. LOL
It takes me 22 hours to build a frame from full size sketch customer sign off and It takes 60 hours of daily operations within those 22 hours to complete frame to send for paint. I would never schedule more work than there are hours.
hey we all have our own opinions, i got a guy out here who runs a ( pro shop) his frame guy quoted me 3 grand for a mod of a existing frametech frame (cost cad $600) to make it fit a roadie 30 hours for a mod, he did not get the job needless to say. in saying that nobody is forcing you buy anything. I dont talk to customers , they change their mind every picture they see of another bike build. I just build them if you like you buy you don't you won't simple easy no headaches
but I think its good to say what you think, just be civil about it.
member3480
RICH
You have to know when not to take on a job. That was my down fall I was getting big fast and got greedy and took on everyone that wanted a bike WRONG!!!. I had big overhead and 7 guys on payroll and things just went to shit trying to make dead lines. Then I got one moran that wanted to change everything and all my builds had a punch list and they signed off on parts. Well long story short he destroyed Title for bike that I gave him ordered parts from vendors that had nothing to do with build and when I said I am done. He came on here and trashed me and two other assholes who I don't know chimed in and it cost me $24,000 in return deposits and the story stays on the net so I still get back lash from it and lawyers calling me and emailing me to sue. He got his bike back and his cash and a mad wife who didn't want him on a bike. So that was the END for me. Now I build two bikes a year sell them local or on ebay and done.
Chilzer is building from the ground up is what it sounds like and that is very different than adding a hard tail or making a brat bike. I use to do that with Harleys and sometimes it took me 2 yrs to finish up a complete bike and customer in your ear all the way making changes but that's the business. I been in this all my life and I will be 64 soon and owned three chopper shops a Honda Dealership and two Tattoo shops would I do it all over again if I could turn the clock back YOU BET!
Pick your customers carefully and build to the best you can and involve the customer to a point. I used a punch list and boy did that save my ass because I was sued three times after all this went down and all people could get back was there deposit and I am still refunding two years later. The kicker is I did build 45 complete bikes and 5 kit bikes and now they pop up all over the internet.
Chilzer is building from the ground up is what it sounds like and that is very different than adding a hard tail or making a brat bike. I use to do that with Harleys and sometimes it took me 2 yrs to finish up a complete bike and customer in your ear all the way making changes but that's the business. I been in this all my life and I will be 64 soon and owned three chopper shops a Honda Dealership and two Tattoo shops would I do it all over again if I could turn the clock back YOU BET!
Pick your customers carefully and build to the best you can and involve the customer to a point. I used a punch list and boy did that save my ass because I was sued three times after all this went down and all people could get back was there deposit and I am still refunding two years later. The kicker is I did build 45 complete bikes and 5 kit bikes and now they pop up all over the internet.
DIRTY DOG
XS650 Guru
Yea I feel for you Rich, I have built a bike or 2 over the years and they pop up with people say'n they built it cause they changed the color of the tank or changed the rear tire haha but call me to ask about something on the bike haha or 3 years and 2 owners later want me to fix something on it for free lol,( one guy took the carb's apart and got mad cause I wanted paid to put them back together reinstall them and retune the bike) lol it just part of building bikes
Hi Jpikus,
I just read this whole string when it came to the top of the list again.
My own biased reaction to the first post was that you got off light because the chiropractic treatments you'd need after riding a hardtail would cost a lot more than the money you lost from not getting the one you ordered.
But hey! That's just me giving you a hard time because there's nothing like spending the first 5 years on 2 wheels riding rigid frame bikes to make one appreciate the worth of rear suspension and wonder at the thought processes of those who'd remove it.
So, Ardcore finally came through for you and I wish you every good fortune with your build.
I wonder if it was the half year's worth of increasingly acrimonious correspondence that finally got the frame sent to you or if the builder was plain ol' swamped by circumstances and did the best he could anyway?
I just read this whole string when it came to the top of the list again.
My own biased reaction to the first post was that you got off light because the chiropractic treatments you'd need after riding a hardtail would cost a lot more than the money you lost from not getting the one you ordered.
But hey! That's just me giving you a hard time because there's nothing like spending the first 5 years on 2 wheels riding rigid frame bikes to make one appreciate the worth of rear suspension and wonder at the thought processes of those who'd remove it.
So, Ardcore finally came through for you and I wish you every good fortune with your build.
I wonder if it was the half year's worth of increasingly acrimonious correspondence that finally got the frame sent to you or if the builder was plain ol' swamped by circumstances and did the best he could anyway?
This outfit is hooked up with that crook at Thomas racing service. Same scam he runs on crap engines. Takes the money pisses all over you has a million excuses but never any satisfaction. The whole lot of them needs to be knee capped.
Jpikus
XS650 Member
Like I said, I still to this day have no idea what happened there. I want to say just a loop of bad shit happened for Jon but am not sure because I got into contact with a guy who gave Jon his bike and had it for almost 2 years I think. He went to the shop himself and told me the new place is like a shed and his bike was so dusty that it looked like he hadn't touched it in months. I do still have some faith in Jon and Ardcore because I did in the end get my product and the quality is top notch for sure. @fredintoon i'm not insanely worried about my back too much, very active an athletic person. Worked manual labor my whole work career, was enlisted in the military etc etc. I'm sure i'll have to go in at some point but I don't think it will be for awhile haha. Honestly it's about what appeals to me and I haven't really come across too many bike with the spring suspension in the back that I actually liked the look of, then what would happen is id have a bike that I would never ride. Exactly why I got rid of the two sport bikes I had
Hi Jpikus,
yeah, even back in '86 when I bought my NOS '84 Heritage, it was the only bike in the dealership that looked right.
One side, sport bikes with their monkey humping a football rider stance.
T'other side, massive cruisers like Winnebagos split lengthwise.
Back wall, street legal off-road bikes you'd need a step stool to get on.
And in the middle, an XS650.
Been riding it ever since.
Today's offerings don't even include an XS650 equivalent.
The closest to a bike that'll take two in comfort and weighs less than half a ton is a Suzuki Bergman.
I agree! However, there is one exception of course....the Triumph Bonneville has stayed pretty true to it's original looks/feel. Even the Thruxton would be a good choice in that market.
PickleSlice
XS650 Addict
mgjaynes
XS650 Member
Same boat as you. I paid the balance on my frame back in early April. I waited and emailed a month and a half later. No response. Kept emailling and calling. Never ever a response. Finally in July I got an email from Jon saying my frame was marked as shipped on accident. Verbatim the same email you got. He said it would be shipped out ASAP. Well it has been another month and half. No response from them whatsoever despite my attempts to contact them. Opened a Paypal claim this morning.... I hardly ever post on here but figured I'd come too see if there was any news about them going out of business or something. I guess this is just how the guy does business.
Mad Tatter
XS650 Member
This guy should be out of business. Did the same thing to me with my frame order. Luckily I saw this post and went ahead and filed a claim with PayPal got my money back.
McGyver62
McGyver62
they still in business!? i also was given the runaround by these guys.Threatening to have Visa recind payment got a reply to my constant calls and finally delivery of my ardtail.I can't believe they are still pulling this crap! Can i say douchbag? is douchbag appropriate?if the term douchbag is unacceptable please delete the word douchbag from my post
douchbag is unacceptable!
The correct term is douchebag.
The correct term is douchebag.
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