Cam chain replacement issue

[willis]

Engine is out and I am in the process of buttoning the engine back up after a top end rebuild and cam guide replacement. This is my first XS rebuild so I am learning as I go. As I was replacing the cam chain, I had a major hiccup. Long story short the chain fell down in the motor before I hooked up the master link. I managed to fish the chain out, but the master link fell out in the bottom end. The case still has oil in it and is bolted to an engine stand. I am trying to remove the drain bolt but cannot get it to break loose on the bench. My next step I suppose is to remove the sump plate bolts. This will make for a nice mess but what are my options at this point? Also, can I feed my cam chain from the top and rivit it through the sump plate while it's off? Is there a simpler way to feed the cam chain through the crank?

 

[Paulrxs650]

We've all been there a magnet on a telescopic stick has got me out of a few scenarios like that. If you haven't got one, or tried and it has worked, drain the oil and drop the sump plate. If the drain plug is tight, try bracing the engine or bolting the stand down. Otherwise , loosen off the plate bolts and get some stiff card under there in a V shape and let the mess ensue
You'll not be able to join the chain at the bottom on the crank due to lack of access but at least you'll be able to at least get the joint back at the top.
Just feed some soft wire or such like down, remembering to thread through the cam chain tensionser assembly correctly, tie on the chain and draw it up.
If the chain is tight, you can slip off the cam bearings to give you some more room, join the chain and push the bearings back on

 

[willis]

I tried the telescopic magnet. That's how I got the chain back out but it was a real bear. I fished it around for the master but there's too much other ferrous materials in there that want to grab the weak little magnet instead. Hopefully it will appear when I drop the sump plate. If not then I guess I will give it a good flush with some kerosene and hope for the best. I'd rather not pull the cylinders and barrels back off again unless absolutely necessary. Thanks for the tips though.

 

[5twins]

I'm pretty sure the rebuild procedure has been outlined somewhere here on this site before (I'M SURE IT HAS). You leave the old chain in place until it's time for reassembly. Then you hook the old chain to the new one with some tie wire and pull the new one down and up through. This is the basic "101" of a 650 top end rebuild.

You're asking for advice on a problem we don't know much about. We don't have it because we don't let it happen.

 

[figure8]

Hahahaha. Willis, wtf! You can't make a mistake around here. Although 5twins seems to be guilty to, he just posted in a thread for absolutely no reason.[emoji33]

 

[5twins]

I guess I just get bored sometimes, lol. But all this stuff is here, you just have to (and should) "look before you leap". I wish there was such a comprehensive resource for some of the other bikes I own. This place is terrific - all you need to know is here if you're willing to put in the search effort. Granted, rare new problems do surface, but for the most part, the Yamaha 650 "mysteries" are solved. This basic rebuild stuff is more than well documented. In fact, it's enhanced with better procedures over the basic factory instructions.

 

[figure8]

Just having fun with you 5twins. I agree, this place is fantastic. There have been multiple threads on a bottom to top engine build. I think the problem lies in thread titles, for example slowmaitenace has his thread right now with an engine build incorporated. So it wouldn't be the easiest to find if your just looking for an engine rebuild how to. I would like to see the best posts on engine rebuilds from multiple threads compiled into one sticky, it would take some time but that would be one amazing thread.

 

[650Skull]

willis, here are a couple of threads you should bookmark, could help for the rest of the build and definitely for the future if/when needed. One of them has the cam-chain problem remedy, (not trying to be a dick just a lot of useful info). You probably know a fair bit of the info posted but re-reading information has never caused a problem, it's when its not read.

http://www.xs650.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30786

http://www.xs650.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32041

http://www.xs650.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18237

figure8, you have pointed out the issue of a lack of cohesion before..........What/why don't you do something about this instead of making a noise about it..........

 

[willis]

5T, thanks for the berating and negative comments. At this point I know I've fucked up and am looking for help and input. The long story is I used a tsubaki peanut cam chain and had issues with the master link and needed to order a replacement. I had the old cutoff link from the old chain holding it together in the interim. Also had some issues with the new cam bearings fully seating on the cam which caused me to fuss with it more than I wanted. Chalk this up to inexperience. This place is an invaluable wealth of knowledge and I love it. I could just do without the useless negative commentary.

 

[theDQG]

figure8, you have pointed out the issue of a lack of cohesion before..........What/why don't you do something about this instead of making a noise about it..........

I think that this is an issue more suited towards the moderators. They could create another forum category entitled "rebuilds" below "The Garage" and above "The Lounge" and organize builds by years such as "256 rebuilds" "447 rebuilds" etc.

I am aware that there is a "build" sub-topic within "The Garage", but most of those threads aren't throughout, and it's always changing due to thread updates.

The new "rebuild" forum could consist of stickied threads so they stay at the top.

 

[willis]

I like Dogs idea above. Can't tell you how many times I searched for Carbons videos using the search function. I would be useful having it all in one place.

 

[figure8]

I think that this is an issue more suited towards the moderators. They could create another forum category entitled "rebuilds" below "The Garage" and above "The Lounge" and organize builds by years such as "256 rebuilds" "447 rebuilds" etc.



I am aware that there is a "build" sub-topic within "The Garage", but most of those threads aren't throughout, and it's always changing due to thread updates.



The new "rebuild" forum could consist of stickied threads so they stay at the top.

My thoughts exactly, although I wouldn't be opposed to helping dig through posts to make that happen. Any thoughts on this gggGary?

 

[Paj]

I guess I just get bored sometimes, lol. But all this stuff is here, you just have to (and should) "look before you leap". I wish there was such a comprehensive resource for some of the other bikes I own. This place is terrific - all you need to know is here if you're willing to put in the search effort. Granted, rare new problems do surface, but for the most part, the Yamaha 650 "mysteries" are solved. This basic rebuild stuff is more than well documented. In fact, it's enhanced with better procedures over the basic factory instructions.

Years later this is still a good read.. Willis never mind guys rousing ya, they have a lot of experience It’s easy to see from all the posts, but they dont have all the answers. I’m here to tell ya there’s more than one way to skin a cat. Experienced Fellas like that said the same thing too me one time, dont build a bike from scratch because its virtually impossible to get the paperwork. I had 0 experience either at the time. They were experienced and right, because Canada does make it super difficult to get what they call you built title paperwork, especially when you’re not a manufacturer or certified bike builder, but I hate when someone tells me I cant or shouldn’t do something. I can tell ya I got that paperwork, it took me 3 years to build that bike and 8 months to get the paperwork. When I had it all done i went out and got my bike license and I’ve been riding that thing ever since. You dont learn something from someone telling you how to do it, but from making mistakes and learning from them. I know you got that cam chain thing sorted already, but for those out there making mistakes, keep making them and learning from them. Just because theres a manual out there for just about everything these days, doesn’t mean a fella isn’t going to use his own mind and come up with something better than in that manual,. Even all these guys in here made the same mistakes and they’ll keep makin em until they themselves come up with something better . No matter how many years of experience you have, none or a lot, if you have the interest you’ll already have the solution.