Electrical setup options?

VENMUS

VENMUS

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I have a question that I'm SURE someone here could answer easily... XSJohn maybe, petepamco, etc..

I am a fan of simplicity. (KISS) And need to wire the bike before I can find out if the engine runs, so in order to do that I need an ignition setup. Here's what I want:

1. Batteryless
2. kickstart only, no electric or starter (will be blocked off)
3. Headlight/taillight/license-plate light/key-switch will be the ONLY things on the whole bike. (I hope that's all I need, am I forgetting anything?)

Here's my dilemma..... I have a 1981 Special that has the TCI bull$#it and it's going into the dumpster as soon as I have my bike running. This means I need either points or a pamco something-or-other to make it run correct? Please help out here, I'm lost in the endless field of wiring with no easy way out.

I've read for batteryless I need a permanent magnet, and a coil, and one other thing? If it's REALLY easier to run with a battery I would be willing to do that, but as long as it remains simple. If the pamco will do the job I'll spit out 200 and make her purr. (or so I think)

Dazed and confused,
Logan
 
venmus,

Hopefully, bigjimie13 will arrive here and can guide you through the steps to install a PM alternator with the PAMCO ignition.

You will need Mikes 14-0902 kit that includes the ignition, coil, wires and caps as well as the mechanical advance parts.

Check the various posts here and on other forums for info on the PM setup, but I would recommend that you initially start the engine using an external battery that is not connected to the PM charging system to power the PAMCO until you can verify the correct operation of the PM regulator because one of several things will happen if you attempt to start right off with the PM system powering the ignition.

1. No usable output from the PM system due to installation errors. You will kick yourself to death trying to get it started.
2. Starts on the first kick and runs great for about 30 seconds, followed by a whiff of smoke from the PAMCO due to very high voltage (like 20+ volts) from the PM alternator due to mis wiring of the PM regulator.
3. Starts on first kick but cannot be shut off due to mis wiring of the PM alternator and / or the regulator.
4. Starts on first kick followed immediately by either the battery or the capacitor blowing up due to miss wiring of the PM alternator and / or the regulator.

I also recommend that you wear safety glasses for the initial startup as well due to the possibility of exploding batteries or capacitors.

Also, check the installation tips for the advance system in my site, www.yamahaxs650.com
 
Last edited:
Very interesting Pete. I was wonder the same stuff but on my current build I am running a battery. That info is kind of making me want to stick with a battery! Ha
 
Okay now were getting somewhere. Trebor13 the mechanical advance your talking about it the points setup right? And pamcopete, you recommended the kit 14-0902 which HAS the points included, am I understanding that correctly?

In other words, my engine is sitting completely on its own in the garage, and the only wires coming from it are for the alternator I believe, (from under the left side case), and it has a quick-disconnect plug. Other than that, there is NOTHING electrical really going on with it. Pamcopete, are you saying with this kit ($200) I will have everything I need besides power from a battery to start and run the bike? Essentially, will two hundred get her running sitting here where I'm at?
 
Oh, Jayel, when someone speaks of "TCI" what physical parts are they referring to? It seems I wont need any of it, so it'll be available. But what exactly is it? Everything stock is there, and the only thing wrong is the ignitor unit (little black plastic box found under original battery box area) has cracked plastic, but nothing inside has been affected or touched.

Thanks!
 
venmus,

I'm saying that $200 will get spark to the cylinders at the right time.......the rest is up to you and the condition of the other essential parts.
 
Okay perhaps a better angle to ask my question from, BESIDES the $200 kit (14-0902) that I can get from MikesXS, what other parts are crucial for me to have in order to run the bike?

My current problem is making it run at all. From there, I can tweak and tune. I have all the old dirty grimy bits from the stock 81 special, so should I grab a few things and clean em up to reuse? Or is it all good to be sold off?
 
I am still new to this ignition dilemma on the XS's so excuse me if I sound dumb, but what are the advantages of replacing the TCI ignition? I have and 80 model and figured I was avoiding the headaches of ignition problems due to it not being the points ignition..
Am I wrong? I had just planned on updating some of the parts and running a small battery as kick only. I thought this was possible with the stock TCI but I admit I could be completely off base here.
 
ive got the tci on my 81 and it works so im going to run it that way, ill use a smaller battery since i dumped alot of the exrtra crap on the xs that i didnt need. I intend on a kick only, headlight and brake light and thats all. From what i know about the points system is that it can require alot of attention to keep in time/working order. A tci is hands free run by that electronic box under the seat. I like the though of not having a battery simply for a cleaner look, like pete said, your battery could explode if the pamco is wired wrong....i think im all set...safety glasses wont do much when the battery smacks you in the face!!!!
 
You guys keep changing these things a complaining about ignition problens while having no idea what you are doing....fact is you are a long way from cruising down the highway pleasantly for double sure........tee hee

xsjohn
 
matt81xs said:
ive got the tci on my 81 and it works so im going to run it that way, ill use a smaller battery since i dumped alot of the exrtra crap on the xs that i didnt need. I intend on a kick only, headlight and brake light and thats all. From what i know about the points system is that it can require alot of attention to keep in time/working order. A tci is hands free run by that electronic box under the seat. I like the though of not having a battery simply for a cleaner look, like pete said, your battery could explode if the pamco is wired wrong....i think im all set...safety glasses wont do much when the battery smacks you in the face!!!!
Click to expand...

Not if the PAMCO is wired wrong.......if the PM alternator and / or the REGULATOR is wired wrong, regardless of what ignition system you use.
 
I see my thread has become a little muddied up here, :wtf: I'm going to quote myself here which is the question at hand right now....:

Okay perhaps a better angle to ask my question from, BESIDES the $200 kit (14-0902) that I can get from MikesXS, what other parts are crucial for me to have in order to run the bike?
Click to expand...

Thank you
 
people have no idea the condition of your bike, you have been given the answer on how to get it to run, prehaps if you were a bit more civil more people might be inclined to help
 
venmus,

Well, in general, you have to have fuel and you have to have spark to run the engine. Most people suggest that you get the spark going first because it is generally easier to do so, then you attempt to start the engine and see what the other problems are.

Unless your carbs are completely fouled up, getting spark to the plugs will probably allow you to start the engine, and then you can determine by how well the engine runs as to what other problems you may have. Having bought the parts to get a good spark, you would then just have to focus on the carbs.
 
I'm not intending to be a d!ckhead here! Not at all, so pardon me if my internet-self has come across that way. It is rather tough to convey appropriate emotion and detail in a few words that everyone will comprehend. And as far as the time being, I'm not sure if the condition of the bike has come into play yet, I'm speaking entirely in theoretical terms.

My problem is that I'm an electrical rookie. I don't know how EVERYTHING works and my desire to learn is greater than my wallets thickness. With that in mind, I have come to an XS650 community bearing my problem and hoping to find a successful solution. I more or less would like to know what parts I should be looking to purchase to achieve a popular yet simple electrical system for these motorcycles. (far less complex than stock, even!)

Pamcopete has been helpful in the previous posts when he suggested I get myself the ignition kit from MikesXS, and that will cover my spark, so that part is taken care of. From here, I am wondering what else I will need (whether I have it off the stock bike or need to find it elsewhere) to make the bike run and rideable. (this is where it got off track with other members asking their questions in my thread and changing the topic suddenly, thereby lowering my chances of having the actual problem solved). Does this make sense? Again, sorry for harsh/rude words folks, just trying to get the little help I need then I'll be on my way).

Logan
 

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