Kawasaki W800

[650Skull]

talking about riding in the rain............From yesterday ...................

And that truck had just gone through a puddle and the spray completely covered the Riders..............One husband and wife team that like each other

 

[David Toll]

My God! Remember the Amphicar? There is no way that swimmer made it onto the beach!

 

[Raymond]

Still the best bike in the garage. And still the prettiest IMHO.








Just back from the supermarket.

Has a good edge in performance over the XS650, I wonder if the power and torque might be like a big block?

But so smooth in comparison to an XS. Very good road manners, just gets on with the job.

 

[Mailman]

Still the best bike in the garage. And still the prettiest IMHO.

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Just back from the supermarket.

Has a good edge in performance over the XS650, I wonder if the power and torque might be like a big block?

But so smooth in comparison to an XS. Very good road manners, just gets on with the job.

Yeah that’s a lovey bike Raymond, maybe I missed the boat on that one? Tell the Mrs. her garden looks pretty as ever too!

 

[GLJ]

I wonder if the power and torque might be like a big block?

I believe it would be. My BBK is a whole different bike from the stock motor. I've had a few friends ride my BBK that rode it when it was a 650. Even with the cam milder they are amazed at the difference in it.

 

[Raymond]

Been aware lately that the disc on the Kawasaki is wearing - there's a tangible lip between the centre of the disc and the swept area.

Today at last, have got around to checking it out. First, look at the manual - new disc is 5.1 mm with a wear limit of 4.5 mm. Second, go to garage and measure Polly's with my rusty old micrometer thingy - 3.2 mm.

Ahem. I think that means a new disc is called for. The disc has done more than 34,000 miles, including my bizarre habit of practicing hard braking, usually on the approach to town speed limits. After checking the mirrors, of course.

Looked at prices - Cradley Heath, Fowlers Parts, etcetera. About £265 for the Kawasaki item. New pads would be additional to that. Quite a lot of money, are there cheaper options? Well, ebay came up with a second-hand OEM disc from a motorbike shop in France for about £130. Removed from the bike when it was brand new, done less than 2km and looks fine in the photos. My problem was more that buying from France might be fraught with unexpected problems, maybe high delivery costs or maybe HMRC will attach customs duty plus VAT? So that's a No then.

Other alternatives? I am very happy with the EBC disc I fitted to the XS650. EBC disks and pads have a good reputation and again, available from about £130 for the disc.

In the end, placed an order with Sportsbikeshop near Boston for an EBC disc plus a set of EBC pads for a total of £153. Other suppliers are of course available. There will be a delay for supply chain reasons but I'm happy enough.

Will I venture out with Polly and a rather thin disc? Uhm, possibly not . . .

 

[MaxPete]

Been aware lately that the disc on the Kawasaki is wearing - there's a tangible lip between the centre of the disc and the swept area.

Today at last, have got around to checking it out. First, look at the manual - new disc is 5.1 mm with a wear limit of 4.5 mm. Second, go to garage and measure Polly's with my rusty old micrometer thingy - 3.2 mm.

Ahem. I think that means a new disc is called for. The disc has done more than 34,000 miles, including my bizarre habit of practicing hard braking, usually on the approach to town speed limits. After checking the mirrors, of course.

Looked at prices - Cradley Heath, Fowlers Parts, etcetera. About £265 for the Kawasaki item. New pads would be additional to that. Quite a lot of money, are there cheaper options? Well, ebay came up with a second-hand OEM disc from a motorbike shop in France for about £130. Removed from the bike when it was brand new, done less than 2km and looks fine in the photos. My problem was more that buying from France might be fraught with unexpected problems, maybe high delivery costs or maybe HMRC will attach customs duty plus VAT? So that's a No then.

Other alternatives? I am very happy with the EBC disc I fitted to the XS650. EBC disks and pads have a good reputation and again, available from about £130 for the disc.

In the end, placed an order with Sportsbikeshop near Boston for an EBC disc plus a set of EBC pads for a total of £153. Other suppliers are of course available. There will be a delay for supply chain reasons but I'm happy enough.

Will I venture out with Polly and a rather thin disc? Uhm, possibly not . . .

Hi Raymond: I would have no qualms about installing an EBC rotor.

Similarly, the rotors on my '83 BMW were below the wear limit and now OE rotors cost more than $450 CAD (EACH) so with shipping and taxes, that would be more than $1500 CAD for three dumb lumps of cast iron.

Anyhow - I went with EBC rotors which cost <I think> about $110 CAD each and are a perfect fit. As a plus, they are also "floating" (the originals were not) and that makes for smoother braking action and more even wear on the pads (which are also EBC).

I don't understand why the OEs can't seem to realize how many sales they lose when they over-price their replacement parts to that extent.

Pete

 

[46th Georgia]

Hi Raymond: I would have no qualms about installing an EBC rotor.

Similarly, the rotors on my '83 BMW were below the wear limit and now OE rotors cost more than $450 CAD (EACH) so with shipping and taxes, that would be more than $1500 CAD for three dumb lumps of cast iron.

Anyhow - I went with EBC rotors which cost <I think> about $110 CAD each and are a perfect fit. As a plus, they are also "floating" (the originals were not) and that makes for smoother braking action and more even wear on the pads (which are also EBC).

I don't understand why the OEs can't seem to realize how many sales they lose when they over-price their replacement parts to that extent.

Pete

Totally agree. On the other hand, at least you can still get OEM. I have a '05 H-D Road King and you just about can't get anything OEM for it. Not a big deal as many of the aftermarket parts are higher quality.

 

[650Skull]

Today at last, have got around to checking it out. First, look at the manual - new disc is 5.1 mm with a wear limit of 4.5 mm. Second, go to garage and measure Polly's with my rusty old micrometer thingy - 3.2 mm.

Will I venture out with Polly and a rather thin disc? Uhm, possibly not . . .

77-83 X650 front rotors are 7.5 mm with a wear limit of 6mm............SR500 rotors are 5mm thick..............The caliper and brake pads from an SR500 is a direct swap to an XS650, meaning the xs650 caliper and pads will swap into a SR500 with a 5mm thick rotor.

Don't think you would have any real trouble. Worse that will happen is when your road racing for an hour, race braking on every corner the rotors could heat up and warp.............there is that, so slow down...........

 

[Raymond]

As said above, order has been placed for an EBC disc.

Coulda gone for the OEM but would have cost twice the price. With the bike not for sale, originality not an issue.

 

[Downeaster]

I don't understand why the OEs can't seem to realize how many sales they lose when they over-price their replacement parts to that extent.

For the same reason John Deere buys bulk oil from the same place as 1000 other companies and puts it in a Green and Yellow bottle: There is a significant portion of the public dumb enough to believe their bullshit about using ONLY JD products in their JD.

In 50 mumble years of doing my own maintenance of pretty much anything with an engine, I've run into a difference between OEM and NAPA (or wherever) consumables exactly once: the hydraulic filter on my Kubota, and that may have been a fluke.

 

[Raymond]

I don't understand why the OEs can't seem to realize how many sales they lose when they over-price their replacement parts to that extent.

I agree with DE that the price of OEM service items and parts does not reflect better quality, so I always use Hi-Flo oil filters which are a fraction of OEM and just as good.

I can't say whether the car and motorcycle manufacturers lose huge sales by over-pricing but there's a couple of factors which apply - perhaps more especially in Britain than N America? One is warranty & insurance - if you fit a Hi-Flo filter and your engine packs up it don't matter a damn that there was a manufacturing fault, they will use that as a way to weasel out of paying for the engine to be rebuilt.

Or at least, that's what people believe. I have serviced the W800 from new but that's me. You won't find many people in Britain willing to service their own bike or even take it to a local mechanic while it's under warranty.

And the other thing is people in Britain have been brain-washed into believing that you need to get the right thing - so you need to buy John Deere oil for your tractor. Or proper H-D oil for your other tractor. People are frightened there might be some unspecified but terrible consequences if they don't shell out for the proper OEM part.

 

[MaxPete]

And the other thing is people in Britain have been brain-washed into believing that you need to get the right thing - so you need to buy John Deere oil for your tractor. Or proper H-D oil for your other tractor. People are frightened there might be some unspecified but terrible consequences if they don't shell out for the proper OEM part.

Yes, I’ve run into that too. Do people really think that Ford or John Deere actually make the oil themselves?

Actually, all of that is one of the reasons why standards setting organizations like the SAE, IEEE and the DIN in Germany are so useful. If a given product meets a certain SAE or DIN standard - then that is all you need to know. People who swear that this oil or that brand of electrical tape is crap make me smile…..because there is no logical basis on which they could form such an opinion.

It’s like people who believe that skinny b!tch Gwyneth Paltrow knows more about nutrition, immunology and public health than medical authorities all over the world.

 

[46th Georgia]

Yes, I’ve run into that too. Do people really think that Ford or John Deere actually make the oil themselves?

Actually, all of that is one of the reasons why standards setting organizations like the SAE, IEEE and the DIN in Germany are so useful. If a given product meets a certain SAE or DIN standard - then that is all you need to know. People who swear that this oil or that brand of electrical tape is crap make me smile…..because there is no logical basis on which they could form such an opinion.

It’s like people who believe that skinny b!tch Gwyneth Paltrow knows more about nutrition, immunology and public health than medical authorities all over the world.

Yeah, like the Harley shop warning me in 2016 about using "Snake-oil, like Amsoil instead of H-D oil". Funny, last time I was in there guess what was on display? Amsoil at $2 above retail.

 

[arcticXS]

Yes, I’ve run into that too. Do people really think that Ford or John Deere actually make the oil themselves?

Actually, all of that is one of the reasons why standards setting organizations like the SAE, IEEE and the DIN in Germany are so useful. If a given product meets a certain SAE or DIN standard - then that is all you need to know. People who swear that this oil or that brand of electrical tape is crap make me smile…..because there is no logical basis on which they could form such an opinion.

It’s like people who believe that skinny b!tch Gwyneth Paltrow knows more about nutrition, immunology and public health than medical authorities all over the world.

As you know, there are also these brand specific approvals for "long life" oil change intervals. In my VW 2.0TDI van engine, I use Castrol Edge, as that oil has the VW xxx xxx approval that is specified for my engine. As an auto industry guru, what's your take on that?

 

[Raymond]

Yes, I’ve run into that too. Do people really think that Ford or John Deere actually make the oil themselves?

No, they don't actually think much at all. We're so used to being told what to do and what's best for us. I'm sure if you told a customer who bought a set of saucepans, Oh, you'll need the manufacturer's special scourer and this bottle of special cleaning fluid or you'll spoil the finish. And if you don't use them, the guarantee on the non-stick finish is invalid then a British customer would never argue but just pay up.

I say British customer - I have no idea whether people are the same elsewhere.

 

[Jan_P]

Yes, I’ve run into that too. Do people really think that Ford or John Deere actually make the oil themselves?

Actually, all of that is one of the reasons why standards setting organizations like the SAE, IEEE and the DIN in Germany are so useful. If a given product meets a certain SAE or DIN standard - then that is all you need to know. People who swear that this oil or that brand of electrical tape is crap make me smile…..because there is no logical basis on which they could form such an opinion.

It’s like people who believe that skinny b!tch Gwyneth Paltrow knows more about nutrition, immunology and public health than medical authorities all over the world.

Lots to say about that ... And has been said.
I remember end 60 ies When pushrods for Brit bikes was in the Press .. " Pirate Parts " they were called
Having a tendency to bend and causing .engine failure

The Standardization sticker DIN or so is just a sticker on the bottle .Who knows what is inside And sometimes these can be minimum requirements.
I had Motul in a Honda Fireblade ..and when changing went for a Autosuppliers Oil that had the Specification sticker should be fine.
But warm days after a faster ride it rattled at low rpm ...so I did not dare to keep it in the bike I am economical and don't do it unless I feel it necessary. It is subjective to some extent but I do tune Guitars so I believe I have reasonable ear. Impression was that the " Snake Oil " did not have as good high temperature capability
Replaced it with some known Oil company's brand and the high temp rattle disappeared.
Dont remember what company .. But I stick to those Known brands that has been around a long time Valvoline / Castrol / Perhaps Shell
And I stick to the exact specification according to vehicle manufacturer unless engine is worn.
They are a bit more Expensive ,,but thats how I do it.

Sadly there are tricksters out there at booth ends ..The OEM companies can order Oil from fex Castrol and increase price with a factor 3x and having their own sticker on the Bottle the same oil as in Castrol's bottles.

At the other end perhaps up to spec min requirements with lesser additives that are cheaper and not so good

Other factors are Clutch that in XS 650 can slip for some Oils
Riding style
Warm up before setting off
How often changing oil some manufacturers prescribes Oil changes after a trip around the block
It is not them that pays especially if it is the same manufacturers oil that is the " Only " one you can use
Bordering to Fraud.
How worn is the motor perhaps going for a slightly thicker oil in an older engine which can be dangerous

 

[Raymond]

Enough! This is not an oil thread.

Supplier has told me the disc will not be here until the end of the month. Probably won't use the W800 until it has the new disc. But then again, I might.

 

[Guzziguy]

I am thinking of buying a W800 but looking at a used one I was horrified to see that the rear tyre was worn out after only 2,500 miles!
Is this normal or is it the OEM tyre prone to wearing out quicker than replacements available from Avon etc?
Many thanks for an entertaining forum.

 

[grizld1]

Ouch. 2500 miles can be about the limit for a sticky high performance tire, but a touring tire worn out at 2500 is another matter; says things about the seller's maintenance that aren't so good. You might examine that tire closely for signs of suspension grief and ask for service records. If seller doesn't allow test rides, I'd give that thing a pass, remembering that there is really no such thing as a last good deal . Good hunting to you!.