Need help with timing assembly

[carlosdacook]

I bought a 77 xs650 with the top end completely disassembled. I managed to pu most of it together. I was missing some of the ignition stuff so I bought the mikes xs electronic ignition but I'm having trouble finding exactly what to do since I didn't take it apart I'm a bit lost. Can anyone show me exactly how to put it all together

 

[Downeaster]

Need more information, and ideally, pictures. WHAT Mike's ignition? How much of the top end is together? Is the cam in and timed correctly? Will you be using the stock advance system?

Given at least that much data, there are several of us here that can help you.

 

[carlosdacook]

Need more information, and ideally, pictures. WHAT Mike's ignition? How much of the top end is together? Is the cam in and timed correctly? Will you be using the stock advance system?

Given at least that much data, there are several of us here that can help you.

This is what I have the advance assembly is the only thing that has me kinda confused. I ordered the xs charge because I think it's the easiest for me. And it came with a new rod and what seems all the components. But I am having a hard time finding a video on how exactly it's installed

 

[carlosdacook]

And thankyou I really appreciate the help

 

[Jim]

If you do a forum search, you'll find many instances of that XS Charge ignition installation.... and just about as many instances of it failing/never working right in the first place.

 

[DogBunny]

https://cdn.partzilla.com/cdn-cgi/image/quality=50/MTE/d/3/MjIwNjUxMg-3871f361.png
You're getting ahead of yourself. Installing the ignition and (the red XS unit, the little trigger, and the rod), and the timing advance plate (the little mechanism with the two copper flyweights), will make WAY more sense after you have the cylinder head cover all assembled. Wait till then to try to figure out the ignition and advance. They install trough the covers part # 26 in the above diagram. Get the head assembled, the covers in place, and then ask for help.
Until then, look at this diagram showing the rod, advance mechanism, and points:
https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/y...50d/camshaft-chain-tensioner-xs650d-e-e006501
your red XS unit takes the place of the points.
Don't throw your points away -- you can use them when the red XS unit fails after 30 minutes.

 

[Downeaster]

First, what Jim said about that ignition. Frankly, you'd likely be better off with the original points system. However, if you need to go with that, read the instructions thoroughly. If there are no instructions, find some or search for and read posts here as Jim pointed out.

The next thing you need to do is get the head on the engine with a new head gasket, get the cam timed and the chain installed. Then torque everything to spec and install the cam cover. That's a day's work right there, especially if it's your first time. Again, check the Tech Section for advice on that process.

Let us know when you get that far.

EDIT: I see The Bunny beat me to it...

 

[carlosdacook]

View attachment 261171
https://cdn.partzilla.com/cdn-cgi/image/quality=50/MTE/d/3/MjIwNjUxMg-3871f361.png
You're getting ahead of yourself. Installing the ignition and (the red XS unit, the little trigger, and the rod), and the timing advance plate (the little mechanism with the two copper flyweights), will make WAY more sense after you have the cylinder head cover all assembled. Wait till then to try to figure out the ignition and advance. They install trough the covers part # 26 in the above diagram. Get the head assembled, the covers in place, and then ask for help.
Until then, look at this diagram showing the rod, advance mechanism, and points:
https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/y...50d/camshaft-chain-tensioner-xs650d-e-e006501
your red XS unit takes the place of the points.
Don't throw your points away -- you can use them when the red XS unit fails after 30 minutes.

I don't have the points that's why I got the xs charge

 

[carlosdacook]

First, what Jim said about that ignition. Frankly, you'd likely be better off with the original points system. However, if you need to go with that, read the instructions thoroughly. If there are no instructions, find some or search for and read posts here as Jim pointed out.

The next thing you need to do is get the head on the engine with a new head gasket, get the cam timed and the chain installed. Then torque everything to spec and install the cam cover. That's a day's work right there, especially if it's your first time. Again, check the Tech Section for advice on that process.

Let us know when you get that far.

EDIT: I see The Bunny beat me to it...

I don't have the points. But I ordered the obvious parts I need to assemble the engine I'll keep you guys posted I'm going to put it together next weekend

 

[gggGary]

If you haven't seen it this thread (found in tech) is the bible for topping an XS
https://www.xs650.com/threads/xs650-top-end-buildup.52041/
Jim's too modest to mention it.

 

[carlosdacook]

If you haven't seen it this thread (found in tech) is the bible for topping an XS
https://www.xs650.com/threads/xs650-top-end-buildup.52041/
Jim's too modest to mention it.

Ok guys I got this far today is this correct

 

[Jim]

You might be off a tooth. The red line is where you're at. The yellow line is where you should be.
Of course, I don't know if you've moved the crank or not.
Try setting it to the yellow (TDC) line and give us a left and right cam shot.

 

[carlosdacook]

You might be off a tooth. The red line is where you're at. The yellow line is where you should be.
Of course, I don't know if you've moved the crank or not.
Try setting it to the yellow (TDC) line and give us a left and right cam shot.


View attachment 261992

You might be off a tooth. The red line is where you're at. The yellow line is where you should be.
Of course, I don't know if you've moved the crank or not.
Try setting it to the yellow (TDC) line and give us a left and right cam shot.


View attachment 261992

So I moved it and it has some play. I'm assuming when I put the tensioner on, it won't have any play

 

[carlosdacook]

So I moved it and it has some play. I'm assuming when I put the tensioner on, it won't have any play

This is how far it moves

 

[Jim]

Your cam pic isn't centered down the cam, so I can't be 100% certain, but it looks like you're good.

 

[Jim]

This is how far it moves

Reset that to TDC with the tensioner still in and see if the cam notch is still vertical.

 

[Jim]

 

[carlosdacook]

View attachment 261998

Got it thankyou

 

[Melnic]

If you rotate slowly in the direction of engine rotation CCW then the front of the chain should be in tension as it would be running.

 

[5twins]

New chains are very tight and have no play, so I'm assuming you have re-used an old chain? To check the cam timing, I would install the tensioner and adjust it. That's how it will be running so that's where you want the cam timing correct. If the old chain is badly stretched, you may not be able to set the cam timing exactly. For me anyway, replacing the chain is part of the topend rebuild, unless it's a very low mileage motor (say less than 10K). Yours has quite a bit of play which is telling me it's pretty stretched out.