Noob: Xs650 46.6 bhp restriction

[Samh0]

One year ago i found and bought my pride and joy my first bike an xs650, and after working 6 days a week for a year and saving up i am finally taking my A2 motorbike licence but to my understanding i have heard that the xs650 is 3.3bhp over what I'm aloud to legally ride and be insured on.

I've been on the phone all day yesterday to insurers and the police to find out information regarding the possibility of me ever riding my bike and they said that seems as how old the bike is losing a few horsepower over the years isn't good enough, if the bike has come of the production line over 46.6bhp it needs to be restricted. if i can purchase a restrictor kit and have a form printed and signed by a mechanic proving its been fitted then i will be acceptable to ride.

Now here is the part where i am struggling and if anyone could provide me with some options or advice i would appreciate it thoroughly. Today i have scoured all of; eBay, gumtree and google for a restrictor kit for an xs650 or equivalent bhp bike and i cannot find a single thing if anyone knows of an old bike that outputs 50bhp or of a website that might fabricate something which could do the same job i would forever be in your debt. hope your having a good day guys!

 

[weekendrider]

You may find some helpful info in this thread.
http://www.xs650.com/threads/power.44680/

 

[Samh0]

You may find some helpful info in this thread.
http://www.xs650.com/threads/power.44680/

Thank you weekendrider ill relay this to the insurer and see if i can get a different outcome or maybe find one which only requires a dyno!

 

[Paulrxs650]

Well, I recognise that bike from somewhere......

 

[Paulrxs650]

Hi Sam, glad you've still got the bike!
So, here's a link to your build thread http://www.xs650.com/forum/showthread.php?t=31160&highlight=bobber+build+thread

The ignition system in your bike is the Boyer Bransden Micro Power. Boyer are a UK company and it may be worth giving them a call to see if there's anything they know of to restrict it http://www.boyerbransden.com/contact.html

If that's not a flyer, I'd look at getting on a dyno to see what it actually is putting out. The engine is completely stock and the jetting was set to get it running nice, not for performance. So you may find going back to stock jets drops the performance enough to get a dyno result under the required limit ( I've still got the original jets so could send you them)

Paul

 

[fredintoon]

Hi Sam and welcome,
When I left the UK in 1969 one could hang L-plates on a big twin on one's 16th birthday on "Acts Only" insurance and ride off to your first collision.
Alas that was then and now there's graduated licences.
But ain't graduating up from an A2 licence just a matter of riding a smaller bike for a while?
And you did say "first bike"? FWIW I reckon that even if it's de-rated to below 46.6 BHP an XS650 is too big for a beginner to learn on.
Best you buy something small and expendable to learn on and let the XS650 mature like a fine wine as your A2 times out.

 

[Samh0]

Hi Sam, glad you've still got the bike!
So, here's a link to your build thread http://www.xs650.com/forum/showthread.php?t=31160&highlight=bobber+build+thread

The ignition system in your bike is the Boyer Bransden Micro Power. Boyer are a UK company and it may be worth giving them a call to see if there's anything they know of to restrict it http://www.boyerbransden.com/contact.html

If that's not a flyer, I'd look at getting on a dyno to see what it actually is putting out. The engine is completely stock and the jetting was set to get it running nice, not for performance. So you may find going back to stock jets drops the performance enough to get a dyno result under the required limit ( I've still got the original jets so could send you them)

Paul

Haha i bet you do Paul seems as though you made the beauty ill never let her go i love it to pieces, thanks for the very detailed response and i shall get on it tomorrow morning, i was thinking of giving you a call but i didn't want to bother you. fingers crossed my test goes ok and i should be riding it by the end of august

Hey as well I've been following your next build since you started it, and how amazing it looks now you had me drooling!! you honestly should have your own shop as you can't half design and build bikes! Hope all is well

 

[Samh0]

Hi Sam and welcome,
When I left the UK in 1969 one could hang L-plates on a big twin on one's 16th birthday on "Acts Only" insurance and ride off to your first collision.
Alas that was then and now there's graduated licences.
But ain't graduating up from an A2 licence just a matter of riding a smaller bike for a while?
And you did say "first bike"? FWIW I reckon that even if it's de-rated to below 46.6 BHP an XS650 is too big for a beginner to learn on.
Best you buy something small and expendable to learn on and let the XS650 mature like a fine wine as your A2 times out.

Hi Fredintoon thanks for the advice, Yeah I'm limited to a 46.6bhp bike for 2 years and after that i can re-take my test and ride an unlimited cc bike but after the 2 years I'm don't think ill be getting a new bike i loved this bike to much intact since the minute i saw it! when you see it you'll understand. I'm doing my training on a suzuki gs500 at the minute and that has a bhp of 47 but it isn't half heavy and clunky haha.

 

[650Skull]

These might help. Some brochures aren't any help as they state the bike has 50hp,53hp,52hp. On a lot they wont state the hp, only give the torque.

2 Dyno charts. One from a road test and the chart is dated 74 and the other is a Heiden Tuning Dyno test taken from their website. Both are around the 43hp-44hp. Note the Heiden Tuning dyno has the bike up to 47hp with open exhaust and pod fiters.

 

[angus67]

Unsync the carbs, and dyno it, take the papers to the gods that be.

 

[Paulrxs650]

Hi Sam,

Glad you like the new build! I'm sure you'll breeze the test! Post up how get on.

Paul

 

[blim840]

Should point out that the quoted bhp is usually worked out at the crank not rear wheel, also I think Hieden tuning's dyno is a touch optimistic as I have had mine on a dyno twice, as a 650 with pods and open pipes and not very well set BS34's I was about 38bhp at the rear wheel. As an 840 with open pipes and pods and 447 cam and properly set up BS34's, on a different dyno 46.6 was the final run coz we richened the middle to smooth it out but did get one run a bit weaker at 49bhp. I am now running 34mm Amal carbs and a 256 camshaft and it goes like f*ck but prob only mid 50's as not had it on a dyno in its current set up..... I would start again and just not mention horsepower, I think the later ones according to the Haynes book of lies are between 36-46 or something it only lists the really early ones as over 50 bhp (XS1/2) so I think you are over worrying mate......

 

[grizld1]

First off, Sam, you need to find out how that regulation is stated. If you have to restrict your motor, don't play with intake, exhaust, camshaft, spark timing, etc., to do it; rev limiters are cheap, easily installed, and easy to document. Good luck to you!

 

[Samh0]

Should point out that the quoted bhp is usually worked out at the crank not rear wheel, also I think Hieden tuning's dyno is a touch optimistic as I have had mine on a dyno twice, as a 650 with pods and open pipes and not very well set BS34's I was about 38bhp at the rear wheel. As an 840 with open pipes and pods and 447 cam and properly set up BS34's, on a different dyno 46.6 was the final run coz we richened the middle to smooth it out but did get one run a bit weaker at 49bhp. I am now running 34mm Amal carbs and a 256 camshaft and it goes like f*ck but prob only mid 50's as not had it on a dyno in its current set up..... I would start again and just not mention horsepower, I think the later ones according to the Haynes book of lies are between 36-46 or something it only lists the really early ones as over 50 bhp (XS1/2) so I think you are over worrying mate......

Hi blim840 thank you very much for that information, you will have saved me a lot of money going for dyno tests and buying restrictor kits for other models of bikes and paying to have them fitted by a certified garage lol. i thought i was over thinking a bit it ill keep it on the hush then and see where i can get with it, thanks for the help!

 

[Samh0]

First off, Sam, you need to find out how that regulation is stated. If you have to restrict your motor, don't play with intake, exhaust, camshaft, spark timing, etc., to do it; rev limiters are cheap, easily installed, and easy to document. Good luck to you!

hi grizld1 thanks for the advice i was potentially going to do the intake/ exhaust method, but i think I'm going to risk it by keeping it on the quiet that the bike has 50bhp as like grizld1 said he really had to push and modify it to get it to the maximum stated 50bhp and seems as though its so old i doubt they will be bothered enough to dig out some xs650 brochures

As far as the law goes i got this of the .gov website " A2 licence - Standard motorcycle up to 35 kW (and a power-to-weight ratio not more than 0.2 kW per kg), bike mustn’t be derived from vehicle more than twice its power " which the bike should be suitable for!

 

[blim840]

No worries man hope you enjoy getting it on the road, unless it is an XS1/XS2 your not being naughty at all as I think the later engines are all below 47bhp even at the crank it was only early motors claimed over 50bhp, truth be told on a dyno you'd be lucky to achieve 40bhp rear wheel on any model at standard 650 with standard carbs, pod filters wont make a huge difference either, it should be really cheap to insure! Just had a look in the book and XS1B, XS2, TX650 53bhp @ 7000 rpm, XS650A is 43.36 @ 7000 rpm XS650C is 45.61 @ 7500rpm and the later ones and US imports will all be under even at the crank!!! Nothing to worry about!!

 

[blim840]

Should also say you loose power through the gearbox and drive chain hence the manufactures "crank" figures are higher than that on a dyno as that is measured at the rear wheel, like even an O-ring chain will loose you power on a dyno, but like I said its not over power even at the crank mate!

 

[Samh0]

No worries man hope you enjoy getting it on the road, unless it is an XS1/XS2 your not being naughty at all as I think the later engines are all below 47bhp even at the crank it was only early motors claimed over 50bhp, truth be told on a dyno you'd be lucky to achieve 40bhp rear wheel on any model at standard 650 with standard carbs, pod filters wont make a huge difference either, it should be really cheap to insure! Just had a look in the book and XS1B, XS2, TX650 53bhp @ 7000 rpm, XS650A is 43.36 @ 7000 rpm XS650C is 45.61 @ 7500rpm and the later ones and US imports will all be under even at the crank!!! Nothing to worry about!!

Thanks for having a look for that blame840 your a star!

 

[Paulrxs650]

Go for it Sam

 

[blim840]

Your most welcome Sam I think the 47bhp rule is better than it used to be, it was 33bhp when I did my test, pretty much had to restrict everything... You have way more choice at 47bhp without having to restrict now, you have made a good choice with the XS as twins have way more torque than a four cylinder bike and torque is just has just as much to do with things as bhp, you should find it a fun bike, you often find big sports bikes when restricted are a bit boring if that makes sense... The only reason I would not mention anything about it being restricted or not is because its prob not on the list of approved bikes because its old so you'll just confuse them and possibly end up with a higher premium as well that's all, you should be able to insure it as a classic bike it should be cheap as chips....