The sweet sound of pinging spokes... on one side only.

[Mister Mellow]

My stock aluminum wheels are straight and true. Whoever laced them did a beautiful job of removing any trace of vertical or horizontal movement, and they are both perfectly centered on the bike. The problem is, when I ping tested the spokes, ALL the spokes on the right side of both wheels ping nicely, and ALL the ones on the left side return a dull thud. I checked for broken spokes, and they're all good.

My question:

Obviously, the loose spokes need to be tightened, but what will happen when I do so? I have only laced one wheel in my life, some 30-odd years ago, but I remember the basics. This is a weird problem, and I'm scratching my head trying to predict whether the rim will move horizontally when I do this.

Should I ONLY tighten the loose ones (evenly), or should I correspondingly loosen the tight ones as I go around. My fear is that loosening the tighter ones (on the right) will move the rims to the left. My current thinking is that, if I leave the tight ones alone, they will hold the wheel where it is, while I simply bring the loose spokes to their proper torque. But I'm not certain of this.

 

[blackbetty]

My stock aluminum wheels are straight and true. Whoever laced them did a beautiful job of removing any trace of vertical or horizontal movement, and they are both perfectly centered on the bike. The problem is, when I ping tested the spokes, ALL the spokes on the right side of both wheels ping nicely, and ALL the ones on the left side return a dull thud. I checked for broken spokes, and they're all good.

My question:

Obviously, the loose spokes need to be tightened, but what will happen when I do so? I have only laced one wheel in my life, some 30-odd years ago, but I remember the basics. This is a weird problem, and I'm scratching my head trying to predict whether the rim will move horizontally when I do this.

Should I ONLY tighten the loose ones (evenly), or should I correspondingly loosen the tight ones as I go around. My fear is that loosening the tighter ones (on the right) will move the rims to the left. My current thinking is that, if I leave the tight ones alone, they will hold the wheel where it is, while I simply bring the loose spokes to their proper torque. But I'm not certain of this.

Before I walk through a rim I get a spoke wrench on each nipple starting from the valve and go once around the wheel, just to get a feeling for how tight each spoke is. I have not heard of doing a ping test on moto spokes, the spokes really thick. I don't even use this as an effective gauge for my bicycle wheels to be honest....

If the side is indeed loose, tightenting those spokes will pull the hoop over. The rims are very thick though, you may be able to establish adequate tension without ruining the runout much.

I'd probably take it to a shop if you don't have the tools or knowledge. They are wheels after all.

 

[jd750ace]

I would take it to a shop, or use a spoke nipple torque wrench to see where each side is so you know what you are dealing with. It ain't a harp, and you can't judge tension any more by the sound of a spoke than you can tell if a big rig tire has the right pressure by whacking on it with a big stick. All them gators on the road don't come from people checking and adjusting cold tire pressure. An owner operator probably does on his tractor, as he knows what it costs to replace those tires, but lots of drivers say they just check the tires on the trailer and make sure they have air in them. Got news for ya: Even the flat ones have air in them! Gauge it properly, and save yourself further issues.

$0.02

 

[Mister Mellow]

Before I walk through a rim I get a spoke wrench on each nipple starting from the valve and go once around the wheel, just to get a feeling for how tight each spoke is. I have not heard of doing a ping test on moto spokes, the spokes really thick. I don't even use this as an effective gauge for my bicycle wheels to be honest....

If the side is indeed loose, tightenting those spokes will pull the hoop over. The rims are very thick though, you may be able to establish adequate tension without ruining the runout much.

I'd probably take it to a shop if you don't have the tools or knowledge. They are wheels after all.

Thanks. I was looking for opinions or educated guesses as to whether the wheel would shift positions, and given two scenarios, what could theoretically happen. What actually happens will happen. I think you're right, the rim will shift if I tighten one side (assuming they need tightening). This was more of a "what do you think would happen if..." theoretical question, which presented two scenarios: one in which only one side is tightened, and the other dealing with the necessity of loosening the right side. Although I didn't say, it is safe to assume that I will do this properly. Just musing on the "theory" aspects.

I don't need to take it into a shop, as I can handle re-trueing the wheels if setting to proper torque shifts it beyond acceptable limits.

As to ping testing, I'm not alone in this. Maybe it's old-school, but it's a quick and dirty way to test to see if you have any anomalies, like a loose or broken spoke.

Jd750ace, yes, it's not a substitute for properly torquing the spokes, but then again, I never said it was. For several model years, the new Bonneville had a problem with spokes breaking. Doing a quick ping test every so often can quickly zero in on a bad one, or at least one that needs attention.

 

[Mister Mellow]

I found where I'd recently read about spoke pinging on Yamahas. On re-reading my previous post, I realized I sounded a bit sassy when I said, "I'm not alone in this." I didn't mean to be, sorry. I was kind of obsessing on trying to recall where I'd recently read this. It's nowhere in either my Yamaha or Triumph factory manuals.

I finally found it in my Clymer manual,* which was down in my shop (the test is also recommended in my Haynes Triumph manual). In the Chassis section, under "Wheel and Spoke Inspection," it says to:

• Grasp 2 consecutive spokes and squeeze. If they move, tension is not sufficient. Another method for checking is to rap the individual spokes with a wrench or key. A properly tuned spoke will produce a clean ringing sound. A loose spoke will produce a dull thud. Tighten each loose spoke 1/4 turn at the nipple, working around the wheel until all are tight. Tightening each spoke fully at first will cause the wheel to be out-of-round. (My emphasis)

It then instructs to test the wheels for runout, and if >1/16", true the wheel.

Like I said, this is something I've done my whole life as a quick check, especially during a post-ride check on dirt bikes. The Clymer manual recommends checking every 1,000 miles. On my Bonneville, I just check for broken spokes when I think about it, usually before I take a long ride. I've just been slowly going over stuff on my XS because I just bought it.

I think what happened is whoever trued the wheels did it on the bike, and sat on one side to do it. Most likely, he unwittingly gave more attention to the near side, maybe because of spoke wrench access. Anyway, I'm not afraid to tackle anything, and even though I've only built one wheel, I laced and trued it correctly. It was just a slow and methodical all-day task. I've done zillions of bicycles, but kind of a different ball game.

*Yamaha 650 Twins: 1970-1982 (Clymer Publications, 1987, eighth edition, second printing, November, 1987), Page 132.