To Pamco or not to Pamco

Jtcrash

Jtcrash

Satans proctologist
Messages
28
Reaction score
6
Points
3
Location
Lucan Ontario
I'm doing a top end on my 79 and a bunch of other upgrades. Since I built it about 4 years ago its had its highs and lows. Time to show this old girl some love. Full top end including rings and timing chain and guide, bunch of dress up stuff, new tank and powdercoating

My question is I have a little extra cash when all is said and done and was told that deleting the brush ignition system would make it more peppy and reliable. Heres my current set up so you gentlemen can tell me which direction I should be going.

Hughs Handbuilt full PMA system with battery eliminator capacitor (huge thanks to Hugh!)
xs650 direct Green Monster coils
Stock spark plug boots
Stock style wires
BPR7ES plugs
Stock head light
LED tail light
No starter, Kick only
That's everything electrical this baby's running (less is the new more right?)

Please advise on weather a Pamco would jive with what I have
I bow to my senior XS 650 gurus
 
Stock spark plug boots (the part that connects the wires to the plugs) have a 5k resistor so you do not need resistor plugs too.
 
Read up on problems with Pamco setups with capacitors before you commit. They need a constant voltage (battery setup) in order to function properly. There are many threads on guys having problems/blaming pamco or pma setups. Be wise on your choice and buy from Pamco Pete directly cause others are fakes.
 
Thank you very much for the heads up. I’m hoping someone will respond with the same setup as I have. I’m for sure going to go with Pamco Pete if I go that way. I really trust the guys on here for the high level info. Everyone’s so willing to help. Even owning this bike 4 years I’m still pretty fresh to the 650 world.
 
jtcrash,
PAMCO XS650 products are only available through www.yamahaxs650.com We no longer sell through distribution and have passed the savings on to the customer with a $69.95 price for the original PAMCO. Also available with the a high performance coil for $109.95. The so called "Green Monster" coil has a habit of self destructing and taking the ignition with it. Similar savings available for the latest E-Ignition @ $149.95 or with the coil, $189.90.
Ride. Enjoy. Life is simple.
 
Jtcrash said:
My question is I have a little extra cash when all is said and done and was told that deleting the brush ignition system would make it more peppy and reliable. Heres my current set up so you gentlemen can tell me which direction I should be going.
Hughs Handbuilt full PMA system with battery eliminator capacitor (huge thanks to Hugh!)
xs650 direct Green Monster coils
Stock spark plug boots
Stock style wires
BPR7ES plugs
Stock head light
LED tail light
No starter, Kick only
That's everything electrical this baby's running (less is the new more right?)
Please advise on weather a Pamco would jive with what I have
I bow to my senior XS 650 gurus
Click to expand...

Hi Jtcrash,
WTF is a "brush ignition system"?
You presumably mean the stock rotating electromagnet alternator.
Whoever told you swapping to a PMA would add pep and reliability was either trying to sell you one or had swallowed the PMA koolade.
All a PMA does is let your bike run without a battery and whoever told you that was a good idea is plain daft.
But can you run a Pamco with a batteryless system? Pete sez um, well, yes but for sure not the fancy one.
 
Jtcrash said:
I'm doing a top end on my 79 and a bunch of other upgrades. Since I built it about 4 years ago its had its highs and lows. Time to show this old girl some love. Full top end including rings and timing chain and guide, bunch of dress up stuff, new tank and powdercoating

My question is I have a little extra cash when all is said and done and was told that deleting the brush ignition system would make it more peppy and reliable. Heres my current set up so you gentlemen can tell me which direction I should be going.

Hughs Handbuilt full PMA system with battery eliminator capacitor (huge thanks to Hugh!)
xs650 direct Green Monster coils
Stock spark plug boots
Stock style wires
BPR7ES plugs
Stock head light
LED tail light
No starter, Kick only
That's everything electrical this baby's running (less is the new more right?)

Please advise on weather a Pamco would jive with what I have
I bow to my senior XS 650 gurus
Click to expand...

Pma puts out a continuous 200 watts........XS650 in Factory form puts out around 130 watts and this is on a variable scale

That leaves about 70 Watts the charging system has to get rid of............Hugh has had problems in the past with his Reg/rect due to various problems and his solution was to offer the moffit Reg/rect for an added cost...........

On the Factory charging system bike, installing LED taillights and indicators reduces the load on the Factory charging system. Using LED lights on a PMA that is already putting out way more Wattage than a factory bike can use means there is more Heat for PMA Reg/Rect to get rid of.............More incandescent bulbs on the bike eats up more of the excess wattage.less load on the Reg/Rect.

Urban myth that a PMA is more reliable and less maintenance than the Factory Charging system........

Why not get hughs combined CDI/PMA when shopping at Hughs????

So no......... less lights or running LED's is not better when running a PMA..........
 
650Skull said:
Pma puts out a continuous 200 watts........XS650 in Factory form puts out around 130 watts and this is on a variable scale

That leaves about 70 Watts the charging system has to get rid of............Hugh has had problems in the past with his Reg/rect due to various problems and his solution was to offer the moffit Reg/rect for an added cost...........

On the Factory charging system bike, installing LED taillights and indicators reduces the load on the Factory charging system. Using LED lights on a PMA that is already putting out way more Wattage than a factory bike can use means there is more Heat for PMA Reg/Rect to get rid of.............More incandescent bulbs on the bike eats up more of the excess wattage.less load on the Reg/Rect.

Urban myth that a PMA is more reliable and less maintenance than the Factory Charging system........

Why not get hughs combined CDI/PMA when shopping at Hughs????

So no......... less lights or running LED's is not better when running a PMA..........
Click to expand...

You are damned if you do and damned if you don't use LEDs with a PMA. You are correct in saying you need all the power absorbing lights you can get to dissipate the excessive current from a PMA, but when the engine is just idling with a capacitor in place of the battery, those current hogs will reduce the available voltage / current for the ignition coils and you may have problems with the engine miss firing or quiting completely.
 
Last edited:
Ratranger advocates a different type of PMA regulator
If you do a PMA I recommend an SH775 reg/rec. Instead of shunting the extra power to ground it shuts down phases, the stator and reg/rec run cooler. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polaris-RZ...0c44ac6:g:4WgAAOSw3ANb4wk9&LH_ItemCondition=4
that open circuits the alternator legs instead of dissipating the excess wattage into a resistor, makes sense to me but I have no experience in using one, not sure if that would create reliability problems in the stator coils?? It would have to have good voltage suppression? as I would guess those open circuit legs might develop some serious voltage with no load on them? Just guesses. Heck I have about 5 minutes of riding time on a PMA equipped XS650....
 
Last edited:
gggGary said:
Ratranger advocates a different type of PMA regulator
If you do a PMA I recommend an SH775 reg/rec. Instead of shunting the extra power to ground it shuts down phases, the stator and reg/rec run cooler. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Polaris-RZ...0c44ac6:g:4WgAAOSw3ANb4wk9&LH_ItemCondition=4
that open circuits the alternator legs instead of dissipating the excess wattage into a resistor, makes sense to me but I have no experience in using one, not sure if that would create reliability problems in the stator coils?? It would have to have good voltage suppression? as I would guess those open circuit legs might develop some serious voltage with no load on them? Just guesses. Heck I have about 5 minutes of riding time on a PMA equipped XS650....
Click to expand...

Gary, I think you would be far better off sourcing a genuine Shindengen FHO20AA Reg/rect. The one in your link appears to be a repop, although a very good one as it has the SS back and the slotted mounting hole - just missing the brandname, which is a bit of a giveaway.
See here for a quick guide in spotting the repop Shindengen reg/rect's. Genuine FHO20AA's go for big $ new, however, can be found on newer wrecked bikes for good prices. I sourced mine from a Honda CBR500 for $50.
Additionally, I run a 130w PMA with no battery. I also run with my incandescent headlight on at all times ( a lesson learnt from working on and owning old HD's - which also run a single phase PMA) to reduce any excess voltage. The bike has been running with no issues for years.
Here is a FHO20aa review from youtube
 
fredintoon said:
Hi Jtcrash,
WTF is a "brush ignition system"?
You presumably mean the stock rotating electromagnet alternator.
Whoever told you swapping to a PMA would add pep and reliability was either trying to sell you one or had swallowed the PMA koolade.
All a PMA does is let your bike run without a battery and whoever told you that was a good idea is plain daft.
But can you run a Pamco with a batteryless system? Pete sez um, well, yes but for sure not the fancy one.
Click to expand...
Ya. Sorry I did miss speak. I was referring to the stock points system.
 
Jtcrash said:
Ya. Sorry I did miss speak. I was referring to the stock points system.
Click to expand...

Hi Jtcrash,
points are easy to understand and simple to adjust but yeah, their settings do tend to drift out of spec.
OTOH electronic iggys like the Pamco work by what as well be magic but they do stay where they are put.
Just install your Pamco EXACTLY as the instructions tell you and it'll be fine.
 

Similar threads

peterg
Resistance plugs and non-resistance caps
Replies
13
Views
1K
Team Junk
Team Junk
johne67
Exhaust Sucking In Air
Replies
13
Views
1K
Slippery
Slippery
XS1204
Original Starter Button Question..
2
Replies
35
Views
2K
XS1204
XS1204
K
XS charge ignition problems.
3 4 5
Replies
81
Views
6K
ApparatusMC
A
krza
E-ignition diagnosis help needed
Replies
0
Views
567
krza
krza
Back
Top