2013 XS650

[Atrvo]

If Yamaha was to bring out a new XS650 or XS bike what things would you like to see in the new bike and what would you like to see gone?
Would you keep the air cooled single cam design with the iconic tap pit access? I think the overall deign of the frame need not change except the suspention. Would you keep the kick start?

 

[Paulrxs650]

It would follow the ne Norton design - classic yet modern

 

[Scrambled]

If Yamaha was to bring out a new XS650 or XS bike what things would you like to see in the new bike and what would you like to see gone?
Would you keep the air cooled single cam design with the iconic tap pit access? I think the overall deign of the frame need not change except the suspention. Would you keep the kick start?

The kick start is what makes a vintage bike . If they brought out a new XS they would probably screw it up. Look at the old British bikes and the new ones . I like old Brit bikes because they were light , the new ones weigh too much . I hated Brit bikes because the Lucas electrics and the oil leaks and the odd size nuts and bolts . If the Brit bikes were built basically the same as the real ones but with the bugs ironed out I would buy one.

 

[gggGary]

Closed loop EFI and cats are needed now, not easy to hide that.

 

[yamasarus]

And the new Bonneville is better than the old in every respect, brakes, power, handling, comfort, vibration and quality. And it will get you home, even in the dark. And it won't stain your garage floor. And no, I don't have one.

 

[yamasarus]

A few years ago Yamaha displayed a bike at the Tokyo show that payed homage to the XS650. They called it "Sakura". It was really an exciting design, but it was a V-twin. Even so I would probably have bought on. It was voted best bike in their display, but nothing else was ever heard. Here's a link.

 

[jd750ace]

Just about everything I would want to see in a modern version would add weight or detract from the lines of the original. She was heavy enough originally. It could be re-done significantly and still stay close, but I don't know if it could be done as simply. Granted, they don't seem simple when the carbs or electrics are giving you fits, but the basic machine is very simple indeed. Could it use a stiffer frame and swingarm? Lighter wheels? more efficient brakes? Better charging system? Sure, but then, would it really be "the same"? I see the Japanese market SR400 single, and think it could be done, but it would probably loose out by the time it got "conformed" for the US market.

 

[wannabridin]

And the new Bonneville is better than the old in every respect, brakes, power, handling, comfort, vibration and quality. And it will get you home, even in the dark. And it won't stain your garage floor. And no, I don't have one.

X2 big time on this! i used to be a technician at a Triumph/BMW dealership in Denver and one day i was going over the national recall records for all major brands of bikes and Triumph had the least about of warranty issues or quality issues (reliability) of any major manufacturer. even the adjusted numbers (volume of triumphs compared to japs, BMW and stuff), they were still #1. it's been that way for years now!

and with very little cash you can turn a bonnie into a little rocket ship with new-old classic lines!! i'd love to have a new thruxton, and a speed triple!!

 

[peanut]

this is the problem ... how much could you change without losing the old world charm and idiosyncrasies of the original bike ?

I am an inveterate tinkerer , always have been. I can't own anything that I don't immediately look to see how I can adapt or modify it to improve it. its a curse.

For me I would want to introduce an electronic fuel injection and engine management system .

Trouble is how would you install that to the existing engine without radically altering the iconic look of the original xs650 engine
http://motorcycles.findthebest.com/compare/59-399/2011-Triumph-Thruxton-vs-2012-Triumph-Speed-Triple-R

 

[GreasyC]

Have a look at the modern triumph again. Those CV carbs aren't CV carbs. That's how you hide the EFI if you really feel you need to.

What's the point of Yamaha making a new one if you don't want them to change all these things mentioned. The bike you guys are asking for is already available, its called an XS650. Sounds like what you really want to buy is an aftermarket ECU and some suspension bits for the bike you already have.

I like the styling of the XS, the attractive air cooled engine, the visual simplicity of it compared to the overly busy angles and colors that dominate the modern market. I don't like the work out bench seat. Since when was your crotch rectangular? Terrible ergonomics. I see it as a lame penny pinching way to make a "one size fits all seat" that doesnt fit anyone all that well. There's no attention paid to the ergonomics of the tank either. It should be higher, easier to grip with your thigh/knee. It doesn't help that the loose rubber mounts let it wobble so it feels like an even less secure anchor for your leg.

A new one should also loose 50-100 pounds, have modern suspension and tires, a 270 firing order like Yamaha's other modern twins and a proper combustion chamber so it can have flat, light weight pistons that don't shake it to death like the tank rounds we have now. With that and a modern valve train it would make a lot more power at a lot less vibration.

 

[resto]

Yamaha ought to bring out something like the Kawasaki W800 (basically a punched out W650). EFI, electronic ignition, 4 valves per cylinder. Lose the bevel gear valve drive, replace it with a between the cylinders cam chain, restyle the engine cases a bit, give it a Yamaha influenced paint job.

I'm sure they would fly off the showroom floor but would cut deeply into the sales of their own V Twin models.

I can't understand why Kawasaki only only imported their W650 into North America for years 2000 and 2001, especially since they are still making them in Japan

http://bikerholic.com/2010/11/03/20...est-installment-in-the-iconic-retro-w-series/

 

[Reid]

DOHC hidden away in a set of cases that still keep the look, with shim under bucket valve lash adjustment, cams side driven for easy cam timing adjustment, 6 speed that would handle highway speeds, and keep the kick start. Also all of the required smog crap to be held on with one bolt

 

[bt24]

A few years ago Yamaha displayed a bike at the Tokyo show that payed homage to the XS650. They called it "Sakura". It was really an exciting design, but it was a V-twin. Even so I would probably have bought on. It was voted best bike in their display, but nothing else was ever heard. Here's a link.

That is very nice, I would definately buy that in a heartbeat!!

 

[ProSimex]

why they dont put kick starts on new bikes is beyond me

 

[Sgt Hollywood]

I'm sure they would fly off the showroom floor but would cut deeply into the sales of their own V Twin models.

I can't understand why Kawasaki only only imported their W650 into North America for years 2000 and 2001, especially since they are still making them in

Sad thing about the Kawi W650 is that they didn't fly off the showroom floor. At the time they were a very small niche bike. I'd love to see a W800 in the states, but one needs to consider that fact that many people in the vintage bike scene are also not paying new bike prices for them. Not to mention that the profit margin on a w650/w800 isn't huge.

I have however been looking for a w650 to build with.

Cafe's are the Choppers of 10+ years ago.
In regard to brit bike buyers, many are buying because of the image of a brit bike vs. something Japanese, similar to the Monster crowd. Not all of course but most I know.

 

[GreasyC]

The w650 was about 10 years too early in the US. The whole retro/cafe racer thing didn't reach critical mass until recently. In 2000 a cafe racer was still something mechanically inclined guys custom made out of cheap old bikes. Guys like carpy were making a good business out of cranking out the cb750s, but it was nowhere near the national prime time consciousness. The guys who bought the w650 at that time had grey hair, no time for tools, and something against harley

Twelve years later we're well into the point where first time buyers want to buy a new production bike with that kind of styling. People build them on a TV series just like the chopper shows a decade ago. Now it's probably close to being too late for kawasaki to get a piece of that market. Triumph had the thruxton out for years, moto guzzi has a cafe racer model, there's a few more I'm forgetting, but more and more these days you're seeing retro dirt bike styling becoming the trend. The old "Scrambler" style of pretending a 500 pound street bike will be fun off road if you just change how it looks is back and the kids love it.Triumph was once again right on top of that, and their scrambler even has a 270 rephase stock. Whoever is running the show over there is apparently a pretty savvy trend watcher.

 

[oldbiker]

A few years ago Yamaha displayed a bike at the Tokyo show that payed homage to the XS650. They called it "Sakura". It was really an exciting design, but it was a V-twin. Even so I would probably have bought on. It was voted best bike in their display, but nothing else was ever heard. Here's a link.

........................i remember printing off a picture of that bike,,, although it did look heavy,,,, ,,,,but nothing happened,,, all yamaha did is tease us,,,,,,,, i even got a price on an engilish bike,,, being built by an american with his own track to test bikes on ,,,of course it was the new norton commando ,,,he, sent me a few pics,, of the new norton ,,,and a new cost of $17,000 plus delivery in 6 months..... i was smart enough to say no thanks....no an english company has bought it back to be manufactured in england...

 

[Reid]

why they dont put kick starts on new bikes is beyond me

A friend of mine builds ECUs for drag bikes, and constantly tries to get me to put one on my XS until we start talking about the kick starter. He says he thinks that the short low speed kick over would not be enough for the crank sensor. That may be the same reason we no longer see them on new bikes.

 

[gggGary]

I will have to look for the reference, but someone did check and a kick is remarkably fast, a healthy one spins the engine faster than the E start. The kicker does need a retarded spark, some race ECUs don't provide that.

 

[Reid]

That may well be the case, all I know for sure is that when I say kick start he stops talking about it.