Anyone running Top Fools pipes?

VENMUS

VENMUS

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Is anyone running the Top Fools pipes made by Ardcore choppers? They are on a number of bikes, but notably the Wizard Sleeze is a great example. Here is a photo:

tpfools2.jpg


The only problem I see with them is the cost :S They want $225 plus shipping for 2 little pipes that are about a foot long each. How much tubing could I buy for that kind of coin?!?! Anyways, as luck would have it they're the ones I want ultimately, so I extend a question on any feedback whatsoever! How are they? Do you get more stuff with it (header wrap, fasteners, head studs, carb needles, seriously anything) that justifies the outrageous price? What diameter are they? No baffles I'm guessing? Talk to me!

Thanks in advance..
Logan
 
I don't know but it seems if you're gonna wrap them anyway couldn't you get some shop close to home to fab them up? I mean under the wrap do they have to be pretty? Gordon Scott on here makes pipes. Maybe you could get him to make you some.I'd email them and see what comes with them.
 
That was my line of thinking as well. Get the local exhaust guys to bend some stainless tubing up quick, but I'd need diameter of pipe, and angle of bends, and the header-mount off the stockers or else a new way to hold them on.

If anyone IS running them and could take some measurements I'd sure as heck appreciate it....
 
You will need the spigots and flanges to mount whatever you have made. One way to get these is to buy a set of used pipes off ebay etc. You could also have the spigots machined and purchase the flanges from Mike's or ebay.

A few things to consider with pipes that short:

1.) Every time you're idling (stop light) you might as well just bend over and suck on that pipe.
2.) Have fun cleaning the shit off from your bike.

But hey, carbon monoxide poisoning is less filling AND tastes great! Just sayin'...

3.) You'll be having a lot more chats with your local law enforcement. That's always fun.

Anyway, if you're interested in buying a set of machined spigots, head over to TCU and look up blacksmithbilly. $45 shipped.

Remember; you get what you pay for and price is determined by availability. If you can't do it yourself, you have to expect to pay a premium to someone who can.

Billy's spigots:
 

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:bike: Yay! Teebs joined the party!

By using the term spigot you refer to the same thing as the photo you posted, which is what slides into the actual engine and creates a seat in the head. (Quite obviously you cant shove a raw pipe into the hole and expect it to work).

Also the flange is the ugly cast ribbed piece that's impossible to remove from stock pipes without cutting them? Mine are in fine shape, just rusty and still on the pipes.

The things I'm to be considering:
1) Carbon Monoxide will undoubtedly form a haze around the bike when not moving, and it's more pronounced when the pipes stop so suddenly in a very forward position on the bike. (essentially further forward than my head, when I'm riding it.) I am familiar with gas flow and dynamics of exhaust circulation. Hell, my CBR has undertail exhaust and a common side-effect of this is perpetually discussed between enthusiasts. It creates a slipstream in the form of an air bubble around the rider and is exactly why you get off the bike smelling like "Eu de Yoshimura".

2) I don't understand what I am to be cleaning off my bike, unless it's carbon deposits or soot your talking about?

3) What straight through designed muffler is intended to be a quiet one? Now, ask the same question backwards..... What quiet muffler is designed to be of straight through construction? It's like water and grease man, they don't work that way. I know it will be loud, but tell that to the 1800cc groundpounding/headache causing/ears-on-the-verge-of-bleeding cruisers that circulate my city like an infestation of cockroaches.

I can probably have the pipes made locally, and if so, I'm quite sure it will be less than 225 + shipping. I can give them my stock pipes to cut/reweld the 'spigots' onto the new pipes for me. Problem solved?

(not barking up your factual tree here Teebs, but I can relate to your point of view, and chose to respond in a similar fashion)

Any input on actual dimensions would still be great, if someone could please.

Thanks
Logan
 
:D YES!!!

In response to:

1) - I like that smell too.

2) - Aforementioned soot and carbon deposits will just make your scoot look "authentic".

3) - Well hell, if you can't beat noise pollution... add to it! Let me know how that Miracle Ear works out... (mine is sweet)

You definitely can have them made locally for way less, and since you have your original exhaust, you're golden. Although the fins help with heat dispersion, you can always remove them from the flanges. They also sell ones without the fins. The pipe is 1.5". You can always pick up some bends and fabricate them yourself. Those pipes would be super-easy and the bends are cheap.

By the way, when did facts and the internet ever have anything to do with one another? I'm 14, and right now I'm sitting in Mom's basement...er, my Command Center, schooling ignorant middle-aged uber-riders on one site, scanning Hentai on another and posting photoshopped pics of Obama as Alfred E. Neuman on a Mad magazine cover with the famous "What, Me Worry?" tag-line written out in EZ Cheez and IMing my Latvian bff Mikelis about the efficaciousness of Botulin as opposed to Ricin. (Botulin totally pwns Ricin, FYI.) That stuff about Botulin vs. Ricin is entirely hypothetical. (That's a disclaimer.)
 
Why not just cut the stock header pipes to the length desired - it's free and will take about 10 minutes. Wrap if you wish.
 
Are they called "top fools" because you would have to be a fool to pay that much for what looks like any header cut in half:laugh:
 
why not buy some mandrel piping from speedway and make your own pipes, for 200, I can make a whole bunch of sets like that.
I just made a wicked set of 2 into 1 pipes for my xs, flanges and everything you need are easily made, or buy em, ....I'll post pictures up in a couple days when the bike is done.
 
gentlemanjim said:
Why not just cut the stock header pipes to the length desired - it's free and will take about 10 minutes. Wrap if you wish.
Click to expand...
I agree, cut off at that length and see how it runs :laugh: I know Nate , stand up guy:thumbsup: but having messed around myself with different pipes on the dyno I'm surprized they sell such short pipes?

Uploaded with ImageShack.us
 
dlabkeeg, just because you can't look at porn and assemble an M16 at the same time, doesn't mean the rest of us can't...
 
Ok I'll chime in on this one since you are talking about a product of ours..
First off the pipes on the sleeze are wrapped because that's how I wanted them.
The dims on the pipes are not stock and there is quite a difference in the a stock cut off header and these pipes.

" Do you get more stuff with it (header wrap, fasteners, head studs, carb needles, seriously anything) that justifies the outrageous price?"
No, you put them on adjust carbs as needed and go...You also don't have to worry about those finned flanges you seem to not like cuz our pipes come with new flat one just like in that pic.
 
Short pipes will kill power and sound like a lawn mower. Great idea? 8^(

If you do use short pipes please take advise and use small diameter tubing to keep any of the torque you are giving away by using short pipes. 1 1/4" OD and wrap or double wall to get the fat look.

Tom Graham
 
Okay, Ardcore guys - don't think I'm bashing you or your business here, definitely not the case! I love the pipes! So much in fact that I'd like to sport them on my own bike. They are, however, not in the budget.....hence this post.

Now, I know it's not everyones cup of tea to have shorties, but these just look the bees knees to me. I have actually cut my stock pipes (which ardcore is correct in saying are NOTHING CLOSE to these pipes) and I have them ending at the under-engine exhaust mount which is that rectangular box on the frame. The stockers are also smaller diameter. I'll see how it runs this way before making my next move, but I'm sure I'll eventually want to have the 'Top Fools' :)

Thanks for the comments guys, smartass and helpful alike...

Logan
 
Check out speedway, jegs, columbia river mandrel bending, hell just google "mandrel bends" and see what you find. A minimum amount of effort with a hacksaw/sawzall, and a bit of welding and you can make your own for considerably less. If your welds are ugly, you can buy a shitload of header wrap with what you've saved.

And it doesn't matter if the guys at ardcore made those out of some new space-aged super-steel from the planet Krypton, performance will still suck ass. There comes a point where you are sacrificing way too much performance-wise for looks. This would be that point.

I'm not knocking the guys at ardcore. They seem to make quality products. But they're also out to make a profit (nothing wrong with that) and their concern isn't how well your bike runs after you drop the cash for their pipes. That's on you.
 
Glad I'm not the only one who thinks $200+ is crazy.. I bought a box of mandrel bends on ebay for $30 w/ 2 90's 2 45's 2 J's and 2 J's w/ 45's on one end. I could make two full length systems with what I've got. No offense flat flanges or not that's crazy
 
We don't think you're bashing us..
We build quality parts,we understand that guys have budgets but we also can't give our parts away.I bet if a guy figure out how much they spent on pipe,how long it took them to make a set of pipes(any set),How much the welder cost they are using to build them,then the time figuring out the jetting,buying the jets,time installing jets,etc..They would come out to the same price if not more in the long run.
That's the problem is most guys look at the short term,not what it take to make it work right in the end.
As far as everyone chiming in on performance maybe you should run a set and find out before you go and make an assumption. The sleeze blows the bars off of a buddy of mine stock xs,and he has a rebuilt motor, mikuni's etc..It identical motor set up wise with the exception he's running the stock exhaust.
 
ardcorechoppers said:
then the time figuring out the jetting,buying the jets,time installing jets,etc...
Click to expand...

So, my bike will run fine without doing that work just by installing your pipes? They must be magic! Just playin', but really, brother...

ardcorechoppers said:
I bet if a guy figure out how much they spent on pipe,how long it took them to make a set of pipes(any set),How much the welder cost they are using to build them...They would come out to the same price if not more in the long run.
Click to expand...

That's IF someone were to purchase a welder just to make pipes, which is a ridiculous suggestion. In my case, my welders paid for themselves many years ago, so scrap that. I bought a butt-load of bends for about $100 bucks. Straight 1.5" 16 gauge pipe is cheap at my local parts store. for $225, I can make about 6 sets of pipes, including the MIG wire and electricity. Labor is another animal all-together. Since most of us do this for the satisfaction of building it ourselves, labor doesn't really count. Although, I realize that it has to be included into your price, these pipes are nothing for you to make.

There isn't really any short-run thinking here at all. In fact, that doesn't even really make sense. Purchasing a welder, material to work with, taking the time to learn how to fabricate things for one's self... that seems like rather long-term thinking to me. How your pipes have anything to do with "making it work right" I haven't a clue. Are you suggesting that these pipes will increase performance?

ardcorechoppers said:
As far as everyone chiming in on performance maybe you should run a set and find out before you go and make an assumption. The sleeze blows the bars off of a buddy of mine stock xs,and he has a rebuilt motor, mikuni's etc..It identical motor set up wise with the exception he's running the stock exhaust.
Click to expand...

And you should know that that is no way to judge a bike's performance. There could be 20 other variables causing poor performance. How much weight have you shaved off the Sleeze? I can just look at it and tell it's a significant amount. If it's set up identically, no wonder it runs like shit. You can't tune carbs for stock pipes the same way you tune for those short pipes.

So, I'll assume that isn't what you meant. Just because your buddy has Mikunis, that doesn't mean they're adjusted right. It also doesn't mean they're set up to "blow the bars off other bikes", whatever that means. Faster take off, top end, what? Is the Sleeze set up for balls-out speed, while your buddy's is set up for a balance of speed, fuel economy and life span?

Regardless, dyno-test your Top Fools against your Half-popped and Long Shots. I'd like to see the results.
 

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