... and remember what Gary said, both plugs have to be grounded in a dual coil system.
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Crap, bike died on me, shorted spark plug wire?
- Thread starter XS650D
- Start date
If the timing (and spark and fuel) looks okay, suspect your choke. Might try squirting a bit of gas or starter fluid directly in to bypass need for choke (if nobody thinks it's unsafe) I have another suggestion if even that doesn't pan out.
P.S. holey floats is one thing that could result in running for awhile then seeming to run out of gas followed by not being able to start (seems to be the complaint)
P.S. holey floats is one thing that could result in running for awhile then seeming to run out of gas followed by not being able to start (seems to be the complaint)
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XS650D
XS650 Junkie
Thx all. Saga continues tomorrow with a lil more time. Going to try Timing light again as per Jims advise.
Like to at least see were it is. The Timing disc has not moved at all from when I set it last fall.(I had marked it in fall just incase)
I had carbs apart in spring and all was good then BUT...
Like to at least see were it is. The Timing disc has not moved at all from when I set it last fall.(I had marked it in fall just incase)
I had carbs apart in spring and all was good then BUT...
XS650D
XS650 Junkie
Update: went out looked over bike again tday. I no longer have any spark,WTF!
After closer inspection of all the wiring I found the new bullet connectors I installed for the new Reg were not good , found the Black (GROUND) had come completely apart and
the Green was very loose, Brown (Power) still tight. I guess after cutting of the old corroded plug and installing bullet connectors
I was trying to tuck them in tight out of way and they came apart.Lesson learned ,use twist ties or tape to hold in pace.
But now I have no spark at all, strange. I had spark at least yesterday. I retested the coil and was good, even tried
installing the used but good coil from an 83 with wires caps and plugs and still no spark. Totally stumped !
Any idea were to go from here. Jim ,just because, I tested the new rotor in case I damaged it but still good at 5.2 OHMS.
Could the pamco ignition and advance be the culprit. Maybe im looking to deep now. Gettin dizzy, the more I work on the bike the worse
it seems to get.
After closer inspection of all the wiring I found the new bullet connectors I installed for the new Reg were not good , found the Black (GROUND) had come completely apart and
the Green was very loose, Brown (Power) still tight. I guess after cutting of the old corroded plug and installing bullet connectors
I was trying to tuck them in tight out of way and they came apart.Lesson learned ,use twist ties or tape to hold in pace.
But now I have no spark at all, strange. I had spark at least yesterday. I retested the coil and was good, even tried
installing the used but good coil from an 83 with wires caps and plugs and still no spark. Totally stumped !
Any idea were to go from here. Jim ,just because, I tested the new rotor in case I damaged it but still good at 5.2 OHMS.
Could the pamco ignition and advance be the culprit. Maybe im looking to deep now. Gettin dizzy, the more I work on the bike the worse
it seems to get.
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Use your probes on both sides of the connectors to make sure you have continuity, preferably on the wire somewhere, not the spade. They can get corrosion between the wire and the spade, and I've also had a spade push up in the connector so there's no good contact with its mate. I push all the spades down with a 1/8" screwdriver after plugging it together just in case.
For checking continuity, it's best to have a tool that latches the continuity or discontinuity long enough that you can detect a really brief one while you jiggle the wires around.
P.S. It's darkest before the dawn
For checking continuity, it's best to have a tool that latches the continuity or discontinuity long enough that you can detect a really brief one while you jiggle the wires around.
P.S. It's darkest before the dawn
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There's 2 wires at the coil. One is power from the kill switch. The other goes to the Pamco card. Disconnect the one going to the Pamco and repetitively touch to ground and remove from ground (the wire coming out of the coil... NOT the one going to the pamco). Every time you pull the wire away from ground, both plugs should fire (make sure they're grounded). Tell us if you get spark and we'll go from there.
1. If the plugs spark, it means you have power to the coil and the coil is working.
2. If no spark, either the coil is bad or you're losing power to it.
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XS650D
XS650 Junkie
Thx Jim will test tomorrow, strike that,
Decided to have a quick look at wiring before calling it a nite.
It appears I have more than a few grounds at the Coil.
I have 3 ground junction at the Coil end lug (all 3 connect to Frame via a black wire to top engine mount)
#1 Black coming in from harness goes to coil end lug
#2 Black wire from Pamco Ignition to coil end lug
# Black wire from top engine mount to coil end lug
Based on the way the grounds are wired, which ground do I remove and use
to test for spark while I have the green wire now grounded?
I take it this test is with key on, plugs out and grounded
Disregard,i think I read it wrong, (forget the grounds), just pull the green and touch to ground
,key on, plugs grounded.Im not cranking the motor for this test, correct?
Decided to have a quick look at wiring before calling it a nite.
It appears I have more than a few grounds at the Coil.
I have 3 ground junction at the Coil end lug (all 3 connect to Frame via a black wire to top engine mount)
#1 Black coming in from harness goes to coil end lug
#2 Black wire from Pamco Ignition to coil end lug
# Black wire from top engine mount to coil end lug
Based on the way the grounds are wired, which ground do I remove and use
to test for spark while I have the green wire now grounded?
I take it this test is with key on, plugs out and grounded
Disregard,i think I read it wrong, (forget the grounds), just pull the green and touch to ground
,key on, plugs grounded.Im not cranking the motor for this test, correct?
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XS650D
XS650 Junkie
Just tested it with the green wire to good ground , NO SPARK either side.
I tested both Coil Terminals for voltage with key on and I have 12 volts each side.
Not sure if this is a proper test, I touched one led to one terminal on coil and other to ground and
got approx 12 volts, did same for other terminal and same reading. Strange thing is when I tested
ohms on coil I got 2.5 OHMS. All other tests as per Pamco Petes list looked good BUT
im not sure how to test from sparkplug to sparkplug. I dont get how I have strong spark one day and none the next.
Only change was changing plug wire on one side and reconnecting green and black bullet connectors at Reg that had come loose.
Plugs and or caps went bad? Im reaching now!
I tested both Coil Terminals for voltage with key on and I have 12 volts each side.
Not sure if this is a proper test, I touched one led to one terminal on coil and other to ground and
got approx 12 volts, did same for other terminal and same reading. Strange thing is when I tested
ohms on coil I got 2.5 OHMS. All other tests as per Pamco Petes list looked good BUT
im not sure how to test from sparkplug to sparkplug. I dont get how I have strong spark one day and none the next.
Only change was changing plug wire on one side and reconnecting green and black bullet connectors at Reg that had come loose.
Plugs and or caps went bad? Im reaching now!
Correct.
If you have 12V at the coil but no spark when you ground/unground it, the coils bad.
Did you try the same test with the factory 83 coil?
Just to clarify... you will not get a spark when you ground the coil... that just charges it. The spark will happen when you remove the ground... unground it. That how you did it?
XS650D
XS650 Junkie
I did ohm the 83 coil out, but I did not test it this way with the green, I am not positive it is good .
I can do tomorrow same way. If coil is bad is it possible I also damaged the Pamco and Advance?
I can do tomorrow same way. If coil is bad is it possible I also damaged the Pamco and Advance?
XS650D
XS650 Junkie
I tapped and or held the green on and then off a good ground (tried both coils) no sparklers!
Guess thats why got the other for free Lol!
Guess thats why got the other for free Lol!
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If you have a dwell meter hook it up to the coil. It will tell you if your PAMCO is firing the coil. See post 353 at my thread. Also a few other tests.
http://www.xs650.com/threads/its-past-time-to-start-xs2-resurrection.53396/page-18
http://www.xs650.com/threads/its-past-time-to-start-xs2-resurrection.53396/page-18
XS650D
XS650 Junkie
GLI, no dwell meter unfortunately. I have ordered a new Coil and Electronic Ignition.
I just noticed on xs650 Direct here in Canada that the Original Pamco product is no longer
available. I read up on what happened, not impressed with Mikes xs for what they did.
But thats another topic for another time.
I just noticed on xs650 Direct here in Canada that the Original Pamco product is no longer
available. I read up on what happened, not impressed with Mikes xs for what they did.
But thats another topic for another time.
You could use a test light on the PAMCO side of the coil and see if it goes on and off. Or if you have a analog volt meter watch the needle movement.
XS650D
XS650 Junkie
Well,i just installed a new pamco (xscharge) ignition, new coil, plugs and still no spark!
Question: Should there be continuity between the spark plug caps? from one side to the other basically.
Its almost like my kill switch is off. Is there a way to test that.
I also did the same test, with green from pamco to a ground, no spark. I dont think I could have
3 bad coils in a row.
I tested for 12 volts at the pamco ignition directly on the circuit board Red and Green,no power
with key on. Yet there is 12 volts at each terminal on the coil.Is that normal. The Electronic Advance is wired in line, could that be bad or does power not run thru until bike ignites or is running.
Update: Kill switch working, shuts off power to coil.
Tested continuity on 3 wires from coil to card, Red and black are ok, No continuity on
Green wire, no change with key on.
Question: Should there be continuity between the spark plug caps? from one side to the other basically.
Its almost like my kill switch is off. Is there a way to test that.
I also did the same test, with green from pamco to a ground, no spark. I dont think I could have
3 bad coils in a row.
I tested for 12 volts at the pamco ignition directly on the circuit board Red and Green,no power
with key on. Yet there is 12 volts at each terminal on the coil.Is that normal. The Electronic Advance is wired in line, could that be bad or does power not run thru until bike ignites or is running.
Update: Kill switch working, shuts off power to coil.
Tested continuity on 3 wires from coil to card, Red and black are ok, No continuity on
Green wire, no change with key on.
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I would go back to basics and start fresh again......Forget what has been done and start as if your starting afresh.......Have mentioned what needs to be done..........You have a wiring or switch problem so the loom has to be gone through from end to trace your problem.........If your bullet connectors have come off then your either using the wrong ones, (cheep coloured type), or not using the crimp-er properly.............
I think your problem is the same one that has been the cause of 3 Rotor problems.........
And yes the stop switch can be tested...........Continuity test the wire leading into the switch and the wire going out of the switch.......... test the wire leading into the switch, (from the further-est away point where it connects into a connector), further-est away point on the out bound wire (where it joins into a connector), and continuity test with the switch in the middle............
That would be per for the course if the whole loom was continuity tested properly.........
I think your problem is the same one that has been the cause of 3 Rotor problems.........
And yes the stop switch can be tested...........Continuity test the wire leading into the switch and the wire going out of the switch.......... test the wire leading into the switch, (from the further-est away point where it connects into a connector), further-est away point on the out bound wire (where it joins into a connector), and continuity test with the switch in the middle............
That would be per for the course if the whole loom was continuity tested properly.........
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Something else...........some of the coils mikes sells have been known to have suspect terminals......check them out and see if they are loose
Definitely sounds like you have a wiring/"power not getting to where it needs to go" problem. Before spending more money on parts, I would do as 650Skull suggests...check all your wires going to/from battery, to switches, to coil, to ignition, etc.
Good luck!
Good luck!
XS650D
XS650 Junkie
Bad parts from Mikes/xs650 direct ,see post tday!
Bad batch off Trigger plates and Rotors from the Electronic Ignition Kits.
Bad batch off Trigger plates and Rotors from the Electronic Ignition Kits.
