Matt's First mechanical endeavor. I'm hoping for the best!!!

[scabber]

From what your saying it could be a broken valve. Did you ride it home ? Take some pictures of the valve. Do not run the bike. Pull the spark plug and look for carnage. Report back.

 

[Paddy399]

You can't give up now! Did you get a bike to ride or a bike to build? Anyone can walk into a shop and ride out on a new bike but they will never have the feeling of riding what they built. Keep on digging at it!

 

[KentMoney]

sounds like times have been tough Matt, sorry to hear.

I remember when I got my 81 I rode it stock for a while but it was really unreliable. I got stranded several times, late for work, etc. I got so damn fed up with the thing after chasing constant problems with it i finally said SCREW IT, and tore the thing apart.

You're gonna be turning it into a complete custom, right? It's probably gonna have to happen eventually

 

[fishhat]

I pulled the spark plugs out a while ago, but couldn't see any obvious signs of severe damage. I should be getting an engine stand tomorrow, so hopefully I can get the engine off the frame and tear into it this weekend. I'll check back in soon with pictures, and hypotheses.

Thanks for the support folks! It is easy to get discouraged when working on this thing, but I'm definitely pushing it to the end. Junk heap or highway, here I come.

 

[fishhat]

I was able to convince a friend of mine to allow me to use her driveway as a workspace to tear the bike apart. Here are the new digs

It isn't any more space than I was working with before, but it has the advantage of allowing me a workbench and more importantly, I can actually leave shit around without retribution

I got to work right away, and pulled the engine

A day or two later, I got the top end opened up.

It neither the rocker arms or the camshaft appear to have any significant damage. So, I must go deeper.

This is when I read that I needed a chain breaker for my cam-chain. Anyone know someone in the LA area with one to loan? I think it's back to Mikes and another week in transit

I went around it a few times with stretch wrap to keep the bugs & moisture out.

Now I wait once again

 

[ippytattoo]

You can get the cam out without breaking the chain. There have been posts about it around here somewhere that give the specifics but the gist is you loosen the cam chain adjuster as far as you can (read remove from the back side of the jugs) and the cam chain should be able to slip off the cam gear. I don't recall which side it is that it will come off of but once you get it off the gear you want to make sure that you attach either a piece of string or wire or such so that the chain doesn't fall down into the crankcase. once you get the chain off you can pull the head and have a look around at the valves and tops of the pistons and the cylinder walls if that is what you are after. Reassmbly is the reverse of disassembly.

 

[scabber]

If you had sent the picture of the exhaust valve adjuster you might not have jumped to the wrong conclusion. Since the picture shows the exhaust valve retainers and keepers not broken. My guess is you might have been adjusting when the valve was still on its opening ramp. Since you have the motor allmost apart check the front camchain guide. Pulling the exhaust pipe and looking at the valve would tell if was bent or broken. It is like having a head ache next step brain surgery.

 

[KentMoney]

nice leopard stool.

as scabber said, you can avoid a cam chain breaker by just derailing it from the camshaft cog. with it off the cog you can just work around it with no problem.

 

[peanut]

wow what an inspirational thread !

I sure hope I don't have all the problems you've had . Reminds me of a cartoon I saw once.
Owner is looking up at his car, which is on the ramp at the local garage for the umpteenth time and a friend walks up

.....wow that car sure is a beaut Bert ...how many miles have you got on that baby ?

Bert replies ' vertically ? or horizontally ?

 

[fishhat]

Alright.....

I pulled the cam chain tensioner bolt off, slipped the camshaft bearings off, and pulled the cam on out.

There appears to be some slight pitting on the side of the risers, any idea of that will cause problems???

On a side note, the bearings on the left side did not want to come off, I ended up having to hammer on them a bit.

I secured the chain, and pulled the rest of the head off (not sure about the correct terminology )

The pistons look nice and grimy, so I don't think I have any oil leaks to worry about.

I can't see anything obvious with the left side exhaust valve

I'm planning on borrowing a valve spring compressor from autozone. Anyone know which would be the best?? http://www.autozone.com/autozone/ac.../Valve-Spring-Compressor-and-Measure/_/N-4aow .

Scabber - I am absolutely certain that I was adjusting the exhaust valve on while at TDC of the exhaust stroke. I at least triple checked running through the cycles & very carefully stopping at TDC each time. How would I have been able to tell if the valve was bent/broken form the pipe hole?

 

[KentMoney]

wow, whered id you get that engine? Looks like the PO took good care of it. Those valves and pistons look very clean. and there is a PMA installed already

 

[fishhat]

It's been in my family since new. Grandfather bought it originally, than a cousin took it & dicked around a bit. I doubt it has any more than 10,000 miles on it. It was completely stock when it came to me. I've put the PMA & Pamco on it myself.

 

[fishhat]

Prick BASTARDS!!!!! I can't find any place to lend me a valve spring compressor. Ugh...

 

[fishhat]

I'm not sure if it means anything or not, but I was just looking around the head since I couldn't really do anything else, and I noticed something odd.

Looking through the exhaust pipe holes, I could see that the stem of the left side valve appeared to be oily and wet. The right side valve appeared to be quite dry. Could this be a sign?

I'll post pictures, later if they are good enough to actually show anything.

 

[KentMoney]

And regarding the "pitting" on the sides of the cam lobes, I think those are just casting marks. My cams looked similar from what I remember.

 

[fishhat]

I'm feeling lost at the moment. I have a mechanic who will either let me use his valve spring compressor or do it himself. However, after taking in the posts here I've been looking at the engine more closely. There is no apparent damage to the cam lobes or the rocker arms. I can't see any damage to the bottom side of the valves. There isn't any damage to the top of the piston, and after cranking the rotor a few times I know that the sleeves are pristine. The bike was definitely vibrating excessively in the top end & no matter what I did, I could not loosen the rocket arm enough on the left side exhaust valve to have even the smallest gap. I am certain that there is a problem, I just have no clue where to look for it. Any ideas? Should I pull the valve just to check; could there even be a problem so small (maybe a slight bend) that woulda cause it to stick like that? I just don't know.

 

[KentMoney]

honestly, knowing now that this has been in the family and the low miles, i feel like you didn't even need to dig into your engine at all. Just do chassis mods.


But its already apart now. Do you plan to go into the crank case? if you do, then you might as well add the overdrive 5th gear and that will help vibes in the last gear. and you might as well lap up the valves if you get the spring comressor

 

[peanut]

. It would be worth reseating all the valves before reassembly anyway I should have thought. Don't forget to keep the valves in the correct order and measure the spring lengths too

 

[scabber]

Alright.....

I pulled the cam chain tensioner bolt off, slipped the camshaft bearings off, and pulled the cam on out.

There appears to be some slight pitting on the side of the risers, any idea of that will cause problems???

On a side note, the bearings on the left side did not want to come off, I ended up having to hammer on them a bit.

I secured the chain, and pulled the rest of the head off (not sure about the correct terminology )

The pistons look nice and grimy, so I don't think I have any oil leaks to worry about.

I can't see anything obvious with the left side exhaust valve

I'm planning on borrowing a valve spring compressor from autozone. Anyone know which would be the best?? http://www.autozone.com/autozone/ac.../Valve-Spring-Compressor-and-Measure/_/N-4aow .

Scabber - I am absolutely certain that I was adjusting the exhaust valve on while at TDC of the exhaust stroke. I at least triple checked running through the cycles & very carefully stopping at TDC each time. How would I have been able to tell if the valve was bent/broken form the pipe hole?

To answer your problem you do not adjust valves on the exhaust stroke. You adjust valves TDC compression stoke . Rookie mistake we all make them. To answer your second question. Since you have the head off now. look into the exhaust port you can see the valve not all of it but enough to tell if its bent with Compressed air leak down test or a light source It is easy to jump to the wrong conclusion not having all the facts. Since I asked for the picture fact 1 not enough information for me to know what the problem was on my part. The conclusion your part he needs more data to give me an honest answer so disregard the Broken valve send picture he is guessing. Com lag call it what to do. No other replys Fuck it pull it apart. Fact 2 nothing seems broken at this point Scabber reports back no pictures now its all torn apart. Conclusion I fucked up by not sending the picture back now he is telling me I was adjusting the valves wrong again Fact 3 Troubleshoting Is guess work and data with enough of both a correct opinion can be achieved 99% of the time. Well matt since your in there check that front guide. Might as well lap those valves while your in there and new valve seals Sometimes a valve tapping is valve is just at tapping valve. If the cam bearings are ok. I will not venture a guess on the excessive vibration in the head. The miles should be on the speedometer if is not broken and grandad did not change it. I have a head ache now from the headbanging send 5twins a PM He might help you now. He is never wrong. Good luck scabber

 

[fishhat]

Scabber, I can't thank you enough for all of your recommendations. I'm not upset that I've torn the engine apart. I am in the middle of a divorce, and this has given me something to focus my attention on. I am a tinkerer, and I like to have a project.

I am not too proud to say that It appears that I did fuck up on the adjustment. For whatever, I though that it needed to be TDC on the stroke that involved that particular valve. As you said, rookie mistake. I don't think I will be able to lap the valves, or redo the seats ($$ is weird with the divorce). But I already had the gasket/seal kit from Mikes, so I'll redo all of those.

Just to be safe, I'll try the light test when it gets dark tonight since the workspace is outside.

Everyone here has always been so helpful to me. Please don't think that I was intentionally trying to ignore recommendations. I just got a bug up my ass, and decided to tear into the engine. I am almost at the point where I want to take the carbs apart, but I'm waiting on that until I hear from the lawyer