need help and PATIENCE

[jetero41]

I am new to xs's and read the forums deliberately but always seem to come up short on my specific answers, so I beg patience. I am prefectly willing to reveiw a prior thread if I have missed it and I am pointed in the right direction, so here goes.

CDI to points conversion- I have been acquiring the necessary and obvious parts but....
-is the cam the same?
-is there alist (or good source of info) for misc parts, seals, bearings etc. that also change
don't want to tear down only to find I'm coming up short on reassembly

Rear spoke to Mag- same info needed
-where can I find the most detailed info on parts needed

'83 Heritage Special- 447 ????

Thanks in advance, props for ALL that is here and apologies if I've missed the answers already

"I'll be baack"

 

[gggGary]

Sorry no specific answers to your questions, but welcome to the mad house!
Conversion to a disk is not trivial, drum mags are kinda hard to find.
Why the points conversion?

 

[jetero41]

Rear Disk, Mag wheel -not keeping drums

Points just get rough, CDI box pukes, you're walking or pushing
AND necessary to convert to permanent magnet alternater

 

[XSLeo]

The TCI will run with a p/m alternator. You just have to besure your regulator is working right. No overcharge, That will burn up the TCI. LOts of them out there.
At www.yamahaxs650.com You can find alot of the info you are looking for. Just install the points breaker plates instead of the Pamco.

 

[jetero41]

xsleo, HUH!!!!!
I've posted here before asking that very question- Will a P/M conversion work with TDI ?? Definitive answer was NO. Help ??? Point me to the right source PLEASE.

Sure would be a lot simpler than TDI to points.

 

[gggGary]

Rear Disk, Mag wheel -not keeping drums

wheel, disk, caliper, swing arm, torque rod, master cylinder, hoses, brake switch, linkage to correct pedal.
You will need to fabricate and weld hard points on the frame.
Not a trivial project

 

[jetero41]

not new to wrenching fab'ing, BLEEDING just new to the XS, you know the bloody DETAILS

Got- wheel, disk, caliper and bracket, swing arm, master cyl, hard points and torque rod to be fabricated. Planning Cafe Racer Project so will also fab rearsets and the pedal rod. Much more concerned with axle and spacers.

Thanks to all so far
just hope y'all aren't done with me yet.

 

[gggGary]

Axle is the same, since you now have both, spacers should be an easy check. The sprocket side spacer fits inside the hub and includes the dust shield it is the same on both (all?) types of rear wheels. The brake side spacer is also integral with the hub dust shield, it fits between the hub and the caliper bracket, there is no spacer between the caliper bracket and the axle adjuster.

 

[XSLeo]

I guess I wasn't thinking straight. The stock TCI ignition won't work with a P/M alternator. No p[lace for the pick up and rotor magnet.
The after market ignitions like the Pamco or Boyer will work.
My apologies for any confusion. One to many adult beverages I guess.

 

[XSLeo]

I did the drum to disc conversion on my 75. If you have all the right spacers for the wheel it is an easy swap. I didn't have the right spacers, I ended up grinding down one to thick to fit. Not hard to do. haveing the right one would be better.
You will need the brake pivot shaft from a disc brake 650. The drum pulls a rod horizontally. The disc push a rod verticlly. A slight change on the brake stop adjuster on the frame will need to be done. Once you have both pivot shafts in your hand you can see the differences.
Getting the M/C mount in the right place was the hard part. I looked at as many pics of bikes that showed the M/C mount as I could find. Used the pics and some trial and error till it all worked.
Bleeding the system was a bit tough. The resevour to M/C hose had a high spot in it and getting the fluid past that took a bit of thinking.
I took the M/C and resevour off and held it up so the hose was a straight shot from resevour to the M/C. Pumped the M/C with a screw driver untill I got fluid pumping through the lines. Reinstalled the M/C and resevour, and finished bleeding as normal.
Works very well now.
I also put a dual disc set up on the front.

 

[jetero41]

XSLeo- 1 too many I understand.
Too much help to get bent about what is easily remedied, Thank you.

Any ideas where to go (and the part callouts) for the correct spacers.

Cam, bearings and seals question remains for box to points conversion
same cam ????

Thanks All

 

[jetero41]

OK I read my title again laughed, I'm the 1 with no patience.

PLEASE - Is the cam the SAME ? points versus TDI

Thank you

 

[XSLeo]

The cams were all the same from 74 on, the valve timing was different on the earlier models.

 

[jayel]

TCI doesn't use a timing cam, times off the crank so any points cam after 74 if what you want is the camshaft all the same after 74

 

[XSLeo]

Mike's sells all the parts you need to convert to points. For just afew bucks more you can get a kit with all you need to install the Pamco ignition.
The cam in your engine will work just fine, the bushings and seals just slide into your cam. Then you install the advance rod, ATU. At this point you can either put in the points breaker plate and cam or the Pamco.
If you look on Mike's site and compare prices you might be surprised which way is the most cost effective.

 

[jetero41]

Thanks to all of you
XSLeo, always there man, Thanks.

Ihave the breaker cups , advance rod and cam, points mount, advance unit, point wires.
Was curious about the cam as I know the advance rod runs thru it. I guess I can add , I have the cam. Just need bushings and any seals. Mike sells them huh? Spent a lot of time looking on his site never noticed them. Time to get the manuals out and check the points cam out. Then off to Mikes, AGAIN.

BY the way, just received an oil strianer from Mike's and it looks GOOD.
Read in several threads about the quality being less than we would want.
BUT THIS STRAINER LOOKS FINE. Thanks Mike.

 

[XSLeo]

The bushings and seals are in engine under camshafts. Scroll down, just past bearings.

 

[jetero41]

Okay, a few minutes with Mike's and the Haynes. Still

Haynes shows 1 bearing inside the camshaft plus 1 oil seal each end. Makes sense Huh.

Mikes list 3 parts - internal metal "bushing" p/n 05-0032 "mounts inside in center"
- internal metal labrinth "seal" #050033 "mounts flush w/ end"
- internal cam needle bearing" #050034 "mounts flush w/ end"
replacement for 05-0033
-By the logic and Haynes descriptions the needle "bearing" should mount inside not "flush".
-the labrinth "seal" mounts flush with end COOL. But the needle "bearing is listed as a "replacement" for the "seal"

ASSUMPTIONS (i HATE that action)
-advance rod actually rides on the "bushing (actually the Haynes "bearing")
-labrinth "seal" is not actually a"seal" but oil lube source and that the needle bearings are indeed a suitable, or better replacement

Conclusion I need 2 of Mike's bushings and 2 needle bearings

Am I close?
Thanks

 

[XSLeo]

The parts list at Yamaha show the needle bearings used in the early models. The listing has both the needle bearing and the bushing listed.
I guess after they changed to the bushing they went back and listed both for the early years. That way whichever the dealer had would be right. They went with just the bushing in 74, cheaper part and works as well.
It shows that the needle bearing goes in the same as the bushing, then the seal.
It may allow the rod to spin a bit easier than the bushing.
I guess you can go either way.
As far as how things mount I think I would go with the way Yamaha does it.