Shallow Thoughts

[kent_in_kc]

I'm still kinda new here. Bev and I have a little custom bike fabrication gig, custom pipes, gadgets, maybe a bobber or two. I'm pondering this bobber thing and turn to you, my new compadres, for soulful advice. Or at least some advice you pulled out of yer butt real quick.

Is there any money in building bobbers? I'm thinking all fresh, go through the engine, new wiring, everything, essentially a new bike, just customized.

Is there a source for rebuilt engines? How about custom soft tail frames? Mike's has a pretty good inventory but are there others? I found a NOS electrical parts house but the only lasts till the parts run out.

I've built bikes since I was a kid, my first was a BSA A-10 bobber in 1970 that was really clean. Some cafes and cruisers since. My shop is pretty well equipped and I weld, paint, powder and most other things, so I'm not exactly a novice. I just don't have the XS experience that a lot of you guys have.

Am I just another newbie thinking he's Jesse James or is it a real opportunity? Don't worry, I'm old enough I don't work too hard, maybe could do a bike a month, max, so I won't be putting any of you out of business!

 

[rustynail99]

well man, here is my 1 cents on the situation, but this is just my opinion, im sure others would have a much more educated answer to your questions. to me it seems like this motorcycle craze that started with jesse james and his show on discovery channel is just about over and many many motorcycle shops are closing there doors and finding other ways of making a living. most of the people that are still in it are the ones that were into motorcycles way before the craze started and will continue long after everyone has forgotten how kool it was to ride a long chromed out $60,000, flashy painted monstrosity of a bike. most of the people on this forum fall in this category. if you ride an XS its probably not because you just want to be kool (except maybe teebs )

as far as building bobbers go, it seems like there are already alot of people building them (myself included) and a good bit of companies like g&l and ardcore that offer XS bobbers. i would say instead of just building bobbers build whatever your customers want and dont limit yourself to just bobbers if you dont have to.

as far as XS parts companies there are a few out there. i have heard many negative things about mikesXS and his customer service seems to fall short, especially since his phone number is no where to be found on the website and he takes a long time to respond to e-mails (in my experience, but i have heard this from others on this site) i much prefer 650central with Michael "MMM" at the helm. he is a great dude with excellent customer service and you can call him and he will help you find what you need.

as far as engines go, i have heard many good things about heiden tuning but i have never actually contacted them. from what i have heard though, you can call them up and they will tune your engine to your needs.

also if you were going to do a bike a month you will need to get a business license if you dont already have one, and you will need to get one so you can sell completed titled motorcycles (i know in florida this is different from a regular parts sales license) if you are not a registered dealer, i believe you are only legally allowed to sell 3 bikes in a year.

wow, so now that i have responded with a full novel (sorry about that got kinda carried away) hope this helps a little and hopefully more qualified people can comment as well. overall i say if its what you want to do, go for it but i wouldnt get into it for the money or you may burn yourself out and still not make a fortune. biggest thing to remember is GOOD CUSTOMER SERVICE AND FAIR PRICING dont be a push over and dont give your stuff away just be fair, that is how you make it in a shit economy with a dwindling bike scene

GOOD LUCK!

 

[cooltouch]

About the only thing I'd add to Rustynail's advice is that it seems to be pretty much a catch-as-catch-can situation when it comes to picking up XS650s as donor machines. I don't know of any source offhand for the engines, and even if you're doing a bobber, seems to me you'd want to pick up the entire (titled!) bikes so you don't have to deal with separate frames. I don't know of anyone selling complete frames for the XS anyway, although there are outfits, like TC, who sell the hardtails for them.

Then there's also the price you're likely to get for a completed bike. You'll have to figure out the hours you'll be spending as well as the cost of materials to come up with a figure that will make it worthwhile for you to do the project. And if this number is too high, you'll have a tough time selling the bike. Pretty much the most I've seen a very clean, chopped or bobbed XS650 sell for is $3500 or so. For example:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/XS65...motorcycles&hash=item19bd9bbcc8#ht_776wt_1166

If you can work within these monetary constraints, then I'd say 'go for it.'

 

[bloodthirstysystem]

i don't think building bobbers should be looked at as a money making opportunity myself.. if you love building bikes build choppers, make fancy custom parts and show off your skills, spend a few months at least on a bike.

plus, if you want to make money build harleys or triumphs which sell for a lot more than an xs (if you do a good job)

 

[cooltouch]

plus, if you want to make money build harleys or triumphs which sell for a lot more than an xs (if you do a good job)

Yeah, I was thinking of this too. You can buy an S&S motor and an aftermarket frame, and customize it to your heart's content, then sell it for a lot more than you could ever get for an XS. But then you'll have a lot more invested in the project as well. A very real concern, though, is the shaky economy we're experiencing right now. Folks just aren't spending money on big-ticket disposable-income items they way they were even a few years ago.

 

[Teebs]

It's not a business I've known too many guys to get rich in. The economy right now is what is really killing things. Not many people buying bling bikes when they are on the verge of foreclosure.
You have a way better chance of making some money out of it by doing some work on old Trumps and BSAs or Harleys. The XS650 trend is going hot because it's a cheap and easy platform for the beginner. But the best of the XS builds are not getting much more than 4K. I recently saw one XS chop hit 6k on ebay, but it was a stretched wide tire chop with way more than 6k into it.
Funny thing is, the easiest way to make money on them is to buy a prefabbed hardtail and a cheap sporty peanut tank, and a set of drag bars. NOT do a lot of engine work. Powdercoat and paint it black, DON'T go fresh, go used, go old. Make sure it runs good and handles properly so your conscience is clear. You'll get as much out of it as if you put all that hard work into it.

 

[kent_in_kc]

NOT do a lot of engine work. Powdercoat and paint it black, DON'T go fresh, go used, go old. Make sure it runs good and handles properly so your conscience is clear.

That's exactly what I just did on the Rocket Dog. (Gotta post the pics). I figured I would need $5k to make it worthwhile. Bev sez 'ain't gonna, just do it as a hobby'. Maybe she's right. She's a good wife, does a lot of my co-thinking, usually right.

Screw it anyway, I love doing it, if someone wants to throw down some bones, I'll sell them one.

I make custom true dual exhaust for V-Star 1100's, the only guy on the planet that does, and I have a hard time getting $800 for them. I know that's pricey but it's all hand made, one at a time, quality work and that's what I need to make it worthwhile. And, yeah, I have way more invested in equipment and materials than I should have, so I'm not making money just paying myself back.

I'll say this too, because this post just isn't long enough, the xs niche is cool. Lots of guys are doing some excellent, innovative art all around the world because this bike gives them that chance. Ain't no Jesse James' here. No $60k chops.

Its like the VW bug was to dune buggies and street rods back in the 60's. I had 23 of them over the years.

 

[Teebs]

Well, if you have the time and the inclination, you might consider chopping a few asian bikes of whatever make. The xs is getting expensive, but there are plenty of good, cheap platforms out there. New parts may not be as readily available, but any dude with a little initiative and imagination can usually make something else work. And since most of those guys are on the net, it's not that hard to find solutions already available. Food for thought.

If you enjoy doing a thing, and can put even a few extra dollars in your pocket, AND you have your ole lady's suppport, you've got it made in my book.

 

[Inked Monkey]

Hey Kent, I've got a connection for all the parts you could want. he's out in Kearney. let me know if you want his info.

 

[sherwin]

I'm the least knowledgeable in this area but here is some food for thought. Start making reproduction XS650 motors. Not sure what you would all need to do to make a reproduction motor but a reasonably priced new XS650 motor and frame would make a great starting point for a lot of budget concious people who want a do-it-yourself custom bike. I guess you would have to reverse engineer an engine. Offer two versions, a "stock" and a "performance" version. Eventually the supply of originals is going to run out.

Don't S&S and some of the other V-Twin engine makers basically do the same thing with Harley Davidson engines?

Also, if you do this and it works out for you, please consider gifting me a free engine for coming up with the idea.

Sherwin

 

[Teebs]

LOL Very nice, sherwin!

I'm thinking reproduction of the xs650 twin is never going to be very cost effective. And in case you're wanting to pick up that '61 knuck or '58 pan to stuff into a frame; a reproduction knucklehead will only run ya $8-10k. That '58 pan is only about 5 or 6k. Then you need the carbs and whatnot...

Just jokin' around, brother. Thanks for the chuckle.

 

[Ottis]

Kent, Im with the others here in saying "your not going to get rich". But I do believe that you could make some money doing it. A bike and the build up that it goes through must be a passion; something you do because you love to do it. The most common time that I see a shop or a builder go down hill is when it becomes a job. If you can build a bike with the mind set of creating YOUR next masterpiece to show off to all that lay eyes on it and the monetary value of the bike second then I believe that you will do fine. For starters I would sit down and figure out what you HAVE to make a year or month to live a lifestyle that you are happy with and go from there. If you need 10 grand a month to maintain that then we all know its just a pipe dream.

I do feel that if a guy could get 3 or 4 of these bikes built with the supply to build 3 or 4 more a guy could make some decent dough. Just think; if you were to take a few of these to the local "Hot Spot" and let the younger crowd drool all over them. Once you told them that they can buy one of these "Bitchin" Bobbers for say 4000.00 or half the price of that POS rocket they just bought I believe you could get a huge following going. I think it would be all in the marketing and having stock. These days no one wants to buy something that they have to wait for. We want whats here now!! If you had 3 or 4 of them in different styles sitting in front of your shop and a younger guy could walk up and sit on one and feel the American Bad-Ass feeling start running through him as he grabbed the bars and threw his feet up on the forward controls; you would have that thing sold even if he had to go and pawn off half of his life to do it. Especially after you told him that he could have this thing for less than 5 grand (or half of what his dip-shit buddy just payed for that piece of tupperware that he is riding down the road; PLUS its CHEAP to insure!!). And we all know chicks dig bobbers, I see the sport bike craze phazing out of them too. The girls seem to have jumped track to the custom side also?

There is opportunity here if you have the motivation and desire take hold of it. Its all about whats in you HEART; not your HANDS!

 

[gggGary]

If you want to build bobbers the trick is to con a customer into funding it and each week add a new bauble (and more money) to the project. Sad but true, you cannot afford to put bikes back to new condition. I dabble in stockers and I can't make even $10 and hour doing the full monty on a chassis overhaul and that is without even touching the engine internals. Adding to the misery is that the eBay market for used parts is much worse than it was two years ago so that source of revenue is greatly reduced. Maybe if you build in KC and ship to sillyfornia. But it would be simpler to ship the basic unworked bikes there. I won't even go into the expenses of being legal and insured to do this.

 

[inxs]

- kz750 ?

 

[bloodthirstysystem]

just buy old, non running bikes that probably just need a carb cleaning and a battery for $200. fix it, polish, paint and re sell for $800. you could do this twice a month.

then someone could buy it off you and make their own custom bike.

 

[gentlemanjim]

I believe there is merit to your plan. If you have the skills, facilty and capital I would seek out Yamaha Virago's as a platform to build on. Ther were produced since 1981 until 2008. Produced in 125, 250,400, 500, 535, 700, 750, 920, 1000 and 1100 displacements. They are kind of the evolution of the XS aircooled twin. Builtiproof and easy to maintain. There is a huge market out there of likely candidates. They make great cruisers, bobbers, standards and I even saw a cafe version custom of course.

Additionally I would expand my custom offering by by building your flag ship, alternative styles than bobber and a few 90% ers in prime allowing customers to dictate the final design and color. You could also offer easy bolt on kits that owners could use to modify their scoots.

Kind of augmenting what our friend Richard Pollock does: http://http://mulemotorcycles.net/

Broward motorsports http://http://www.browardmotorsports.com/new_vehicle_category.asp is building bobbers from new Star XV250's selling in the 8k range.

If you were in my neighborhood I'd partner with you in a heart beat. The possibilities are endless. In a down economy many bikers (I believe) would be more likely to update and modify their bikes than buying new or pre-owned.

A little more than $.02 worth.

 

[kent_in_kc]

Yes, I would like that Kearney parts info. Thanks, man.

 

[gentlemanjim]

Here's your gene pool: http://http://www.craiglook.com/motorcycles.html?q=yamaha+virago

 

[kent_in_kc]

Thanks, all, for your insightful comments. I also kinda like the idea of building mini-bobbers from like old Honda 125s, 350s, 450s and such. They would be cheap, great mileage (!) easy for women and kids to handle and still some cool factor. If you could knock them out for $2500 each, it might go well. Remember when we thought the Honda 350 was a hot bike?

 

[kent_in_kc]

Thanks, Jim. My V-Star 1100 is a direct descendant of that old Virago engine. Those are great mills, carbureted, no computer, easy to work on, lots of power and stone axe reliable.