Starter issue

[xstom]

So I've been working on my 1980 special and have gotten to a point where I thought I was ready to start enjoying a few rides. Today I put new plugs in. Started it up and let her warm up. Had to break away a bit for dinner and afterwards came back out and started her up again, a few moments into the engine running I could hear the starter motor still running. Tried the kill switch to no avail and then turned the key off and the starter was still cranking. I had to disconnect the lead from the battery. I am assuming there is a short somewhere as the kill switch and key switch were ineffective. Any suggestions for a starting point for troubleshooting?

Thanks.

Tom

 

[Gordon]

Tom,
Sound's like a stuck relay. That was a common issue with Ford's way back.
A weak battery can also cause the relay to stay 'on'. Try to manually operate the relay with a jumper wire to groung. If the relay work's properly with the jumper,( make sure you disconnect the wire from the start button on the handle bars, you can disconnect it at the relay, it's the thin wire), you could have a short in the wire from the relay to the button. if the relay stay's engaged with the jumper, it is bad. There are heavy contact's inside that get really pitted up with time, and will 'weld' themselves together, causing the starter to run .
What Ford did to fix that problem was to use a better grade of copper inside to reduce the welding. Good luck,,, Gordo

 

[xstom]

Thanks Gordon,

Relay is new. I will try anyway.

 

[Gordon]

Tom, disconnect the small wire at the relay. Chances are you got a short to ground in the wiring to the start button. Re-connect the battery after removing that wire & see if it's still engaged. If not, check that starter circut real good. The reason for it staying engaged even with the key off & kill switch off is the button completes the ground so once it was engaged, the circut was allready complete. The only way was to disconnect the battery.

 

[xstom]

Before I go and muck something up....

I guess I need to clarify .... what I am thinking of as the starter relay is referred to as the starter switch (starter solenoid on wiring diagram) Item 2 in the picture. The safety relay is Item 7. I have a new "starter switch" from Mikes XS. It has two small leads and one large wire, red from battery and black to starter. I have not had a chance to follow out the safety relay. Is it the safety relay I should be looking at?

 

[cooltouch]

Xstom,

I sold my '81 SH yesterday, so I'm having to rely on dim recall here. But as I recall, mine had two relays on a single mount, both having to do with the starter, one of them having to do with the headlight activation.

You might try lightly tapping on the relay cover(s) with a screwdriver handle to see if it unsticks the points inside.

I ended up removing mine, and removed the covers. Then I filed down the points til they were smooth -- relatively -- reassembled, and everythng was back to normal. That was several years ago, so my simple fix has lasted at least. I see that MikesXS apparently does not sell replacements. I have a few extra from earlier bikes I got off eBay, but I don't have any from a Special. So if yours is truly bad, I'd recommend putting out a request here or start looking on eBay for one that hopefully will work.

Or just kick it, which is what I always did even after repairing the relay(s).

 

[xstom]

May just do that cooltouch. Ended up doing that on the flasher relay. It wasn't pitted much, just full of gunk. Works fine now. Hopefully I'll have time this weekend in between Grad parties for the kids and work. Will post results.

 

[Gordon]

Tom,
The part that's labeled starter switch is what control's the operation of the starter, activated when you push the button on the handle bars.
Before you take it apart, do the check's as I stated earlier. Could save you from opening it up and still have the same problem.
Portland huh? Not real far from me. P M me if you could use some more help.

 

[XSLeo]

The safety relay won't keep the starter cranking. It stops the starter from cranking with the engine running. The safety relay is hooked inline with the red/white wire. The red/white wire gets battery voltage through the safety relay. When the engine starts the yellow wire from the alternator sends power to the safety relay, which activates the relay. This stops the battery voltage to the starter relay, preventing the starter from running while the engine is running.
As Gordon said check the starter relay and the wires, the blue/white wire is the one that goes up to the starts button. If this blue/white wire shorts to ground it will keep the starter cranking. The start button just might be stuck.

 

[Sundie]

by the by, the starter relay can be replaced with any relay rated for 100 amps or better.

 

[xstom]

So I disconnected the small lead. Starter still cranks the second I reconnect the battery cable. When I have more time I will look into further, for now I disconnected the starter lead (big black one) and kick it.

 

[XSLeo]

Sure sounds like the relay is stuck.